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Firstly Stolly I was referring to trade specifically. It doesn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stolly
The GDP Growth of the EU started to decline relative to the rest of the G20 since Maastricht and it has been worse in the Eurozone.
Germany's Centre for European Policy says euro brought a net gain of €2tn (€21,000 per capita) to Germans over 20 years to 2017. But it cost France €3.6tn (€56,000/capita) and Italy €4.3tn (€74,000/capita).
It works for some I suppose :rolleyes:
I'm with you WP the EU has failed GB.
Glad to be leaving, as voted for by a majority.
Yes, I concur but it was hardly a decisive majority was it?
Explain exactly how the EU has “failed” GB Stagger. Give some reasons and examples maybe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stagger
Or don’t you have any?
Comparing EU growth since Maastricht to a group that includes China and India isn’t the best. It’s not a like for like comparison. There’s even a few resource driven booms in that list along with some stagnant economies. The only way we’ll get anything like their growth rates is with a massive demographic shift or a new industrial revolution. Or massively cheapened labour that too is an option.
Now, if you can find a comparable with limited resources, an aging population, similarly sized and mixed economies Restricted low skilled migration. Then maybe we can start to build a believable Brexit model for the UK to build on.
Argentina’s not the model is it?
How about the USA?
Since Euro, Eurozone GDP Grown 26% compared to USA 46%.
You make a good case for the EU fully integrating into a US style federal set up.
I didn’t expect that from you WP 😆
Love these comparsion between the UK and EU. I wonder if France was not in the EU would their problems with militant trade unionism that block so many of the badly needed labour reforms that country needs suddendly go away?
Would Italy suddendly create a class of sensible politicians and the people elect them, plus give them the time to also modernise the country's outdated economy, instead of historically relying on devaluation to keep the country competitive?
Would 100,000s of of desperate migrants stop trying to cross the Mediterranean Sea, causing so much of the tensions within the EU at the moment.
But nobody will answer; you have your answer all the problems in the EU are 100% caused by the EU and Euro.
BTW Ireland was 5.6% growth in 18 and predicted 4% for 19. What is the UK again?
Did not know that, so I Googled it. I am not saying I disagree with it as you must have got those figures from somewhere reliable, but it is a much more complex measurement than those figures would suggest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
In his final paragraph.
The truth is that neither side ‘wins’ in this beauty contest. Europe merely does less badly than the USA in some crucial respects. Yes, while it is true that the core Eurozone countries could perform far better, Germany, France and Italy have quite different problems – in comparison both to the US and to each other – which require quite different solutions. Anybody who claims that the US provides a model which the EU should copy needs to consider the basic economic facts of the case.
http://www.federalist-debate.org/ind...e-economy-wins
It is from November 2006, I could not be bothered to search anymore, but the general gist of it is probably still relevant.
Firstly on the trade front, we already know that leaving without a deal will completely hammer us, so clearly staying in the EU is profoundly better than that, and secondly the only one example of leaving the EU where we might be better off is the cloud cuckoo land star spangled unicorn ideal of ‘full trading benefits of eu, but with no contributions and closed borders’ which will never ever happen. So staying in is easily better for trade.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
Secondly, aside from trade, what about all of the other massive advantages of staying in the EU that I listed.... presumably which you ignored as you have no answers 😉