High Heart Rate - 226 BPM ???

Got up at 5am to an episode of palpitations. Felt dreadful at first, but eventually walked gingerly down to A&E for an ECG (ECG during an attack needed by consultant to diagnose what is going on with my heart). A&E was full of clubbers from the night before, hefty lasses wearing small amounts of flimsy clothing and 6" heels obviously feeling very ill. What with them and accidents on the ice, everyone was extremely busy. So I waited ... and waited. I was worried that by the time I got my ECG my HR would have subsided, but rather worryingly it stayed right up for a long while. Curiously, the ECG seemed to be therapeutic - after that my HR did soon come right down and I was let go after a repeat ECG. They concluded that I do have A-fib, not good news, and say they will be writing to my consultant and my GP. In my experience hospitals SAY they will contact GPs but often don't.

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Originally Posted by Alexandra

Got up at 5am to an episode of palpitations. Felt dreadful at first, but eventually walked gingerly down to A&E for an ECG (ECG during an attack needed by consultant to diagnose what is going on with my heart). A&E was full of clubbers from the night before, hefty lasses wearing small amounts of flimsy clothing and 6" heels obviously feeling very ill. What with them and accidents on the ice, everyone was extremely busy. So I waited ... and waited. I was worried that by the time I got my ECG my HR would have subsided, but rather worryingly it stayed right up for a long while. Curiously, the ECG seemed to be therapeutic - after that my HR did soon come right down and I was let go after a repeat ECG. They concluded that I do have A-fib, not good news, and say they will be writing to my consultant and my GP. In my experience hospitals SAY they will contact GPs but often don't.

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sorry to hear that Alex

my hospital sent all my info to the my doctors, well actually they sent it to my old doctors from 15 years ago despite having been to hospital a few times for minor things

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Originally Posted by IanDarkpeak

sorry to hear that Alex

my hospital sent all my info to the my doctors, well actually they sent it to my old doctors from 15 years ago despite having been to hospital a few times for minor things

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Thanks, Ian. My stay in A&E has not improved my confidence in the efficiency of the NHS. Of course they were terribly over-worked, but despite their having on their computer screens a complete list of all patients from the moment they were admitted, with constantly updated waiting times for them all, they managed to overlook a family with a crying toddler and keep them waiting about 3 hours, in the face of increasingly furious protests from the father. My visit would have been much easier if they had just told me each time they left me to wait, roughly how long the wait would be and what I was waiting for. I got told off for looking at the computer screen in my cubicle which showed the waiting times and other info - but if they had better guidelines for communicating with patients I would not have needed to.

Latest installment of my heart condition.

The specialist changed his mind and decided against the Adenosine stress test to check the electrical pathways. He also decided not to go for any Angioplast etc as he doesn't think the risks out way the benefits, his figures give a 45% success rate with 53% showing no discernable improvement, the 2% wasn't worth thinking about, 1:50 are not odds I would want to play with unless neccessary.

Instead I went for another ECG resting heart rate was 41! despite walking a flight of stairs to get to the right room. I've also got to wear a 7 day heart rate monitor but there wasn't available for 6 weeks. Another appointment booked for the Friday before the BG dinner.

His words were go out and enjoy life but I may have to ease back abit in 10-15 years, I don't think I'll last that long ;)

He also talked again about the medical study with the Finnish Xcountry endurance skiers and how endurance athletes have 6x more chance of having AF but have a much higher life expectancy than the control goup.

so no real new news but it is sort of good news:)

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Originally Posted by IanDarkpeak

Latest installment of my heart condition. ..... so no real new news but it is sort of good news:)

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Well, I'm glad it was at least sort of good news, though I did feel a bit worried when you said you didn't expect to last til 60. I trust that was tongue in cheek. I expect all of us on this Forum to last to at least 100.

Because my A-fib kicks in always first thing in the morning on waking and never during exercise or later in the day (thank goodness) I suspected it might be triggered by sleep apnoeia. I put this to my GP,who rubbished it on the grounds that over-weight people have a tendency to sleep apnoeia, I am not over-weight, therefore I can't have it. Spot the famous fallacy! Actually, according to the internet, sa is increasingly common with ageing and can be implicated in a-fib.

When I next saw my specialist, he actually ASKED ME!!! what I thought might be a cause (is this a first?) and he jumped at the idea of sa. I was referred to a sleep clinic. There I had to fill in a questionnaire with lots of questions I couldn't answer eg Do I fall asleep while watching TV? (don't have one) or while driving (don't have a car).

