Congratulations to Carl Bell for his brilliant win. Also super massive congratulations to our lovely Judith Jepson on the 1st Female win! Brilliant just blooming brilliant!!
Printable View
Congratulations to Carl Bell for his brilliant win. Also super massive congratulations to our lovely Judith Jepson on the 1st Female win! Brilliant just blooming brilliant!!
With the highest score yet recorded by a FV50 :-)Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceTheSweeper
I would like to record my public thanks to Bill and Ben for carrying on the LCT. This was the 16th and, if people will forgive the cliché, in 2002 when Brian Martin and I launched the LCT to help support entries for a few years for Wasdale and Ennerdale we little thought...Quote:
Originally Posted by BillJ
Bill is, of course, correct to note that completions are lower than they were, with 56 this year.
The five 3 year average completions for the first 15 LCTs are: 33 - 73 - 91 - 94 - 72 but eg Wasdale and Ennerdale will always be tough races and I never expected the numbers of LCT completers to keep rising year after year. Whilst I believe these races are the pinnacle of fell running and the supreme test, nobody has to keep doing them every year to prove their man (or woman) hood.
The fact is that there are now far more Long A races in the English Calendar than there have ever been - so there is just more choice. The growth and characteristics of races over the history of the FRA Calendar is something I have been looking at for a future submission for The Fellrunner and the very recent growth in Long A races is quite astonishing.
So, 16 years ago I was writing for The Fellrunner about the need to "save" Long A races and now I can write about the veritable abundance. Ah the rich historical tapestry of fell running!
Great work Bill
Fantastic to see these races seemingly thriving...
When I got into Fell running, it was the thought of competing in these races that really spurred me on. I share the same view as Graham, that these are the top of the tree when it comes to Fell racing (I can appreciate people having a different viewpoint though)...
My ambition was always to be strong enough to qualify for the trophy every year. For various reasons (a great love for the big Welsh races such as Peris/1000's, clashes with other races, longer-distance ambitions for the future), I've not done these races justice... A single dnf at Wasdale, 1 Buttermere, 2 Borrowdale, 1 Langdale, no Three Shires, Duddon or (unforgivably) Ennerdale.
It will be a couple of years until I've extinguished the ultra long distance bug, but in the words of that American general... "I shall return" and hopefully see myself on the Classics league table in future years. And I wouldn't miss the Buttermere champs race next year for anything....
Thank you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Travs
When Brian Martin and I (with support from Selwyn Wright) established the LCT we didn't know how it would work out. Some RO were indifferent and one wrote to tell us that he didn't agree with what we were doing, but since we were - he was enclosing a cheque! Since Brian and I were financing the LCT ourselves, whilst I didn't agree with his opposition to the LCT I felt it would be insulting to reject his money - so I cashed the cheque to spare his feelings.
It was when the idea was copied by others that Brian and I thought the LCT would all work out fine, and it was when more people wanted to send us money to cover the cost of prizes etc that we knew it would. ;)
For those with ambitions on competing in the LCT 2018...
As you probably know, we planned to 'rest' the three shorter (and largest entry) long races in turn - Langdale, Borrowdale and Three Shires. Which would have meant that Borrowdale would have been the non-counter this year.
However with Buttermere Horseshoe being an English and British Championship race this year, it will be over-busy (perhaps over-subscribed?) with that. So Buttermere Horseshoe will be 'rested' from the trophy this year.
That means that the LCT races 2018 are the same as they were for many years up to 2015:
Borrowdale promoted to a super long, along with Duddon, Ennerdale and Wasdale; and Langdale and Three Shires as the 'shorter' longs.
http://www.lakelandclassicstrophy.org.uk/
FWIW this decision seems to me to be consistent with the reason why the LCT was established, ie to support low attendance Lakeland races, so good.Quote:
Originally Posted by BillJ
Thanks for the information and I understand the decision and Graham's reasoning.
However I quite like the idea of knocking off a super-long and a champs race in one fell swoop. One less weekend away (for those of us not lakes based), one less car trip, one less potential for clash. This year Three Shires directly clashes with the champs race at Cautley, removing another potential race for people looking at both LCT and champs (both individually and from a team perspective. Which people will be).
Last year Wasdale was both a LCT and English Championships counter. Will the decision to rest the Lakeland Classic (or 2 classics, as in 2016) that is used as an English Champs counter be consistent from now on?
Do you have the data for bumps in entry to the Super-Longs when they are champs races? I see Wasdale had 233 finishers in 2017 (Eng Champs, good weather) as opposed to 94 in 2016 (non-champs, crap weather). I'd expect around the 200-230 mark for Buttermere this year.
