£ Kerchinnggg!
£ Kerchinnggg!
Get a cat.
Oh no.....have I opened another can of worms?
I hope you are not breeding worms when there are so many worms that need re-homing.
I can see where longdogs is coming from and I appreciate that dog rescue compounds have far far too many dogs but, if you take longdogs argument to the limit, you could equally argue that we should adopt children before 'breeding' our own or not have children at all because there are too many living off of rubbish heaps in Indian slums. Its sort of an anti capitalism argument also (not that I'm any great capitalist) but dog breeders breed dogs that people want to buy don't they? They are satisfying a demand. And surely the biggest problem with regard to dog rescue centres is that people get dogs but then can't look after them. Anecdotally I suspect that a high proportion of people that pay a lot of money for a dog will not be the type of people who can't look after them. In Skipton recently for example three working border collies all sold from specialist breeders for upwards of £4,500!!
Aww very cute...xOriginally Posted by simgreen78
A brilliant point. The basic lack of understanding drives me insane. I have thought for a long time that we need people-oriented dog education courses - Longdogs I know about fifty people just in my local park that would benefit from something like that!
We are in the middle of a family feud at the moment, where my other half's sister, a vet, has been looking for a dog and refusing to consider a rescue dog despite our pleadings. She only wants a pedigree. Apparently we are officially not speaking to her now.
However, Al - you shouldn't necessarily feel guilty. Just because the general concensus on here is that a rescue dog is preferable, you made your decision based on what would be in the interests of your prospective dog, ie, you were worried that you wouldn't be able to give it the control it required to give it the home it needed. Whilst I would always advocate taking on a rescue dog or none at all, and I think you would have found a suitable rescue dog evantually, I can understand your rationale. Unfortunately you are right, the media does sometimes convey a bit of a stereotype of rescue dogs as all having problems or issues and needing intensive 'extra' work or special handling. Whilst there are obviously cases like that (usually borne out of people's poor behaviour in the past), the reality is very different. Rescue dogs require patience, understanding and love. For many, that is the point of having one.
I've now had Ozzy for two years. He's my constant companion. He was dumped by a farmer because he was rubbish at ratting (he's a Parsons Jack Russel) and was about to be destroyed in the pound. He is from a 'working' background. He is the most gentle, affectionate, loyal and rewarding friend you could wish for. He even comes to work with me every day - he's sitting under my desk as I write this. He's a rubbish fell runner though - he's only got little legs... comes out on my recovery runsHere he is...
Most of the dogs i am talking about die before they ever reach a rescue centre. As far as i know we don't kill excess children that nobody wants, nor do we deliberately breed deformed ones for money.
Purely in economic terms yes, dog breeders satisfy a demand. If they were manufacturing an inanimate object, fine, but these are sentient beings. It's quite incorrect that people are more capable of looking after a dog if they pay good money for it- simply wrong, there's loads of data to support that. If people were educated about the myths that they believe- we know what we're getting, we can train it how we like, we need this breed to do that job etc etc, there wouldn't be such a market. No doubt i come across as over emotional about it, and probably i am, but i can promise you i haven't made this stuff up. Over the last 10 years or so i've read thousands of journals, research papers and books, and seen hundreds of individual cases, and its quite clear that these myths are not true. They seem common-sensical, just as it seemed quite common-sensical once that you would sail off the end of the world, but they are not true.
If anyone wants to bite the bullet and face their ingrained prejudice, feel free to PM me and i can direct you to some of the data.
P.S an anecdote you might like... yesterday i killed a 9 month old Rottweiler with possible orthopaedic disease. The owners weren't willing to pay for either diagnosis or treatment because a new dog is cheaper. If you think that's an unrepresentative tale, come and walk in my shoes for a week.
Longdogs I appreciate that you work in the front line of all this and are also a massive dog lover and very emotionally attached to the plight to dogs in rescue pounds but don't you think that its emotional blackmail to say that anybody who wants a dog must take on a rescued dog rather than buy a puppy of their choice?
I have a client who is a vet by the way who, despite all of the trauma and troubles of the job, seems to get by okay, drawing earnings in excess of £150,000 a year! Not typical I'm sure but, as an owner of two cats and now one dog and various pets before these, many pet owners might also criticise vet fees and, you never know, the cost of vet treatments themselves I'm sure lead some (horrible) pet owners to discard or in your example have put down unwanted pets. I'm not really having a pop at vets here (our local vets are brilliant) but in a round about way what I'm trying to say is that all sorts of things lead to there being too many unwanted cats and dogs in rescue centres and its certainly not all because breeders sell puppies.
Bit harsh that LD.
Be Humble. Sit Down.
Hang on a minute commodity(Longdogs), Stolly is quite right. If we apply your principle on dogs to children, then we'd come to the conclusion that it is evil to want your own children, because thousands of kids around the world are destitue and will die without somebody to bring them up. So, how dare you put your own desires before the world's orphans.( I noticed that at least one of those who agreed with your position have children of their own)
Some of your other arguments are incorrect as well. There are many cases in the world where parents with mental and physical defects have children knowing full well that their children will inherit the same characteristics. In addition one country has killed children that were beyond the parent's quota.
So no, your defense is nonsense just like your earlier arguments.
Last edited by CL; 18-08-2010 at 12:41 PM.
The way I see it, commodity alias Longdogs is pointing the finger and she's got three fingers pointing back. Some time ago she was telling us that she increasingly believed that animals were being just treated as commodities(hence the new nickname I've coined for her). When I pointed out that she was a Vet and Vets made money out of animals, she went ahead and blamed her lack of integrity on having to make a living!
Other things come to mind as well. When she didn't want one of her own dogs(which appear to me to be a particular breed) she found it a new home. Nothing wrong with that from my point of view, but there would be if I was complaining of animals being used as 'commodities.'
In fact if you look at the situation properly, she found herself in the same position as many of the people she's complaining about. Of not wanting her dog anymore and palming it off to some very nice new owners. In other words treating it like a commodity. And if the new owners hadn't of wanted HER dog, but wanted a breed puppy instead, they would be very wrong and evil.
Last edited by CL; 18-08-2010 at 12:51 PM.
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