I was issued with a sort of electronic octopus of tangled wires which I had to put on at night and sleep in. Well, with three elastic bands round my body sprouting wires to a plastic box and also to spikes that went up my nose and to a clip on my finger, you will not be surprised that I only managed to sleep about 4.5 hours. I thought the whole test was a write-off, but weeks later I heard from my specialist to say that signs had been detected COMPATIBLE WITH sleep apnoeia. (Is it that they really aren't sure, or is it "don't alarm the patient"-speak?) So it's back to the sleep clinic to see a chest specialist next. Meanwhile, I haven't had a proper attack since before Xmas, though I suspect minor things happen while I am asleep.

So I think for me too the news is sort of good.

i am seeing the doctor in the morning as i have had some high readings out running but OK when cycling.
would like to think it is a faulty monitor but not run for a week waiting for tomorrows appointment just to be sure.
only had my garmin 310 since xmas so would not think it was a battery (assuming there is a battery in the chest strap?)

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Originally Posted by geronimo

i am seeing the doctor in the morning as i have had some high readings out running but OK when cycling.
would like to think it is a faulty monitor but not run for a week waiting for tomorrows appointment just to be sure.
only had my garmin 310 since xmas so would not think it was a battery (assuming there is a battery in the chest strap?)

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Try running with a cotton tee shirt. I had problems with static from clothing which caused false high reading. Test it by wearing the HRM and normal running top and rub the shirt near the receiver to see if the heart rate increases on the HRM.

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Originally Posted by IanDarkpeak

Latest installment of my heart condition.

The specialist changed his mind and decided against the Adenosine stress test to check the electrical pathways. He also decided not to go for any Angioplast etc as he doesn't think the risks out way the benefits, his figures give a 45% success rate with 53% showing no discernable improvement, the 2% wasn't worth thinking about, 1:50 are not odds I would want to play with unless neccessary.

Instead I went for another ECG resting heart rate was 41! despite walking a flight of stairs to get to the right room. I've also got to wear a 7 day heart rate monitor but there wasn't available for 6 weeks. Another appointment booked for the Friday before the BG dinner.

His words were go out and enjoy life but I may have to ease back abit in 10-15 years, I don't think I'll last that long ;)

He also talked again about the medical study with the Finnish Xcountry endurance skiers and how endurance athletes have 6x more chance of having AF but have a much higher life expectancy than the control goup.

so no real new news but it is sort of good news:)

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More updates...

this time maybe not so good, Had another little episode of AF whilst coming off the Ben Saturday morning. took a few hours to return to rythm but it was no where near as bad as last time. I was dropped off in Threkeld on the way down whilst the rest of the group continued on. Thanks to SteverS who put me up in his cottage at short notice and then drove me back to Sheffield Yesterday.

sounds bad ian i hope you get to the bottom of the problem soon.

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Originally Posted by fellrunnerreuben

sounds bad ian i hope you get to the bottom of the problem soon.

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we know whats causing it, it was hoped it was a freak aberation. it's just a case of what we do about it. drugs are out, (I'm too fit)! operation on the heart is a possible last resort? or I can go on managing it my self and hope I don't have a bad one.
Whats difficult is the confidence issue to dissapear in to the hills for a day(or 2) by myself and not be worried by the fact it may strike again.

that is a problem, i guess the only thing to do for now is to either run with a willing partner or make sure your within a safe distance of home. if the operation is the only resort left and its not to dangerous i guess you will have to go for it. i hope you do manage to get it sorted and back to full fitness quickly.

That confidence thing is the hardest part, it was (is) for me, but after the first ablation, the surgeon said mechanically everything is fine, keep exercising and don't worry, if AF recurrs you know what to do. The next hardest thing to do was to raise my heartrate under stress - will it come back down on its own? It does! I go for another check to the Freeman next month, I bet Carlisle still haven't got the right results from my seven day tape.......back in October, although the results of someone elses test in September looked OK!

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Originally Posted by IanDarkpeak

Latest installment of my heart condition.



I went for another ECG resting heart rate was 41! despite walking a flight of stairs to get to the right room. I've also got to wear a 7 day heart rate monitor but there wasn't available for 6 weeks. Another appointment booked for the Friday before the BG dinner.

