post brexit

[Witton Park]

There was also a lesser covered report from the Centre for Business Research at the University of Cambridge who found that Treasury pre Brexit report was "very flawed and very partisan".

I acknowledge that certain individuals on both sides may have egged up or down certain things. Leave for example stand accused of the £350m claim on the bus.
Most of these were fully scrutinised in the media and I think people were in a reasonable position to make a judgement on them.

However, when institutions central to the Governance of this country put out BS and dress it up as independent, expert opinion it needs further scrutiny. Why and how did this happen?

It's stands comparison with Blair's dodgy dossier.

Once the process is finished I'd like to see a proper assessment by an independent enquiry because if we are to have such a decision made again by way of a public referendum, we need to make sure that information is accurate, that opinions don't get dressed up as facts and that the machinery of Government cannot be used to deceive.

[Mike T]

There was also a lesser covered report from the Centre for Business Research at the University of Cambridge who found that Treasury pre Brexit report was "very flawed and very partisan".

I acknowledge that certain individuals on both sides may have egged up or down certain things. Leave for example stand accused of the £350m claim on the bus.
Most of these were fully scrutinised in the media and I think people were in a reasonable position to make a judgement on them.

However, when institutions central to the Governance of this country put out BS and dress it up as independent, expert opinion it needs further scrutiny. Why and how did this happen?

It's stands comparison with Blair's dodgy dossier.

Once the process is finished I'd like to see a proper assessment by an independent enquiry because if we are to have such a decision made again by way of a public referendum, we need to make sure that information is accurate, that opinions don't get dressed up as facts and that the machinery of Government cannot be used to deceive.

Why wait until it is finished? The result was just a reflection of public opinion, and is in no way legally binding.

[Stagger]

If the public can't make a choice why not just be another Russian state?

[Mike T]

If the public can't make a choice why not just be another Russian state?

If this had been a medical case and a decision needed to be made by the patient and their relatives whether or not to operate, the level of information given by the surgeon has been so appalling he would have ended up in court. So it is not that the public shouldn't be able to choose, but that they need to be given the appropriate, honest, and clear information before doing so.

[DrPatrickBarry]

The problem with this is there is NOT a right answer. There are advantages and disadvantages to both outcomes. The Brexiters will argue the advantages of leaving outweigh the disadvantages, remainers the opposite.

[Stagger]

2 words Doc

Democracy, Majority.

[Mike T]

2 words Doc

Democracy, Majority.

... and in court the crooked surgeon would simply say "you all signed the consent form ..." but that does make the process right, or the outcome good - and if the operation had not yet taken place it could be cancelled.

[Witton Park]

Why wait until it is finished? The result was just a reflection of public opinion, and is in no way legally binding.

I think we have enough on our plate at the moment.

I also think that the issue is what the machinery of Government put out. Individual politicians and campaigners will come out with stuff that is easily challenged. They are venturing an opinion and I don't see there is any way to stop a political campaigner coming out with a whopper. If they goes as far as telling lies, then they'll come a cropper.

Organisations such as CBI, IFS are answerable to their subscribers. The IFS for example is seen as credible but only so long as they stack up.

But the Treasury and BoE should be beyond reproach. We've seen how the political will of Government can be used to politicise the machinery of Government particularly with Iraq and Blair with the dossier.

It's still going on. It needs sorting.

[Stolly]

2 words Doc

Democracy, Majority.

Except that the margin of vote was just 3.8%. And only 37.4% of the overall electorate voted for brexit anyway. A government pushing through such an extreme change based on what is such a small margin of brexit vs remain is bonkers, especially as the old made up such a large part of the brexit vote and a good chunk of those will have died if not already then in the next 10 years. There's even a strong view that if the referendum was rerun today there would be a convincing remain win! If so the government pushing through with what's sounds day by day to be a hard brexit outcome will be completely un democratic for the electorate that exists when the uk is actually out of the EU!

As for referendums, they're their own living proof that they should never ever be used to make "democratic" decisions - didn't Germany hold a referendum to give Adolf Hitler supreme power following the death of Hindenburg in 1934!?

[bigfella]

It's a slightly bigger majority if you discount Scotland as they have more or less said they won't be bound by the outcome anyway.