Development of Young Athletes

[Witton Park]

So that we don't contaminate another thread, let's have one about this. Let's keep it free from cynicism if we can and make contributions that are with a purpose.

There are lots of questions and the answers are probably even more numerous, so rather than getting in to a debate on the rules and race lengths which is a relatively minor issue perhaps we should try and answer some of the questions first.

The first minute a junior athlete walks through the doors for their first session what is the end goal? Should we even have one? What would be deemed success? When can that success be judged.

Should coaches have more say in the competitive structuresif they are those with most responsibility for the outcome.

What is the FRA role in this as the governing body?

Dealing with the first point, when I first get an athlete I try to engage with them and their parents. Enthuse them about how much fun they can have and the wide range of positive experiences out there for endurance runners. They can take part in events as varied as National Young Athletes League, Road and Cross Country Relays and Junior Fell races as well as the wide variety of Championship races out there in all disciplines.
Then we have the relationships. Best friends can be made for life, not just within your own club, but with athletes from other clubs. Travelling to some of the most beautiful places in the country - and eventually perhaps the world.
If I can enthuse them and immerse them in the sport, there is then a much better chance of achieving success. Success for me is seeing that athlete and perhaps their family still involved and loving the sport in to adulthood.

As a coach, I do think we should have more say. We should be consulted - but that's as far as it goes. We will have too many differing ideas. That's the nature of coaching. But there will be some common threads and the custodians of the sport should put more faith in coaches than they do at present.

The FRA is doing more or less what it should. Itr provides a framework for the sport and in most areas it does a fantastic job. Unlike many other governing bodies I also feel that it looks to improve, listens and adapts. Perhaps because the FRA is made up of people who also have a love for the sport, there is a greater link to the grass roots than you find with UKA/EA where paid officers seem to be of the opinion that their degrees and salary count more than years of experience.

[OB1]

Bravo. 1) agree - enjoyment and long term involvement, 2) agree - provide knowledgeable consultation, and 3) agree - provide a suitable framework.

[Eleanor]

The first minute a junior athlete walks through the doors for their first session what is the end goal? Should we even have one? What would be deemed success? When can that success be judged.

Great question WP.

- Is it to bring youngsters into fell running so that they are still involved as adults?
- Or to support their potential in the sport as youngsters, as an end in itself, with no relationship to their adult life?
- To share our own joy of the sport and of racing with youngsters, so that they can enjoy the physical, emotional and social benefits, develop their resiliance, self-confidence, etc?
- To bring new blood into a fell running club - bringing talent through from a young age, from the club point of view?
- To support the wider goal of bringing talented youngsters into competition and thus raising competitive standards of endurance running in the future (finding the minority who are naturally talented at this age)?
- To encourage them to enter and enjoy endurance events even when they are not naturally talented runners (most members of the population fall into this category)?

All these possible answers have merit and I wonder if the background / talent of the coach themself has a bearing on their own point of view? I know it does on mine.

[biara]

To have fun and enjoy themselves first and foremost. About 70-80 children from 6-18 come on KCAC nights, some for competitive training, others to keep fit, some as their parents are running, others because their friends are going, no children are 'forced' to be competitive, there is a club fell championships it is encouraged but not compulsory. (and yes, I know WP you don't force people at BBH, I just can't think of a better word!!).

Those who want to succeed are shown how to get better by club coaches but we aim to deal with all children. There is a written coaching itinerary and now, all are 'graded' after lots of tests. Specific coaches work with each group based on ability, same caoches, with same group every week. But if children are not enjoying it, they wont come back and you will have wasted your time.

[Witton Park]

So far we seem to agree fun, social etc.

But there comes a time that we have to realise we are all in athletics clubs. We compete, we go as a club and our athletes compete individually and as team members.
That is in reality the purpose of our existence.

Should we expect any athlete that comes to us to work to get better?

[Clash City Rocker]

40 plus juniors turning up at CVFr every Tues regardless of weather and with only fell running to tempt them. I believe that when they come for their first session then we should have agoal straight away. The goal should be that they turn up for their second session. They wont if they havent enjoyed themselves.
From that number of kids we have just a handful who race regularly and not many more who race at all. That isnt the reason they come. Having fun getting muddy and just a little bit tired is enough. I make them aware of races both locally and nationally and we have a junior championship series fo 10 races each year to encourage them to try to develop. When they show an intereste then i support them all I can, engaging with parents has to be important in terms of getting them to races making sure they know what they are letting themselves in for. Positive feedback is good and always finding out how they have done to be able to let them know that I know how they are doing is good. Always for me its about telling them to go out and enjoy it. Even with ours juniors who are on the edge of national success, achieving national success and international success my last words to them before any race once the planning is done is to go out and enjoy the experience.

[biara]

Agree with lots of CCR post, enjoyment is the thing that is paramount. More and more juniors are attempting our club champs but it is not the be all and end all. Yesterdays stanbury splash rat run had loads of juniors out, it was wet, very windy and pretty cold, but seeing a hell of alot of smiling faces made it a success. Juniors smiling when you shout encouragement and clap them through, that is a success. Yes, they should want to improve but improvement through having fun and 'not realising' they are working hard is to me, what it is all about.