His words were go out and enjoy life but I may have to ease back abit in 10-15 years, I don't think I'll last that long ;)

He also talked again about the medical study with the Finnish Xcountry endurance skiers and how endurance athletes have 6x more chance of having AF but have a much higher life expectancy than the control goup.

so no real new news but it is sort of good news:)

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next installment tomorrow. Off for my check up at the cardiac clinic, despite being told that the heart rate monitor would be 6 weeks away in April it's still not materialized.

No more episodes at all, mileage right back up and running hard again.

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Originally Posted by IanDarkpeak

next installment tomorrow. Off for my check up at the cardiac clinic, despite being told that the heart rate monitor would be 6 weeks away in April it's still not materialized.

No more episodes at all, mileage right back up and running hard again.

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Still non the wiser, but no more episodes, feel good, so unless or when I have another episode the doctor has written me off.... sorry I mean discharged me.

He felt that unless I have repeat occurances then any work they do will be to the detrement of my general well being so he's put off any ops etc :))

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Originally Posted by IanDarkpeak

Still non the wiser, but no more episodes, feel good, so unless or when I have another episode the doctor has written me off.... sorry I mean discharged me.

He felt that unless I have repeat occurances then any work they do will be to the detrement of my general well being so he's put off any ops etc :))

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So don't you get the heart rate monitor after all? It all sounds sort of good news - I certainly agree that we are best off with the minimum of medical interventions.

I had 2 episodes of my paroxysmal AF in August, only 12 days apart. During the 2nd I fainted and crashed to the floor in my own bathroom, giving myself a black eye and badly bruised face in the process. As I was due to fly to France for 3 weeks' stay in a remote mountain village in 2 days time, this was worrying. However, I went regardless (against advice) and all was well - indeed I have not had an attack since. The worst of it was that many people in the Val d'Allos think of me as the mad reckless englishwoman who insists on walking alone in the mountains - so I had to keep explaining that, no, their predictions had not come true, I had not fallen off a cliff or been attacked by a mad shepherd (mad sheep-dog would be quite likely) but come to grief CHEZ MOI, IN ENGLAND.

I have a checkup on Thursday, and I fear they are going to suggest Warfarin and daily prophylactic beta blockers. Unless something really bad happens between now and then I shall resist both suggestions - I might almost say, to the death!

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Originally Posted by IanDarkpeak

Still non the wiser, but no more episodes, feel good, so unless or when I have another episode the doctor has written me off.... sorry I mean discharged me.

He felt that unless I have repeat occurances then any work they do will be to the detrement of my general well being so he's put off any ops etc :))

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Sounds like a shoddy GP to me. Are you taking notes HEATHENS?
Pester til you find out what you need to Ian.

xx

KK

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Originally Posted by Keswick_Krumble

Sounds like a shoddy GP to me. Are you taking notes HEATHENS?
Pester til you find out what you need to Ian.

xx

KK

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I don't think I mentioned a GP, The Doctor(a generic term I perhaps innocently used) in question is infact the Chief Resident at the Cardiology Dept of the Hospital.

Read though the above posts and you will see that they have performed many scans and tests all have proved inconclusive to what cused the AF (WPW aside) In many cases the trigger is never found and only by drugs or ablation(surgery) etc can a treatment be given, in many cases although this "may" improve the patients heart problem it can have a significantly detrimental effect on your general health. I've had at least 3 HR monitors fitted with no obvious problems found, (Not even the WPW) which is what the last HR monitor was all about.

The "Doctor" also said he wished he was as fit as me and that my overall fittness made my prognosis far superior to the average man in the street!
He's also now offered to sign any "Doctors medical forms" so I can race over sea's.

He's added that at any time I'm worried or there is another occurance I can call his office for an immediate appointment.

I'm quite happy with that. :)

IDP xx

Good news Ian. :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by BritNick

Good news Ian. :thumbup:

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Agree, onwards and upwards Ian:wink:

That'll be a case of one up and one down..........so glad you've got back to full hard training/racing (you just can't hold a good tigger down!) Ian, I've just done the reverse. 14 months of being clear and in the process of getting running fit again, It only took about 20 metres of running with the beagles and I knew I'd tripped into AF on Friday afternoon. Tried everything I could to get back into gear, still went out for a pre-arranged dinner with friends, but eventually had to give in to the constant resting pulse of 130. Ambulance service (crewed by one of my cycling buddies), Carlisle A&E and the cardiology unit were brilliant. A couple of drug tests, mechanical bits checked then straight in to be 'zapped', pulse back to 44, back home Saturday afternoon...........knackered! Now its back to recovering energy and then daring to raise the pulse up to see if it comes down again. So I daresay I'll be back to the Freeman in Newcastle in the not too distant future. Could aim for last place at Dunnerdale, as a comeback run?
Alexandra, how did it go earlier this month? Did you manage to fight off the warfarin and beta blockers?

