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Thread: Disused quarries

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    Disused quarries

    Disused quarries: dangerous places where people fall off cliff faces or drown in lakes — or wonderful recreational facilities?

    I have occasionally referred to Longcliffe quarry on the Today’s Training thread. I don’t go there very often, and usually there are only a few other people there when I do; but on one recent warm, sunny day, it was teeming with people, none of them more than half my age. These young people go swimming in the lake, they do cliff-diving, rock-climbing, mountain-biking, or simply sun-bathing and hanging out with friends. I do personally know some young people who go there quite frequently; when they first told me about what they do there, I gave them the usual warnings about the dangers of these activities, but they already seemed to have a fairly good grasp of the issues. And that is the point: we live in a world full of all sorts of dangers, and we learn to cope with them by progressively exposing ourselves to more hazardous situations, in the company of more experienced friends — just like a fell runner will gradually progress from local BS races to Wasdale and Ennerdale.

    Now my young acquaintances have told me that on their latest visit to the quarry, the hole in the fence giving access had been sealed up (but they had easily found a way round that), but once in the quarry they were confronted by Security staff with dogs. These men asked them to leave, and told them that someone had recently been killed diving into the quarry. Now, I read the local paper every week, and I think such an event would have been reported if it had actually happened.

    I feel really angry about this. The young people have found this quarry, they have made it their own (although they could show it a bit more love; there is an appalling amount of litter scattered around), and devised their own activities. These activities are healthy (both physically and mentally); they are not safe, but I think that Safety is sometimes the enemy of Health. They are not endangering anyone else except possibly by their parking of cars on the road near the quarry. They will undoubtedly find other ways to explore danger and prevent boredom, maybe by driving at stupid speeds along country lanes, or by taking drugs. Who benefits from depriving these people of their recreation?

    End of rant.

    [More on Longcliffe and other local quarries here: http://www.focf.org.uk/pdf/quarries.pdf . Ignore the dreadful presentation of this document, a lot of what it says is very sensible.]
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    Master Daletownrunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anthonykay View Post
    Disused quarries: dangerous places where people fall off cliff faces or drown in lakes — or wonderful recreational facilities?

    I have occasionally referred to Longcliffe quarry on the Today’s Training thread. I don’t go there very often, and usually there are only a few other people there when I do; but on one recent warm, sunny day, it was teeming with people, none of them more than half my age. These young people go swimming in the lake, they do cliff-diving, rock-climbing, mountain-biking, or simply sun-bathing and hanging out with friends. I do personally know some young people who go there quite frequently; when they first told me about what they do there, I gave them the usual warnings about the dangers of these activities, but they already seemed to have a fairly good grasp of the issues. And that is the point: we live in a world full of all sorts of dangers, and we learn to cope with them by progressively exposing ourselves to more hazardous situations, in the company of more experienced friends — just like a fell runner will gradually progress from local BS races to Wasdale and Ennerdale.

    Now my young acquaintances have told me that on their latest visit to the quarry, the hole in the fence giving access had been sealed up (but they had easily found a way round that), but once in the quarry they were confronted by Security staff with dogs. These men asked them to leave, and told them that someone had recently been killed diving into the quarry. Now, I read the local paper every week, and I think such an event would have been reported if it had actually happened.

    I feel really angry about this. The young people have found this quarry, they have made it their own (although they could show it a bit more love; there is an appalling amount of litter scattered around), and devised their own activities. These activities are healthy (both physically and mentally); they are not safe, but I think that Safety is sometimes the enemy of Health. They are not endangering anyone else except possibly by their parking of cars on the road near the quarry. They will undoubtedly find other ways to explore danger and prevent boredom, maybe by driving at stupid speeds along country lanes, or by taking drugs. Who benefits from depriving these people of their recreation?

    End of rant.

    [More on Longcliffe and other local quarries here: http://www.focf.org.uk/pdf/quarries.pdf . Ignore the dreadful presentation of this document, a lot of what it says is very sensible.]


    The security were possibly referring to this http://www.nwemail.co.uk/news/lakes/...f2c570c5eed-ds obviously not the quarry you visit but a definite stark warning that sometimes people need protecting from themselves

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    And in some cases the law could impose a duty of care on someone who owns or is responsible for the quarry, a duty of care to the general public who may attempt to access the quarry. Preventing access may be the best way to avoid liability for negligence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Daletownrunner View Post
    The security were possibly referring to this http://www.nwemail.co.uk/news/lakes/...f2c570c5eed-ds obviously not the quarry you visit but a definite stark warning that sometimes people need protecting from themselves

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    Quote Originally Posted by benshep View Post
    And in some cases the law could impose a duty of care on someone who owns or is responsible for the quarry, a duty of care to the general public who may attempt to access the quarry. Preventing access may be the best way to avoid liability for negligence.
    Yes, I had suspected that the landowners may be concerned about litigation in case of an accident in the quarry. Commonsense dictates that if someone is injured or killed while trespassing on your land, having broken down your fence, then you (the landowner) can't be held responsible. But commonsense and the law are two different things.

    A week or two before my acquaintances met the security team in the quarry, the Leics police had posted on social media a list of warnings about the dangers of the quarry lake -- although the post also included the words, "We are not looking to spoil anyone's fun . . .". I am entirely in agreement with this approach; what upsets me is that someone has now decided that the informal use of the quarry should be totally prevented, even after steps have been taken to warn people of the risks.
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    Master DrPatrickBarry's Avatar
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    An insecure fence is "in effect" inviting them in. So the owner would be libal. This is established in case law.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPatrickBarry View Post
    An insecure fence is "in effect" inviting them in. So the owner would be libal. This is established in case law.
    Link?

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    Master Daletownrunner's Avatar
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    Here’s what the HSE says about quarries, both working and abandoned,

    http://www.hse.gov.uk/quarries/country.htm


    An interesting line is

    ‘In many instances, risks at abandoned quarry sites are similar to natural features encountered in open countryside and will be obvious to visitors’.



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    Master DrPatrickBarry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike T View Post
    Link?
    Something that was discussed in university years ago.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Daletownrunner View Post
    Here’s what the HSE says about quarries, both working and abandoned,

    http://www.hse.gov.uk/quarries/country.htm


    An interesting line is

    ‘In many instances, risks at abandoned quarry sites are similar to natural features encountered in open countryside and will be obvious to visitors’.


    Thank you, Daletownrunner, that article is really useful. I have used it in composing a letter to the local paper, which last week published the warnings from the police which I mentioned in an earlier post.
    In his lifetime he suffered from unreality, as do so many Englishmen.
    Jorge Luis Borges

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    Master Daletownrunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anthonykay View Post
    Thank you, Daletownrunner, that article is really useful. I have used it in composing a letter to the local paper, which last week published the warnings from the police which I mentioned in an earlier post.
    No worries, it’s a hive of info that HSE website

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