Most people i've spoken to are of the opinion that the chest-strap for Heart Rate provides much more accurate and useful results.
I can't comment, as i only use my watch for pace/distance.
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Most people i've spoken to are of the opinion that the chest-strap for Heart Rate provides much more accurate and useful results.
I can't comment, as i only use my watch for pace/distance.
I've no reason to doubt my wrist based heart rate. Seems accurate enough for my needs and don't need any additional kit. The only time I have noticed any issue was when I was on my bike on an indoor trainer and obviously must have had my wrist at an odd angle as I apparently flat-lined!
Thanks. I don't suppose you've used it anywhere very hot and humid have you? - I'll be living mostly in a tropical rainforest area so trying to imagine whether the sweat factor will affect a wrist strap more or less than a chest one. I assume you have to keep the strap fairly tight to your wrist.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteS
Sorry but hot and humid is not something we get much of round our way.
I've had a few runs over the summer where it got very sweaty and rain doesn't seem to make much difference either. It doesn't need to be too tight -just the same most would wear a standard watch.
I find that the optical heart rate can sometimes pick up cadence, particularly if hiking up hills. I think it's worse when using poles, possibly because a bent wrist seperates the sensors from the wrist.
I've started using a chest strap and it does seem to give me slightly more realistic readings. I do seem to have a particularly fast ticker, but my watch recorded 212 the other week on the climb up to stoodley pike. Based on that I would have expected to chucking my guts up but I dont even remember working particularly hard at the point it was recorded.
In reality with the chest strap I think my max hr is more like 205 (still seems to be pretty high for a 32 year old though).
Also, I find with a chest strap there doesnt seem to be as much lag. With the watch I would be running up a very short incline and then recover on the flat over the crest but the hr wouldnt really increase on the screen until I was already well over the top and easing off on the flat.
Lag for HR on watches is usually due to sampling rate and subsequent smoothing of that data typically a moving average. My old suunto used to exhibit the same behaviour for ascent where that would continue to rise even after going over a peak and starting the descent.
But is it your watch or is it your heart rate peaking before recovery? I have read that HR monitors are not the best for gauging short hard efforts because your HR does take time to catch up with your actual exertion. If you think about it when you do an interval sprint your HR doesn't instantly rise and will continue to rise a little then stay high until you recover.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteS
It won't matter if you are primarily interested in speed and distance but my personal experience with optical HRMs has been poor. That's not to say it's perfect with a belt - I still get spikes and strange readings but I think this is common to most if not all systems. Reasons given include picking up cadence, poor contact (I wet my belt before starting an exercise, it often works fine for 5-10 minutes then body heat dries it out. Then I get silly, high readings for a while until I get sweaty, presumably the contact then improves and I usually get good readings for the rest of the run).
Its interesting to note on the Uphill Athlete site that they don't rate optical HR monitoring and stress the need to use a chest belt for accurate results.
I've always used pace as a basis for effort.
2 mile (or 3km run) race effort gives you a baseline pace... 60-70% of that for easy runs. 88% is supposedly tempo pace. I think it is 95-98% is VO2 max area.
I believe that the theory behind it is that it gives incredibly similar paces/results to measuring HR, but less room for error in the measurement. Obviously it is better suited to flat running.
Thanks for you ideas. I've ended up with a slightly older model - Forerunner 735xt. It seems to do the things I want and was a little cheaper that the Instinct. Unfortunately the wrist HRM seems very unreliable for me - erratic and impossibly high readings. Maybe they just don't work so well on thin wrists. Thankfully my rather ancient Garmin chest strap HRM pairs with the new watch so it's not a major issue.
I'm a bit disenchanted by the quality of GPS watches.
I've spent a total of around £950 on my last 3.
I had a Suunto Core Extreme that failed after around 18 months. It had a two year warranty and to be fair to Suunto they took it back to Finland, said it was beyond repair and sent me a new replacement.
However that one also went pear-shaped after 12 months or so and they then claimed I only had a two year warranty and it was now lapsed and if I sent it back to Finland, it was at my cost.
Nice too see they didn't stand by their device only 12 months old.
I then moved to a Forerunner 220. Worked well while running, but developed charging issues and software issues. The charging cradle was quite poor in consistency of contact and often when connecting to my laptop I had software conflicts.
It limped to just over 3 years, so better in terms of life than the Suunto.
My current watch is a Fenix 5S. It's up to 32 months now, but for at least 6 months I've been having similar connectivity issues as with my previous Forerunner.
This was a £350 watch and I only use for running, walking or cycling and the last 3 years have been the least active of my running life, so it should be fine.
My Fenix was last used on Sunday and I haven't been able to get it to charge since, so used my phone this morning.
Overall, very disappointed with them. Wondered if anyone else had similar issues.
I have a Fenix 6X Pro - so far near perfect. I come back from a run, take it off, have a shower, and it downloads to Garmin Connect and Strava without being connected to anything. About once a month it does need to be connected to download. No charging problems YET - I recharge it overnight about twice a week.
My Fenix 5 stopped downloading runs no matter what I did - it was out of warranty but Garmin exchanged it for a refurbished one free of charge - I gave it to my partner though she has not used it yet - she just uses her phone.
I have had multiple Garmins - most have developed charging problems eventually - very annoying to hear that this is still an issue.