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Originally Posted by Chris K

Ian, I've just done the reverse. 14 months of being clear and in the process of getting running fit again, It only took about 20 metres of running with the beagles and I knew I'd tripped into AF on Friday afternoon.

Alexandra, how did it go earlier this month? Did you manage to fight off the warfarin and beta blockers?

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Chris, I'm really sorry to hear about your "incident". I'm so grateful that my sort of AF almost always happens in the middle of the night or early morning, so that I wake up in trepidation, check to feel if my pulse is irregular, and if not, get up VERY CAUTIOUSLY. If I can get as far as breakfast without problems, I'm probably in the clear all day. The sort that is triggered by effort must be heart breaking - on the edge of a precipice the whole time.

Well, I went off to France as planned on 1st September, against the advice of the specialist nurse, did lots of strenuous stuff at altitude and have had no further problems to date. I saw my specialist recently for a checkup, and was delighted to find that he was not particularly impressed by my fainting fit (maybe he'd have reacted differently if he had seen my black eye). He was more worried about the fact that I've had 7 incidents in 2011 - far more than ever before. He wants me to try Flecainide next attack, in hospital, and then go onto it daily. From the way he spoke, he would only recommend Warfarin if I had continuous AF. Flecainide works to stabilise the heart rate rather than lower it like Beta blockers. I'm still hoping to use it as a "pill in the pocket" rather than take it all the time, but it all depends how often I have attacks in the future. Of course I am racking my brains trying to work out exactly what triggers them so I can avoid it. There are links to changing position, especially from horizontal to vertical, going to the loo and slow heart rate. Also to sleep apnoea. I am getting a responding splint to stop the latter.

It's very odd, isn't it - one feels fine and yet any day it can strike again. When I'm not having an attack I can't believe I'll ever have another. However, I was reassured by the fact that recently, running a 10 mile race, I sustained an average HR of 150 for 2hrs 5 minutes without feeling distressed. So the incidents have neither damaged my heart, nor are they as shocking for my heart as they might be were I an inactive person.

Did they try Flecainide on you other times before resorting to zapping?

Finally, this has taught me that, helpful as Nurse Specialists are, they are not Consultants and don't know as much. If I had heeded the advice I got from the Nurse Specialist I would have sacrificed my wonderful holiday - for nothing.

Good luck!

Can't find any links to my episodes, but they have all had a constant rate, usually higher than this one. Yes I tried Flecainide (I have it written down as Fleccanide?), I think in 2005, but didn't feel quite like myself running so (with consultation) stopped after a couple of months, and felt much better. I also had a spell with Warfarin, but so pleased to drop that as it was a nightmare trying to stop small scratches (I work mostly outdoors) from bleeding! Asprin is not so bad.
Staying active is what I do too, though must admit my walk today was very steady, I always feel as though I've a couple of marathons in my legs after zapping and felt no desire to run or cycle today!

I wasn't sure either of the spelling of Flecainide, but that's how Wikipedia spells it. I suspected taking it regularly would have side-effects, and shall resist this as long as possible - but if the attacks become too frequent I may have to give in. I'm hoping to take it just as a one-off zapper.

I think our maladies are very different. However, I too feel fairly rubbish after an incident, and even worse after taking just 5mg of Betablocker, which I am told is a very low dose. The day after taking it my HR is stuck at 77, which means I can't do any meaningful exercise, I get out of breath walking up the stairs. And the day after that is nearly as bad. So every attack takes 3 days out of my exercising life, except that I can do weight training, which cheers me up.

Interesting that you get a constant HR. I get a wildly fluctuating one. I take Omega 3 fish oil and eat oily fish to thin my blood a bit, as I am terrified of strokes. I monitor my intake and side effects and when eg I started getting nosebleeds I cut back a bit. I can't take aspirin as I have digestive problems (AS WELL!!!) It's very interesting to compare notes. You have been living with this for longer than me - I started in 2005 with one incident where out of the blue my HR went up to 200. You can imagine how alarmed I was, but the GP I saw told me to go home and stop fussing!