If they enjoy the juniors, they are more likely to go into the seniors. I always want little biara to finish smiling and having enjoyed the race, I want her to still be doing sport when she is grown up (only 9 now). To me, I think I am hitting the balance right as after 3 years, she is still involved and still wants to do more. As CCR says, the experience is what it's all about.

[Witton Park]

Is it too simplistic to discuss it as juniors / seniors?

In fell terms, up to and including U12, they can get by with what I would call part time commitment. As they move through the U14s if they don't up their game they will lose ground and we will lose them by the time they get to U16s.

Don't get me wrong, there has to be fun all along. You cannot turn out in all weathers to train and race if you aren't enjoying it. But by the same token, part of the enjoyment is based around achievement.

If you look at the current 2011 U18s table and go back to 2005 when they were U12s and chart the progress it makes interesting reading in both Boys and Girls categories.
Quite a large number, the large majority of athletes of whom I can say "I wonder what happened to them".

Some are mine, or were friends of mine or my athletes. A fair portion were those that failed to up their game when it was needed.

That transition from fun to serious has to be managed by coaches, parents and athlete. It's key to keeping them in the sport, whatever level they are at.

I certainly don't think I've got the balance right yet - not sure I ever will :/

[Clash City Rocker]

I agree WP there is a point where success that was easily achieved young due to the kindness of the gene pool begins to be eroded through other athletes who are less gifted but are beginning to work harder and it is this age that is critical because it becomes hard for those who have enjoyed success to come to terms with losing. If its only been about the winning then this is harder to take. It is obvioulsy at this point that we begin to lose juniors. Losing juniors is inevitable whatever we do as parents coaches clubs. History shows as you point out with the fell scene over the last few years that the vast majority chose another route through life. The balance tha Biara seeks is right. Whilst I have a talented son who is amassing county honours for track and Xc who started on the fells and is targetting fells more this year I wnat him to succeed what parent wouldnt but more than that I want him to be running when is my age because he still loves the whole idea of just sticking a pair of trainers on and getting out there. Look at he power of 10 for any sport/discipline and track the juniors through from years ago and you will see names drop of the lists as the age groups progress. Very few make it through to the senior ranks and even less remain record breakers/holders. Seniors are more likely to come from runners who have come to the sport later those that start really young are done with it by then. Is this because we assume that progression is needed all the time and the whole competetive process is built around improve or remove?
As noted on the old thread I am not suggesting that we protect juniors from defeats its the nature of racing that only one person can win unlike team sprorts so the sooner kids get used to that the better. Thats life. But we have to come up with a better way of keeping kids in the sport. Who knows how many potential world beaters have gone aged between 14 and 18.

[Eleanor]

I agree WP there is a point where success that was easily achieved young due to the kindness of the gene pool begins to be eroded through other athletes who are less gifted but are beginning to work harder and it is this age that is critical because it becomes hard for those who have enjoyed success to come to terms with losing. If its only been about the winning then this is harder to take. It is obvioulsy at this point that we begin to lose juniors. Losing juniors is inevitable whatever we do as parents coaches clubs. History shows as you point out with the fell scene over the last few years that the vast majority chose another route through life. The balance tha Biara seeks is right. Whilst I have a talented son who is amassing county honours for track and Xc who started on the fells and is targetting fells more this year I wnat him to succeed what parent wouldnt but more than that I want him to be running when is my age because he still loves the whole idea of just sticking a pair of trainers on and getting out there. Look at he power of 10 for any sport/discipline and track the juniors through from years ago and you will see names drop of the lists as the age groups progress. Very few make it through to the senior ranks and even less remain record breakers/holders. Seniors are more likely to come from runners who have come to the sport later those that start really young are done with it by then. Is this because we assume that progression is needed all the time and the whole competetive process is built around improve or remove?
As noted on the old thread I am not suggesting that we protect juniors from defeats its the nature of racing that only one person can win unlike team sprorts so the sooner kids get used to that the better. Thats life. But we have to come up with a better way of keeping kids in the sport. Who knows how many potential world beaters have gone aged between 14 and 18.

Clash City, this is really interesting. I agree there can be danger for talented youngsters for the reasons you suggest. Conversley, those children who enjoy fell running but who struggle to do well in terms of winning (ie. they work really hard but still come near the back in a race), they gain a lot in terms of emotional resiliance, working hard to make small gains, etc, and this is a fantastic benefit for their later life. It takes a special character to be slow or average in races time-and-again, and to keep turning up. I think these youngsters are more likely to stick with the sport because coping with the work and the pain involved will have become second nature - they have lived it already and they will not be fazed by coming up against better runners later - they are used to it! With children this is specially admirable because at this age racing IS about winning (nothing wrong with that) so if we can get these children into our clubs, they have lots to gain and probably lots to contribute to our clubs later.

For me it is similar to the problems of child prodigies in any field - outside sport too. Extra-clever or talented children get used to being admired and being on top, winning or being in sight of trophies, etc. So yes, for many it is such a big fall once the world stops saying how brilliant they are, and once 'being on (or near) the top' needs a work ethic and resiliance to failure, not just the luck of genetics.

And there is a gap between success in childhood and success in adulthood (again, in anything, not just sport). Maturity, late starters, etc. Some kids can run faster when they are young, and others catch up later. Average juniors can be top seniors, also through the luck of genetics.

I think about this a lot (it's interesting!).