Far be it from me to mis-interpret Graham's baby, but I have come to see the LCT as both supporting low attendance Lakeland races, but also to support the tradition of racing Lakeland superlongs (especially Wasdale, Ennerdale and more recently Buttermere; my best Duddon time is ~15mins quicker than best Borrowdale, but it deserves protected super-long status for the first reason of supporting lakeland races).
Were it solely about supporting poorly-attended Lakeland races then surely Lingmell Dash would be in (13 finishers last year despite the publicity of hosting a champs race a couple of years ago) - although this obviously younger so not as traditional as the big jobbas.
Of course a champs race normally results in a faster winning time, so those further down the field see their LCT scores take a hit!
(just a few thoughts from someone who was planning to use Buttermere as an LCT counter)
All good comments ba-ba.
Our (Ben & I) belief in the raison d'etre for the LCT is much the same as yours - to keep the tradition of the long Lakeland races healthy. In particular to keep those half a dozen or so long races, each with their history, viable.
We did have a lot of debate between the two of us before including Buttermere Horseshoe in the LCT from 2016. I was keen to include it, partly because it was originally a race with 'history' that had stopped being run and then reinstated, but also partly because it feels right to include it.
We then debated about what to do with now having 7 races. That feels like it makes it a different beast. The set of half a dozen races is more compact. Hence the decision to rest the races that now get lots of runners anyway, in turn.
So there's quite a bit of 'feels like' in that! We try to be consistent, but it is consistent with what 'feels right' to us, which is of course not the same as being consistent with logical guidelines - or even consistent with what feels right to anyone else!
But my apologies for making you have to do an additional race rather than 'double-counting' Buttermere Horseshoe. ;-)
It is a good point about being one less weekend away for those who do both championships.
I'll be aiming to score a place in the LCT this year. These are the races which initially made me want to get involved in fell racing, although to my shame I've not yet competed enough LCT races in a year to score. But I'll be making sure this year. Ennerdale entry already sent off. Buttermere was to be the 2nd, so I'll have to do Borrowdale again this year (never a chore), and finish off with Langdale. Particularly looking forward to Ennerdale and Buttermere.
NicQuote:
Originally Posted by ba-ba
I appreciate your comments but it is slightly mischievous of you to throw Lingmell Dash into the mix.
It's a lovely race, although my great affection for it might be coloured by my being First V70 when it was an English Champs counter, but it is a Short race and the LCT is all about Longs.
As you know!
Graham
Yes was slightly tongue in cheek! Lingmell was also my best ever short champs result and I even held Mr. Mason off into the funnel!
There are other Lakeland longs with reduced numbers, some in the LCT style, some not, that sometimes suffer reduced numbers - Great Lakes, some of the more eastern ones (howtown, Helvellyn and the dodds?). I see Pete Blands started another series in 2017, more focused on middle distances. We could get to a point where every race is in a series though which would be daft!
Bill - thanks to you and Ben for putting Buttermere in the LCT (normally!). The numbers the first few years did put it at risk like Ennerdale and Wasdale were when the LCT was started, and it's good to see numbers at it creeping up. It is a hard, honest but enjoyable bugger - much like the former team-mate of mine it is run in memorial of - that deserves it's status.
Some apparently 'reduced numbers' races are actually running at capacity. Entries are restricted by lack of car parking, access, landowner permissions, available marshals/officials, etc.. My point being that not every race needs publicity and promotion to survive. Each race needs to be considered on its own merits and characteristics. Sometimes popularity is what kills off a race, e.g. some Kendal Winter League venues.
Excellent stuff. It was these 'Lakeland Classics' that inspired me to take up fellrunning back in 2006. I frequently find myself re-reading the original fellrunner article from October 2001 to remind myself of the special history of these races. The article also serves to show just how successful the LCT champs has become. It is to my greatest delight that CFR has included Ennerdale in their club champs races. I hope, from a local club perspective, this marks the beginning of an increased interest from the younger generation in the longer races. I welcome the addition of the Daz H race into the LCT and the decision to rest certain races, although I understand the views of those such as Ba-Ba who have a busy racing season ahead. For me, getting 3 qualifying races each year and seeing my name on the LCT finishers list is about as much as I can cope with! Well done to all involved with the LCT.
I've been trying to look at the Lakeland Classics Trophy website for a few days and I keep getting the message "Your connection is not private" and "NET::ERR_CERT_DATE_INVALID" which seems to imply the website might have been hacked. Anyone know anything about it?
Not hacked; that is to do with the new security settings in Browsers. Have you tried other browsers FireFox or I.E?
Google NET::ERR_CERT_DATE_INVALID you will find work arounds.
I got in OK on Firefox, but I had to accept the security risks.
The programmers need to update the site to work with the new security settings.
Ah, right, thanks Pat. Yes, both Firefox and Edge allowed me to get in after accepting the risks etc.