Quote:
Originally Posted by Stagger
We are already working on it
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stagger
We are already working on it
Attachment 8494
Quote:
Originally Posted by shaunaneto
Well politics is a dirty business and journalism and truth are rarely comfortable bed fellows.
Both Gove and Johnson are ex-journalists. (The Times/ The Daily Telegraph).
And truth? "If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie". (Goebbels).
Oh bloody hell, Breezey's only gone and brought the bloody Nazis into it!
Fitting really, considering some of the motivators that led to the EU.
Ok new vote please. However in the interest of fairness there are pre-requisites as tight as a fell runners mandatory kit in his bumbag.
Must be 18-24.
must be middle/upper class and rich
must have a minimum of 2 A levels and a Blue Peter Badge
must be a direct descendant of a Scottish family.
Must have a finger in an EU exporting business.
"Ok, would those 11 people stand up and step forward. Ermm excuse me, you 6 where are you going?" "We are going to vote". "Do you meet the criteria above?" "yes." "I have a poll that said you voted to leave. Is that true?" "Yes, is that a problem?"
"Yes, it is would you please sit back down as if you meet all the above then you must be a racist."
Really Britain? Is this how far we have come? Get a blooming grip and start working together. My family was divided on the vote. At no time during our discussions did we throw insults at each other. At no time since the result have we thrown insults at each other. It's democracy! What scares me most is the hard line "In" voters that are hell bent on Britain failing regardless of what it will cost.
It looks like that should really be 18-44.Quote:
Must be 18-24.
http://lordashcroftpolls.com/2016/06...hy/#more-14746
Agree with that, the petulant and patronising response I saw from remain voters was frankly embarrassing. My favourite was a friend that wrote she was ashamed to be British, and then immediately complained her 4 week holiday in Italy was now more expensive. Twat! On the flip side, leave voters are also telling people to shut up and forget about what they want forever. Which is censorship by peer pressure to all intents and purposes isn't really any better. I suppose the appropriate response would be a pro-Europe party agitating for re-entry which is where the Libdems seem to have thrown their hat. Gives them a purpose to exist I suppose.Quote:
Really Britain? Is this how far we have come? Get a blooming grip and start working together. My family was divided on the vote. At no time during our discussions did we throw insults at each other. At no time since the result have we thrown insults at each other. It's democracy! What scares me most is the hard line "In" voters that are hell bent on Britain failing regardless of what it will cost.
Which although I suspect will be annoying for those on the winning side is how representative democracy is supposed to work.
All that said, there's some good people now feeling very, very unwelcome looking at escape routes out of the U.K. And theyre people that will be sorely missed if they do leave. But considering some of more unpleasant the reports I'm seeing, I'm not that surprised.
I think the LibDems are undoubtedly being opportunistic. With around 6-8% of the vote currently, they are just trying to tap in to that 48%.Quote:
Originally Posted by shaunaneto
I would have more time for them if they just sat quiet while the current process was carried forward and went to Conference and discussed internally putting it in their next manifesto rather than shooting from the hip like this.
It undermines the democratic process.
They need to be careful though as the polling shows that 30% of LibDem voters also voted to Leave so they risk alienating current supporters.
There has been a lot of comment about how the older generations have selfishly cheated the younger generation out of their future. This is scandalous talk in itself since it undermines the whole principle of democracy i.e. one person one vote. But surely if the youngest voters were that concerned about staying in the EU, they could have got off their back sides and voted for it. I read that the turnout in the 18-24 age group was 43%!Quote:
Originally Posted by RaceTheSweeper
I thought one of the best comments was from a member of the audience on last night's Question Time who said if there was another referendum and the outcome was still for leaving, would we keep on having one until the "correct" verdict was given.
Amazingly 4% of UKIP supporters are said to have voted for "Remain"!Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
It is also interesting that we have highlighted the case of "we didn't know what we were voting for" or "we were misled".
I do think that politicians have to be more careful.
The Leave bus for example - I know it was only a promotional display but it inferred that £350M more could be spent on the NHS when in fact in discussions this was never said.
The £4300 worse off made it look like we would be £4300 per household poorer by 2030 when in fact that was not the case.
But the population also need to engage more, as deeper analysis and discussion of those figures was carried out.
If you didn't really know, then you only had yourself to blame, and there is no reason to suppose that it was spread across both Leave and Remain voters, and probably very small in number as well.
I also think that the Leave voters were generally "firmer" voters. I think the Remainers were less firm liek Corbyn for example.
Let's face it almost everyone that wanted to stay wanted a reformed EU and could not sell the EU in its current form.
The BBC in particular as a public service broadcaster could have played more of a role in this. Rather than hosting these adversarial debates, they could have put on a series of informative programmes looking at how trade functions, what the consequences would be of leaving the single market, of trading under WTO rules.
They could have looked at current immigration policy, the possibility of better border controls, and ask how immigration from outside of the EU seems to be higher than the Tory Govt target as well - if controls can work why isn't it?
There were a couple of attempts that I saw, but they really were too simple and just repeated the debating points without the ranting.
yes I've seen that - a bit odd that :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Muddy Retriever