Tonight's football thread

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Originally Posted by IanDarkpeak

it certainly wasn't dangerous.

..?!

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If someone fires a gunshot in a crowded room and it hit's no one, would that be dangerous?

If Nani hadn't have seen it coming and hopped out of the way he could well have been missing for the rest of the season. The only reason Kompany got the ball was because of Nani's instincts for self preservation.

Those sorts of tackles have no place in the game, no coach would advocate them and no player should indulge in them.

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Originally Posted by Witton Park

If someone fires a gunshot in a crowded room and it hit's no one, would that be dangerous?

If Nani hadn't have seen it coming and hopped out of the way he could well have been missing for the rest of the season. The only reason Kompany got the ball was because of Nani's instincts for self preservation.

Those sorts of tackles have no place in the game, no coach would advocate them and no player should indulge in them.

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depends whether it's shooting blanks :)

I agree there's no place for two footed tackles but red was a bit over the top, If Nani jumped over the tackle when/if he saw it why didn't he protest.

Now this is a red card tackle ouch!....http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xc7...a-10-feb_sport

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Originally Posted by IanDarkpeak

depends whether it's shooting blanks :)

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Brandon Lee

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Originally Posted by Fleeter

Epic Game!!

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Agreed. I've never felt so calm after losing a match.

We certainly have the moral victory today if the not the one on the pitch;)

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Originally Posted by IainR

I was watching on line.. everyone in Llanberis seems to be 'alternative' no one has a ruddy TV.... so I missed a fair few moments when the signal went poor..

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Your not bloody wrong there, " sorry, there was an error with an internet connection" Come on ITV sort it out, it was the same problem in the semi final last year and at the rugby world cup.Seems like the web coverage is the same as their tv, a bag o'shite.

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Originally Posted by Danbert Nocurry

Agreed. I've never felt so calm after losing a match.

We certainly have the moral victory today if the not the one on the pitch;)

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https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net...27177260_n.jpg

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Originally Posted by TheHeathens

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net...27177260_n.jpg

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The Heathens.....glad to see you're not dwelling on the fact that after being 3-0 up at half-time, you ended up hanging on by the skin of our teeth against 10 men, with baconface out-manoeuvred tactically by Mancini and your star new signing being a player brought out of retirement who gave more balls away than Santa Claus in Christmas week.

If it hadn't been for the very questionable sending off, you'd now be out of the cup. You failed to score and conceded two goals against 10 men in the second half. At times it looked like we had the extra player. If you can't see the writing on the wall for United you are wilfully blind my friend. Tick Tock matey.

Yep, you're definitely calm about it Danbert :D :D

I understand your frustration at only challenging for one of the big 3 cups so if you feel you need some Kompany, feel 3-2 pop round.

I've already said that I was disappointed we didn't KILL the game (remember those 3 goals we scored without reply in the first half?) but we did what we needed to do to get the win. All this with a massively injury depleted team (we could easily field a Premier League standard XI with our injured players) so disappointed yes, but not as much as the Bottlers.

How long until you're out of the title race? Tick Tock

... and if City want to be known as plucky losers (like you seem to be advocating) then that's fine with me.

Bring on Liverpool!

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Originally Posted by Danbert Nocurry

The Heathens.....glad to see you're not dwelling on the fact that after being 3-0 up at half-time, you ended up hanging on by the skin of our teeth against 10 men, with baconface out-manoeuvred tactically by Mancini and your star new signing being a player brought out of retirement who gave more balls away than Santa Claus in Christmas week.

If it hadn't been for the very questionable sending off, you'd now be out of the cup. You failed to score and conceded two goals against 10 men in the second half. At times it looked like we had the extra player. If you can't see the writing on the wall for United you are wilfully blind my friend. Tick Tock matey.

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Those that say the sending of is questionable are wrong. Two footed lunge, out of control, off the ground, potential ankle breaking challenge. For the likes of Peter Reid to say they didn't see anything wrong with it is barking mad.
If it had made contact with Nani he wouldn't have finished the game and he only missed because Nani hopped out of the challenge.

To make the assertion that but for the sending off, Utd would have been beaten cannot be substantiated at all. Whilst it was 11v11 it was 0-1 to Utd after all.
0-3 at half time, Utd made a couple of errors that lead to the first and second goals. Ferdinand is a decent sub now, no better. The Goalkeeping situation isn't sorted out either, but then you don't just replace a VDS overnight as they found out with Schmeichel a few years ago.

It wasn't really a case of City played themselves back in to the game, as Utd allowed them back in to the game.

At 2-3, Ok a couple of nervy moments with the ball bouncing around in the box, but no real threat.

Then there was the Valencia penalty that wasn't given that would have put it out of reach.

I thought it was a bit of a messy game.

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Originally Posted by Danbert Nocurry

The Heathens.....glad to see you're not dwelling on the fact that after being 3-0 up at half-time, you ended up hanging on by the skin of our teeth against 10 men, with baconface out-manoeuvred tactically by Mancini and your star new signing being a player brought out of retirement who gave more balls away than Santa Claus in Christmas week.

If it hadn't been for the very questionable sending off, you'd now be out of the cup. You failed to score and conceded two goals against 10 men in the second half. At times it looked like we had the extra player. If you can't see the writing on the wall for United you are wilfully blind my friend. Tick Tock matey.

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Danbert.. 71 passes made.. 97% complete.. so he gave away 2 passes... and 10 man team doing well.... being hard to score against... pretty much the norm...

"After coming on after 60 mins, Paul Scholes made 71 passes (97% complete), more than any Man City player in the entire game. (Courtesy of OPTA)"

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Originally Posted by IainR

"After coming on after 60 mins, Paul Scholes made 71 passes (97% complete), more than any Man City player in the entire game. (Courtesy of OPTA)"

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That's as maybe but it only takes one bad pass to give the ball away allowing the other side to score. People won't remember the solid performance he put in, they'll remember the cock up that led to the second goal. Well they will do this week anyway.

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Originally Posted by Witton Park

Those that say the sending of is questionable are wrong. Two footed lunge, out of control, off the ground, potential ankle breaking challenge.

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He won the ball cleanly, with one foot, and made no contact with the player. A yellow for dangerous play would probably have been fair.

Maybe it was worth a yellow and a half considering the consequences if Nani’s avoidance technique was not so nimble. A red seemed harsh; the four-match ban Kompany could receive for his second dismissal of the season, appeal pending, even harsher.

The role of United’s players, in pressuring the official into such a defining action was equally unedifying.

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Originally Posted by IainR

Danbert.. 71 passes made.. 97% complete.. so he gave away 2 passes... and 10 man team doing well.... being hard to score against... pretty much the norm...

"After coming on after 60 mins, Paul Scholes made 71 passes (97% complete), more than any Man City player in the entire game. (Courtesy of OPTA)"

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He made an awful lot of very short passes to the nearest player to him Iain and clearly the 3% of passes that went astray caused you problems.

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Originally Posted by Danbert Nocurry

He won the ball cleanly, with one foot, and made no contact with the player. A yellow for dangerous play would probably have been fair.

Maybe it was worth a yellow and a half considering the consequences if Nani’s avoidance technique was not so nimble. A red seemed harsh; the four-match ban Kompany could receive for his second dismissal of the season, appeal pending, even harsher.

The role of United’s players, in pressuring the official into such a defining action was equally unedifying.

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I think that the acknowledgement that it was perhaps worth a yellow and a half says it all - the ref was right ;)

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Originally Posted by Danbert Nocurry

He made an awful lot of very short passes to the nearest player to him Iain and clearly the 3% of passes that went astray caused you problems.

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Well one pass did.. but really a misplaced pass out on the wing should not be a goal.. to blame scholes' pass rather misses the point that defensively and keeper wise we just keep getting caught out.. the foul by Rio on Richards at the end was idiotic..

If refs were more consistent there would be no argument that Kompany was harshly sent off.. the problem is we see so much variability in the level of offences resulting in red or yellow cards..

If you tackle two footed you risk a red.. it doesn't have to cause injury or be a foul, just have the potential to cause injury.. He was off the ground with two feet.. you do that you risk a red.. I'd be genuinely amazed if the FA overturn this one.. its clear as day 2 footed.. studs forward.. lunge.. won the ball.. no contact on the player.. but by the law quite its a red for me..

The only argument is whether or not it could potentially have caused a serious injury.. because that's what the wording for serious foul play implies.. I can't see how you can't say there isn't a risk there..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1wgi...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1wgi...eature=related[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the evidence Iain, clearly a one footed tackle along the ground with the ball taken cleanly with the other foot following in...

Enough of that now, I watched some highlites the other night and realised how lucky young Wayne was. After running in to defenders the ball bounced off the back of his head whilst he was facing away from goal some how allowing the ball to end up in the net. At least he had a second chance to put the ball away in front of the penalty spot, but no it was saved and bounced in front of him for a second attempt and even I couldn't miss from there.....Utd's other goal though was pretty good. :p :) Discuss..

I have no dog in the fight, not really a footie supporter but enjoy the sparring on here!
As a neutral, may I offer the following observations?
1. That was never a sending off offence - seems like a nice conspiracy to give Utd something now that the European Cup and Premiership are beyond their grasp!
2. Yes, I believe that Fergie's time is up, Mancini is the better man. I admire him and his dignity. His managing of the Tevez scenario shows a rare honesty and sensitivity at this level.

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Originally Posted by Wheeze

I have no dog in the fight, not really a footie supporter but enjoy the sparring on here!
As a neutral, may I offer the following observations?
1. That was never a sending off offence - seems like a nice conspiracy to give Utd something now that the European Cup and Premiership are beyond their grasp!
2. Yes, I believe that Fergie's time is up, Mancini is the better man. I admire him and his dignity. His managing of the Tevez scenario shows a rare honesty and sensitivity at this level.

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1. by the laws of the game.. I can't see how you can say 'never' to be honest... basically its shows a bias against United.. most pundits seem to think the ref had little choice, most feel its under the harsh, but Kompany's own doing bracket.. surprisingly its fans of other teams who seem most irked.. most city fans can seem to why it was a red, even if they disagreed with it.. if you go in two footed.. (which only IanDP seems to disagree with.. I suppose for Leeds fans challenges like that were what they were brought up with under Revie.. :-)), you risk a red..

2. Mancini's son refused to play in a game.. the manager let him stay in the club...

I don't think Mancini dealt with Tevez any different that Man Utd have dealt with many in the past.. like United they offered the olive branch and forgave a number of incidents before finally banishing him..

I like Mancini.. but i don't think him and Fergie are different at all.. very similar to Jose.. 'us against them' to the core.. create togetherness.. keen to avoid public disputes with other managers.. the overall boss mentality..

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Originally Posted by IainR

if you go in two footed.. (which only IanDP seems to disagree with.. I suppose for Leeds fans challenges like that were what they were brought up with under Revie.. :-)), you risk a red..

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LOL only keeping the Banter going Iain ;)

They were all hard lads in the 60-70's it's different game now.

You moved yet?

Not what Cloughie thought.... :-)

Not sure when I spoke to you last.. Off to States for 2 months 1st Feb... I don't know why I come on here now as I limit myself to one max 2 fell runs a week now as I'm pretty focussed on a sub 2:40 marathon in the spring.. out in Boston.. so I doubt I'll do any of classic fell races now.. may do things like Snowdon and the 3 peaks as they suit marathon training really..

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Originally Posted by IainR

I doubt I'll do any of classic fell races now.. may do things like Snowdon and the 3 peaks as they suit marathon training really..

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I think I've wandered onto the wrong thread by mistake. Are you saying the 3 Peaks is not a proper fell race?:closed:

By the way, it was never a sending off:wink:

Does anyone think Rooney would've been sent off if he'd make a tackle like that yesterday?

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Originally Posted by oleg beaviz

Does anyone think Rooney would've been sent off if he'd make a tackle like that yesterday?

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Reputation has alot to do with it,did you see that awful challenge Lampard made on Adam Hamill the other week,he only got booked! There needs to be more consistency with the reffing i think.

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Originally Posted by IainR

I like Mancini.. but i don't think him and Fergie are different at all.. very similar to Jose.. 'us against them' to the core.. create togetherness.. keen to avoid public disputes with other managers.. the overall boss mentality..

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To be honest I don't think Mancini was too bothered about us not winning yesterday. First the changes, Kolarov and Pantilimon are in my opinion not players you would start with in a game you are desperate to win. Second the formation, quite defensive (although you could argue a lack of fit strikers forced his hand). Lastly, the post game reaction from Mancini, obviously bothered about losing Vinny but not too concerned about the outcome of the game.

My own feelings are that i would have liked us to have beaten the rags but I don't think the rags will be the eventual winners of the competition....so everything else is just fixture congestion for them.

Come on Henry, your time is now, complete the fairytale, cover for RVP properly.

Absolute magic, now just keep the lead...... Please?????

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Originally Posted by biara

Absolute magic, now just keep the lead...... Please?????

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One nil to the Arsenal!

You'd think Henry had scored the winner in the World Cup Final judging by the reaction and not against our particularly porous Championship defence. Looks like he's put on a bit of timber to me.

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Originally Posted by Danbert Nocurry

To be honest I don't think Mancini was too bothered about us not winning yesterday. First the changes, Kolarov and Pantilimon are in my opinion not players you would start with in a game you are desperate to win..

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I agree with that.. especially in the manner of the defeat.. your second half come back meant no real psychological blow was dealt.. although I think kolorov is fairly regular, but the dropping of Hart meant the team was weaker..

I think this will be just an isolated game with no impact on the league really.. Komany's red card and possible 4 match ban is the main thing..

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Originally Posted by Muddy Retriever

You'd think Henry had scored the winner in the World Cup Final judging by the reaction and not against our particularly porous Championship defence. Looks like he's put on a bit of timber to me.

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I thought it was the second coming or a scene from JC-SuperStar...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/16522642.stm

Interesting.

And what was going on with Balotelli last night? Injured or not arsed? I heard he'd been chatting in the press about going back to Italy. I hope not.

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Originally Posted by Hank

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/16522642.stm

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I tend to agree with Mancini. The Johnson tackle was far worse than Kompany's. Yet more refereeing inconsistency.

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Originally Posted by Muddy Retriever

I tend to agree with Mancini. The Johnson tackle was far worse than Kompany's. Yet more refereeing inconsistency.

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Far worse? Lower challenge.. but at a faster pace.. both made almost no contact..

But I agree.. its inconsistent which is why Kompany was, or him and City feel, harshly done by.. I think ANY two footed challenge should be a red.. by their very nature they have to be lunges as there can be little control as both feet are lunging forwards..

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Originally Posted by IainR

But I agree.. its inconsistent which is why Kompany was, or him and City feel, harshly done by.. I think ANY two footed challenge should be a red.. by their very nature they have to be lunges as there can be little control as both feet are lunging forwards..

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It's a question of timing too though. If your timing is spot on, as Johnson's was, there's no danger to the opposing player. A lot of damage could be done by a miss-timed one-footed challenge. I guess this is where the ref's judgement comes in, or they have to stick to the letter of the law... which is what happened on Sunday. I'd prefer judgement, even though it will inevitably bring about inconsistencies.

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Originally Posted by Hank

It's a question of timing too though. If your timing is spot on, as Johnson's was, there's no danger to the opposing player. A lot of damage could be done by a miss-timed one-footed challenge. I guess this is where the ref's judgement comes in, or they have to stick to the letter of the law... which is what happened on Sunday. I'd prefer judgement, even though it will inevitably bring about inconsistencies.

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Of course, but if you go in one footed you have one leg to divert yourself or provide some control.. 2 footed challenges have little control.. we all have done them.. but I always accepted that a red card was a possibility.. it was a stupid challenge by Johnson as his team were winning 1-0.. but Johnson rarely makes the right choices...

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Originally Posted by IainR

Of course, but if you go in one footed you have one leg to divert yourself or provide some control.. 2 footed challenges have little control.. we all have done them.. but I always accepted that a red card was a possibility.. it was a stupid challenge by Johnson as his team were winning 1-0.. but Johnson rarely makes the right choices...

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I agree that two-footers have the potential to be much worse, but all I'm saying is that it comes down to timing, and if timed well (like Johnson's!) I think it should be legitimate. I do generally think Johnson's more than a bit rum, and the thought of him as England right-back is a little worrying, but he made a corker of a challenge last night in the area on, I think, Aguero.

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Originally Posted by Hank

I do generally think Johnson's more than a bit rum, and the thought of him as England right-back is a little worrying, but he made a corker of a challenge last night in the area on, I think, Aguero.

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he's got all the raw ingredients, pace, power, skill.. he just makes rash challenges at stupid times, makes poor ball choices but also positionally can be atrocious.. on his day he can be superb, but that's too rare..

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Originally Posted by IainR

he just makes rash challenges at stupid times, makes poor ball choices but also positionally can be atrocious..

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Sounds like me in my heyday.

A cracker at the Valley yesterday, 3 goals in the last 5 minutes including an injury time equaliser for us. Never been to Cleckheaton before but visited twice yesterday. First for a couple of pints before the match then back for a curry on the way home