Regards charging issues with Garmins - you may already ahve done this, but if not, then check that the charging port is not gunked up with sweat/dirt/etc. It's a poor design, an open recess next to a sweaty wrist. I use a cotton bud dipped in cleaning fluid, and give it a good rub, it's amazing the amount of dirt that the bud collects.
Agreed, cleaning is important, but eventually the charging points and/or its supporting frame wear out/become loose and charging becomes intermittent at best, and finally impossible.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yaks
I bought some rubber covers for the Garmin charging port on Amazon. Just a few quid for ten and stops it getting clogged up and worn.
I have a Garmin Instinct bought in 2019 (see earlier review on this thread) and still going strong. If I was going to buy another watch today, I'd just buy the solar version of the instinct. Doesn't have a fancy colour touch screen or anything like that - just does what it's meant to do and well. Battery life still great too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike T
I have had several "refurbished" Garmins but I suspect they are in fact effectively new. Possibly Garmin salvage some parts of returned items but I have never believed Garmin are in the "repair" business.
Update.
I managed to get it charging again and on and off it was OK until about 3 weeks ago and then nothing.
I contacted Garmin - they advised that they do not offer a service option. What I could do is return my watch and they would send out a refurb and charge me £146.57 which seems an odd amount, but also very pricey without any details on the item they are sending or guarantee.
So I found advancedrepair.co.uk and they charged £70 and the watch is back and charging properly. Less than a week to turn it around.
Apparently gunk aside (and I did clean it) the most common issue is the connection to the motherboard and they go in to the watch and repair it.
If I get another year out of it I'll consider it money well spent.
Garmin Fenix 3 bought in late 2015 - still going strong.
Used daily (not while sleeping) and aside from weekly running, it has seen plenty of seawater swimming, lake dips, kayaking action, plus daily showering, etc. over the years. No major issues, but the original charger (wall electric socket plug thingy) stopped working 3 years ago, and now i charge it from my Mac via a, new, charging cradle and cable.
The battery is still satisfactory and needs charging every 2 to 3 days. The only issue I have to keep an eye on is that when it is disconnected from the Mac it sometimes freezes and needs to be switched off and on again (seems to be a cure for so much in life!).
Also, despite there being an indoor rowing widget, it really doesn't work well at all for this activity.
Useful tip for some OCD fit-biters - wearing it while horse riding quadruples your steps count :)
How does that work? Last time I counted, a horse only had four legs :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Mossdog
Since Garmin don't do servicing how do you think they source the alleged "refurbished" models?Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
You're getting your pants pulled down if you go to those idiots, they'll be outsourcing the work at a premium. Some bean counter will have decided it's too expensive to have a service dept.
They would have taken my returned defunct watch, shipped it out to the factory where they refurbish, refurbished it there and used that as a replacement for someone else down the line.Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham Breeze
At least that's what Garmin UK told me.
Yeap. To be honest, that reference might be an exaggeration rather than a literal quadrupling. But the 'step' counter does give some weird feedback when riding due to the horse's movements/gaits and the accelerometre thingy in the watch. Horses walk with 4 beats; trop (posting) with 2 beats; canter with 3 beats; and gallop with 4 beats. There's also 'flying changes' and different rider degrees of contact and vertical movements that confound too!Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco
Impressive use of 70 words to supplement "er...yep" :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Mossdog
Somehow, I'm troubled by the mental image of you have the spare time and also the inclination to individually count each of those words Graham!Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham Breeze
N0! I just can't shake it...:cool:
I would not wish you to be disturbed (although I was troubled by your spelling of accelerometer) and although it is said that genius is an infinite capacity for taking pains certainly there is another word for using cut and paste and word count.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mossdog
And a third word for reducing the true total of 72 to 70 because round numbers are more memorably striking than mere precision.;)
My Fenix 6S Pro used to click nicely onto the charging cable, but for a while it has slotted in more softly - now for the first time, it has failed to charge to 100% overnight - I have since given the connections a decent clean and am keeping my fingers crossed. If it becomes unchargeable despite what I do I think I will go for an Instinct - the top models are now well over £1,000 - crazy.
as with my experience - had a period of inconsistent charging until it would charge no longer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike T
The £70 fix mentioned above seems to have sorted it. It will be interesting to see how much longer I get out of it.
Might be worth a try mike if your problem persists.
Thanks for the suggestion WP. It would seem several people had downloading problems on that day. Whether or not it has anything to do with the recent upgrade I have no idea. My watch has since downloaded/charged normally.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
So which GPS watch hits the 'sweet spot'. That is, basic navigation functions, understated, thrifty, so not overly gauche, or resembling the techy bling a triathlete-type might hanker after?
Is "you look like a triathlete" now the ultimate in disdainful scorn?:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Mossdog
I assume you mean apart from the Yorkshire pair? :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham Breeze
Anyway, to answer Mossdog's question, I'd go Garmin Instinct every time and although not particularly thrifty, it is well under half the price of a Fenix.
Actually I've always thought triathlons are for people who are not very good at anything but alright at several things that few people want to bother with. I could add "why would anyone?" but then remembered - it's the bling!Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteS
Why not trampolining + golf + archery or para-gliding + ski jumping + basketball?
.
Golf and gliding mainly although I love the sound of a trampoline and archery duathlon. Even better combined into a new sport - what could possibly go wrong!Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham Breeze
Thanks Pete.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteS