Depression

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Originally Posted by Brotherton Lad

Or her silence means she doesn't wish to discuss these matters in public.

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Hang on. She's on here discussing it.

This thread in equal measure has made me glad to be a part of the community and also very sad and frustrated. A few threads have taken a turn for the worst lately.

My best wishes to both Mountain Goatess and Stagger. If you are ever in or around Sheffield and want to get out for a blast across the peaks and moors please give me a shout.

I sense you just like to bicker.

I agree Simon it seems to be getting nasty as of late.

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Originally Posted by Brotherton Lad

I sense you just like to bicker.

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I do. It stirs the passions. Unlike the people on 'Auntie maggie's remedy,' who have their passions suppressed.

[QUOTE=christopher leigh]I've said on here before that some people DESERVE TO BE DEPRESSED, for all the wrong choices they make. Choices they knew were wrong when they made them. Others feel down for things they have no control over. BUT, giving pills out to people so they never have to deal with personal grief just proves what a bunch of WIMPS we are.

The truth is, life is about ups and downs. You're not supposed to feel good all the time. In fact the dishing out of these happy pills, is the surest way of preventing people from facing their problems, because it produces a sense of achievment in PEOPLE WHO HAVEN'T EARNED IT.

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I am sorry I made the mistake of coming into this thread. I thought it may have some positive and informative comments, not ones that would fill me with doubt and worry about myself and my treatment. I need to be strong to try and get through this successfully and get back to work and my old self. I am not looking for an 'easy' way out CL and I am certainly not a 'wimp'!
I just don't know how you can make the comments you did (ABOVE IN BLOCK CAPITAL) when you know nothing of individual personality, circumstance or situations.
(With reference to the hypothyroidism, I do agree that could cause some depressive symptoms. I would have thought the doctors would rule that out before prescribing treatment. I certainly had tests done to rule out other things.)

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Mr Leigh, I replied to your post above...didn't you read it? Perhaps my further silence is a sign that I do not wish to be part of YOUR debate. You are free to air your opinions and beliefs but some of your comments and views are plain crass.

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Originally Posted by christopher leigh

Hang on I'm just recovering from a 'Judge Judy moment.'

MG has implied by her silence to my question, that she hasn't been tested for thyroid. If that is so the 'trained professionals' haven't done their job properly, by ruling out a legitimate cause.

As I've said before the 'trained professionals' are giving out pills like 'Auntie Maggie's Remedy,' because it pacifies people. Most of these people have no abnormal brain chemistry, yet the pills they're given are designed to manipulate these chemicals, so they feel something artificial.

In other words the pills repress normal grief processes, allowing time to pass without any psychological pain.

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I am making the decesion to not comment further on this thread as try as I might CL you seem unable to digest information presented in a balanced way, ignoring information contrary to your arguments.

[QUOTE=Mountain Goatess;338027][QUOTE=Mountain Goatess;337715]

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Originally Posted by christopher leigh

I've said on here before that some people DESERVE TO BE DEPRESSED, for all the wrong choices they make. Choices they knew were wrong when they made them. Others feel down for things they have no control over. BUT, giving pills out to people so they never have to deal with personal grief just proves what a bunch of WIMPS we are.

The truth is, life is about ups and downs. You're not supposed to feel good all the time. In fact the dishing out of these happy pills, is the surest way of preventing people from facing their problems, because it produces a sense of achievment in PEOPLE WHO HAVEN'T EARNED IT.

Mr Leigh, I replied to your post above...didn't you read it? Perhaps my further silence is a sign that I do not wish to be part of YOUR debate. You are free to air your opinions and beliefs but some of your comments and views are plain crass.

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BUT you've just initiated the debate! Don't you see? I also find it interesting to note, that out of all the things I've said on depression, you chose to be offended by comments made to a specific group of depressive sufferers. Why would you, if you didn't associate yourself with such people?

I find that lack of running or not being able to run through injury is really detrimental to my mental health, mondays are the worse and yesterday was pretty grim. This is why i end up out running when i've got sprained ankles like i have because i just need to buy a little time, doing the chevin last week probably put me back a week or so but it hit the spot mentally. Cycling just isn't the same and there's only so much weight training you can do. I think things are about to get worse as my physio is talking about stopping me running to see if it helps my knee issues, i don't think it'll help significantly based on past experience and i might have to either refuse point blank or give up on physio completely to avoid another dip. Trying times but i've just got to try and man it and try not to hate myself too much.

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Originally Posted by freckle

I am making the decesion to not comment further on this thread as try as I might CL you seem unable to digest information presented in a balanced way, ignoring information contrary to your arguments.

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I nearly fell off my chair, I was laughing so much. Look,instead of being moody feely, why don't you tell me exactly what you don't agree with and why?

Oh sorry you're not going to comment further.

Right I'm off.

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Originally Posted by TheGrump

This thread now encapsulates everything that can make the Forum a waste of space and time, and pointless debate.
The original purpose and bravery in starting the thread seems to have been forgotten.
Enough is enough - imho of course.

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Hear, hear! x

CL, if you go back to the start of this thread you'll see that it was started by a forumite asking us, other forumites, for help or advice on depression. It was not a request for opinions on mental health treatment from uninformed people or bickering and personal insults

Several health professionals have offered help in good faith along with forumites with either first hand experience of depression, or those simply wanting to pass on their good wishes to a popular and valued member of the fell running community. A good bloke who is obviously having a difficult time at present

If you want to bicker or debate I suggest you start a fresh thread in the usual place

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Originally Posted by christopher leigh

I've said on here before that some people deserve to be depressed, for all the wrong choices they make. Choices they knew were wrong when they made them. Others feel down for things they have no control over. BUT, giving pills out to people so they never have to deal with personal grief just proves what a bunch of wimps we are.

The truth is, life is about ups and downs. You're not supposed to feel good all the time. In fact the dishing out of these happy pills, is the surest way of preventing people from facing their problems, because it produces a sense of achievment in people who haven't earned it.

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I've been biting my lip on this one but missed this comment..... unbelievable!

Firstly, Stagger I'm so sorry about what you're going through and that your thread has been hijacked in this way. I suffer from intermittent bouts of depression myself, much fewer since fleeing London, but the "Black Dog" still occasionally pays me a visit. For me, seeing a counsellor with my wife, being taught practical coping strategies and how to recognise the signs of a bout coming on has been invaluable. However, there are so many different types, degrees of and causes of the illness that qualified professional advice and diagnosis is essential. There's nothing worse than being told to "buck up", "snap out of it" or "chin up" as this just worsens the feelings of helplessness and inadequacy.

CL, you started off quite sensibly stressing the importance of exploring possible physiological causes but this post is crass, insensitive, patronising, ill-informed and incorrect on so many levels. No-one deserves to be depressed. If you'd ever suffered from genuine clinical depression you wouldn't wish it on your worst enemy. Depression is not feeling down or sad, it's a crushing, energy sapping and all encompassing blackness from which, at the time, there feels as though there's no escape. Yes, life is about ups and downs, but that has nothing to do with depression. You're not supposed to feel good all the time but depression is not about not feeling good and no-one should have to suffer it alone, undiagnosed or untreated.

I agree to a certain extent that some GP's have probably been guilty of too readily dishing out anti-depressants but the fact is that, for many sufferers of the illness, without these pills they wouldn't be able to physically and psychologically function. Many cases of depression have no external cues and are due completely to a imbalance of brain chemistry. A pharmaceutical approach is the only solution in these cases and is no different, or more wimpy, to taking an aspirin for a headache.

Dishing out your uninformed advice, opinions and purposely inflammatory posts on Sports Science, politics or economics is fine but this wasn't the thread for it.

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Originally Posted by Derby Tup

CL, if you go back to the start of this thread you'll see that it was started by a forumite asking us, other forumites, for help or advice on depression. It was not a request for opinions on mental health treatment from uninformed people or bickering and personal insults

Several health professionals have offered help in good faith along with forumites with either first hand experience of depression, or those simply wanting to pass on their good wishes to a popular and valued member of the fell running community. A good bloke who is obviously having a difficult time at present

If you want to bicker or debate I suggest you start a fresh thread in the usual place

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When stagger started this thread he didn't give specifics. So all I've done is explored the various causes, including depression caused by making the wrong choices.

The rest of the comments dished out by others on here, are enough to make anyone feel depressed, because they don't contain the truth. All this 'we love you Stagger' isn't going to help him, he wants ideas to identify his problem.

If we're going to omit the possibility of a person having depression due to their actions, then we aren't helping anyone. All we're doing is sucking up to people with 'Auntie Maggie's remedy.'

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Originally Posted by nikalas

I've been biting my lip on this one but missed this comment..... unbelievable!

Firstly, Stagger I'm so sorry about what you're going through and that your thread has been hijacked in this way. I suffer from intermittent bouts of depression myself, much fewer since fleeing London, but the "Black Dog" still occasionally pays me a visit. For me, seeing a counsellor with my wife, being taught practical coping strategies and how to recognise the signs of a bout coming on has been invaluable. However, there are so many different types, degrees of and causes of the illness that qualified professional advice and diagnosis is essential. There's nothing worse than being told to "buck up", "snap out of it" or "chin up" as this just worsens the feelings of helplessness and inadequacy.

CL, you started off quite sensibly stressing the importance of exploring possible physiological causes but this post is crass, insensitive, patronising, ill-informed and incorrect on so many levels. No-one deserves to be depressed. If you'd ever suffered from genuine clinical depression you wouldn't wish it on your worst enemy. Depression is not feeling down or sad, it's a crushing, energy sapping and all encompassing blackness from which, at the time, there feels as though there's no escape. Yes, life is about ups and downs, but that has nothing to do with depression. You're not supposed to feel good all the time but depression is not about not feeling good and no-one should have to suffer it alone, undiagnosed or untreated.

I agree to a certain extent that some GP's have probably been guilty of too readily dishing out anti-depressants but the fact is that, for many sufferers of the illness, without these pills they wouldn't be able to physically and psychologically function. Many cases of depression have no external cues and are due completely to a imbalance of brain chemistry. A pharmaceutical approach is the only solution in these cases and is no different, or more wimpy, to taking an aspirin for a headache.

Dishing out your uninformed advice, opinions and purposely inflammatory posts on Sports Science, politics or economics is fine but this wasn't the thread for it.

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Last time I read, Ian Huntley was being given Antidepressants in jail. With a conscience like his, knowing that would be of no surprise. Would you say he didn't deserve to be depressed?

Granted no-one can be as much of a low-life as Huntley, but don't you know when it's time to stop CL? (or at least follow DT's advice and bicker elsewhere!!)

Hi Stagger

This thread caught my eye as I am a manager of primary care mental health services within the City of Nottingham. In Nottingham (and infact across the whole of england within the past two years) we have been developing IAPT services. basically IAPT stands for "Improving Access to Psychological Therapies". This is a new concept in providong psychological therapies on a much wider basis at a primary care level, eg no psychiatrists or medication are involved. Instead in Nottingham we have employed 70 new Cognitive behavioural therpists, Psychologists and counsellors who provide a course of therapy for people with mild to moderate depression or anxiety either face to face or more frequently we provide guided support via computerised CBT packages. Access is directly via GP or self referral and waiting lists are short. As a national agenda under the last government IAPT exists across the country and there should be a service near you. We also have employment support services too to help people who are off work with stress or depression or are clinging on to their jobs for dear life. Again this should be available to you. i know getting out, not isolating yourself and doing exersize are key components in managing mental health issues. obviously not knowing anything about your level of depression I couldnt and wouldnt want to make any medical recommendations on a forum, but we are finding in Nottingham that with IAPT now up and running, that GP's are referring people to us earlier and are thus avoiding commencing people on anti depressant meds, or are referring people to us for much needed talking treatments previously unavailable at a GP level. We are also finding people who previously would have been referred to a secondary MH service and psychiatrist are more appropriately being referred to IAPT. I should explore locally your IAPT arrangements and see if they can accept self referral, or revisit your GP. Hopefully you will recieve some help in a far less medicalised way than previously. Good luck to you.

[COUNTS TO TEN VERY SLOWLY AND DRAWS BREATH]

Now...before any of this gets any more out of hand...I am more than happy to be open and honest about my depression, and if only one part of my original post in response to Stagger's request for assistance does him and his mood some good then that has to be a GOOD THING.

How are you doing Stagger?

Chin up Trev and get yourself down to hebden bridge...me poncing around in long socks and pink gloves will give you summat to smile about

I've just come across someone called Dorothy Rowe who was interviewed in The Guardian (had to buy it because all the Daily Mails had gone) and what she says seems to make a lot of sense and I would guess that it could be a lot of help. She has a website http://www.dorothyrowe.com.au/

another link: http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2010...-in-psychology

Stagger, http://forum.fellrunner.org.uk/showt...th-and-running!! Some of us discussed similar issues a couple of years ago. There might be something there that strikes a chord?

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Originally Posted by Grouse

I've just come across someone called Dorothy Rowe who was interviewed in The Guardian (had to buy it because all the Daily Mails had gone) and what she says seems to make a lot of sense and I would guess that it could be a lot of help. She has a website http://www.dorothyrowe.com.au/

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I think it takes a lot of guts to admit you read the daily mail, I am sure you can kick it if you keep trying - we are all here for you grouse.

Yeah, come on Grouse, keep yer pecker up. :)

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Originally Posted by Al Fowler

How are you doing Stagger?

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Thanks to everyone who has posted on this thread or PM'ed me.

It has been like a weight off my shoulders and since the original post the advice and ability to talk about it has help enormously. I have felt great since the post and long may it continue. All I need now is a little more focus to lose some weight and train more.

Thanks again
Trev

Champion, as my dear old grandad would have said.

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Originally Posted by Stagger

Thanks to everyone who has posted on this thread or PM'ed me.

It has been like a weight off my shoulders and since the original post the advice and ability to talk about it has help enormously. I have felt great since the post and long may it continue. All I need now is a little more focus to lose some weight and train more.

Thanks again
Trev

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Great news mate, and may you continue to feel great for good. Share on here and folk will care ;-)

Thats great to hear Trevor, thanks for letting us know. Good to hear also that this thread & the various posts were useful, I wasnt sure at one stage. + reminds me that I also need to focus, lose some weight & train more!

Onwards and sideways, but never backwards...

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Originally Posted by duncs

Onwards and sideways, but never backwards...

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Like that duncs ;-)

Don't forget upwards as well:)

tough one to crack, but it can be managed. do you know why i left our place of work? yes, it got me. it's not that we are soft or nutty, it's much harder to put a handle on it, why it has affected us and why us? the biggest problem was the undo able job and the ineffectual management and there lack of acknowledgement of the crap going on, hell they couldn't run a bath. i find that i have to go running, this is my medicine. without it i soon find my black moods descending. i know we have taken the piss out of each other in the past, but if there is anything i can do, just yell! i'm sure a run out with me and lofty would give you a lift, if you can go as slow as me! it will take time to find your own ways of trying to manage this, but things can get better. try and find a bright side to look at! Pete.

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Originally Posted by haworth hobbler

i find that i have to go running, this is my medicine. without it i soon find my black moods descending

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I know how that feels, i've consistently run through chronic injury all year in the name of sanity...pardon the Meldrew speak. I'm currently on a break of 5wks and i know the cracks are going to come at some stage, i've a feeling my ankles are going to need longer though, could be tough and i may have to hand my notice in at work if something needs to give.

I haven't read the whole thread but apropos I always remember an old guy who cheered me up once when I was feeling a little bit down in the dumps. I wouldn't say that I've ever had depression but I've my grey days and I've had many exasperating times. Anyway this was the time when I'd just had my knee operation about 15 years ago and I was walking on the moors as part of my recovery and wondering about life, the universe and everything and if I'd ever get fit enough to run again etc., etc..
Back in the pub at the bottom of the hill I met an old guy aged about 80 or 85. He had his fishing rods with him. "Been running?" he asked. And I explained that I'd only been walking. "I used to run, " he continued. "Got too old for that, so I took up cycling. Got too old for cycling so next thing I took up walking. Got to old to walk so lately I've took up fishing. And when I'm too old for fishing, well then I'll think of something else."
I always remember those wise words. Now that I'm injured yet again I've got myself a couple of Nordic Walking sticks. And, what the hell, I'm enjoying the new challenges, the new experiences, tripping over the sticks, seeing the children laugh at me. "So it goes," as Kurt Vonnegut would say.

Hope this little anecdote helps someone somewhere.

Ta. Keep on keeping on.

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Originally Posted by Stagger

All I need now is a little more focus to lose some weight and train more.

Thanks again
Trev

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Well my friend you have seen me naked, no way can you look as bad as me, well done pal keep it up, and don't forget to thank Mrs Stagger, i have no doubt that she has helped you. xxx

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Originally Posted by woodlander

I haven't read the whole thread but apropos I always remember an old guy who cheered me up once when I was feeling a little bit down in the dumps. I wouldn't say that I've ever had depression but I've my grey days and I've had many exasperating times. Anyway this was the time when I'd just had my knee operation about 15 years ago and I was walking on the moors as part of my recovery and wondering about life, the universe and everything and if I'd ever get fit enough to run again etc., etc..
Back in the pub at the bottom of the hill I met an old guy aged about 80 or 85. He had his fishing rods with him. "Been running?" he asked. And I explained that I'd only been walking. "I used to run, " he continued. "Got too old for that, so I took up cycling. Got too old for cycling so next thing I took up walking. Got to old to walk so lately I've took up fishing. And when I'm too old for fishing, well then I'll think of something else."
I always remember those wise words. Now that I'm injured yet again I've got myself a couple of Nordic Walking sticks. And, what the hell, I'm enjoying the new challenges, the new experiences, tripping over the sticks, seeing the children laugh at me. "So it goes," as Kurt Vonnegut would say.

Hope this little anecdote helps someone somewhere.

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i love this story brilliant! thank you

Hi Staggers,

If you read the post i added, your see why i have been depressed.

What i have been taking is a tablet called 5HTP 50mg, i take it before bed, and it helps me sleep, also the morning later i feel more chilled, and, for me which is a bonus, its lost my appetite LOL!

Id, advise you to maybe look it up on google, and at moment H&B has a special price, sommat like buy one and get 2nd half price.

There is a video about it.... Here

I was told about these tablets by the consultant i saw for Fibromalgia, he told me that they have been a hit with alot of his patients for depression. One of my friends who i would never have thought she would take these type of tablets is on them, shes the type who never looks anxious, and shes been on them for 6 months.

The best for me if it helps me curb my appetite LOL!

I hope you are feeling better, big hugs xx (and from a cuddly lass thats got to make you laugh!) xx

Depression is a dangerous disease. But it is not a end of life. There are so many ways to overcoming depression.

1. Consult the best medical doctor.

2. Do not take more stress

3. Listen your favourite music.

4. Eat medicine regularly.

5. Sleep well.

6. Family support.

7. Develope new friendship and Relationship.

8. Holiday with your family.

And don't forget the dictionary and Fowler's Guide to the Use of the English Language.

I was listening to the issue of anti depressants yesterday on talk sport ( Mike Parry and someone else). The issue was the prescribing of them.
Now driving up the A1 I listened as these two tried to draw the line between unhappy and genuinely depressed and how in the past over the years doctors have been slaughtered for just handing them out like sweets. Clearly its a very difficult area for a GP and not an easy decision to make. My own personal experience of the NHS and medication towards depression has been good.
I did smile though when they tried to sway the people ringing in to say if they should ever have been prescribed them in the first place.
The problem was they had callers on that had say taken meds 6/7 years ago and where now okay but where saying that it took them 2 years to come off them. The two presenters were classing this as addiction. God that wound me up so much!!!!!!.

One thing that I dont think people realise is the nature of how anti depressants work and how long you could potentially be on them. Its difficult for a GP to explain this to a patient who has come into the practice and is very very depressed. You are instantly assesed and its like a rollercoaster ride.
GPs have 7 mins per person