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Originally Posted by Chris K

That'll be a case of one up and one down..........so glad you've got back to full hard training/racing (you just can't hold a good tigger down!) Ian, I've just done the reverse. 14 months of being clear and in the process of getting running fit again, It only took about 20 metres of running with the beagles and I knew I'd tripped into AF on Friday afternoon. Tried everything I could to get back into gear, still went out for a pre-arranged dinner with friends, but eventually had to give in to the constant resting pulse of 130. Ambulance service (crewed by one of my cycling buddies), Carlisle A&E and the cardiology unit were brilliant. A couple of drug tests, mechanical bits checked then straight in to be 'zapped', pulse back to 44, back home Saturday afternoon...........knackered! Now its back to recovering energy and then daring to raise the pulse up to see if it comes down again. So I daresay I'll be back to the Freeman in Newcastle in the not too distant future. Could aim for last place at Dunnerdale, as a comeback run?
Alexandra, how did it go earlier this month? Did you manage to fight off the warfarin and beta blockers?

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Sorry to hear this Chris, It's not good to hear.

I got zapped by an electric fence today, quite a shock I can tell you but luckily it didn't trigger any thing. Hope you can get it sorted

Electric fence Ian..........I should have tried that one before going to Carlisle! Yes I'm gutted, but I'm looking forward already.
Alexandra, mine goes back to 1997, beta blockers have always been 'offered' as a treatment, but there is no way you can exercise properly with it in your system. Flec (whatever!) I think would be less intrusive and with your irregular AF could be a better alternative. But for all of us, it seems the level of fitness helps us recover more quickly?

Well, with a couple of good long training rides in, and heart rate good and stable, I've entered a sportive bike ride this weekend. Hope everyone else is 'behaving' at the moment!

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Originally Posted by Alexandra

I wasn't sure either of the spelling of Flecainide, but that's how Wikipedia spells it. I suspected taking it regularly would have side-effects, and shall resist this as long as possible - but if the attacks become too frequent I may have to give in. I'm hoping to take it just as a one-off zapper.

I think our maladies are very different. However, I too feel fairly rubbish after an incident, and even worse after taking just 5mg of Betablocker, which I am told is a very low dose. The day after taking it my HR is stuck at 77, which means I can't do any meaningful exercise, I get out of breath walking up the stairs. And the day after that is nearly as bad. So every attack takes 3 days out of my exercising life, except that I can do weight training, which cheers me up.

Interesting that you get a constant HR. I get a wildly fluctuating one. I take Omega 3 fish oil and eat oily fish to thin my blood a bit, as I am terrified of strokes. I monitor my intake and side effects and when eg I started getting nosebleeds I cut back a bit. I can't take aspirin as I have digestive problems (AS WELL!!!) It's very interesting to compare notes. You have been living with this for longer than me - I started in 2005 with one incident where out of the blue my HR went up to 200. You can imagine how alarmed I was, but the GP I saw told me to go home and stop fussing!

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So 5mg of a beta blocker - presumably bisoprolol - takes several days to get out of your system - interesting.

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Originally Posted by Chris K

Well, with a couple of good long training rides in, and heart rate good and stable, I've entered a sportive bike ride this weekend. Hope everyone else is 'behaving' at the moment!

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WHAT good news, Chris! What procedure precisely did they do when they zapped you? Having had 7 episodes in 8 months in 2011, the last 2 worryingly close together, I have now managed September & October without any. Long may it last! This demonstrates how unpredictable the problem is, and how hard it would be to evaluate any treatment. If I had been put on regular prophylactic beta blockers or Flecainaide the medics might now be claiming that the treatment was a success.

I listen regularly to a running podcast from the US, "Lost Trailrunner" and in the latest episode Ron discusses his AF. His cardiologist has put him on regular beta blockers, he doesn't mention the dose, and he reckons he is now running 1 minute per mile slower as a result (down from c. 8 minute miles to c.9, if I remember correctly). Thinking about his plight has made me appreciate the NHS - my cardiologist can happily talk of getting me into hospital for a transfusion of Flecainide, Chris could get zapped, and Ian has had goodness knows how many hospitalisations and procedures, all without worrying about the cost. In the US at best we would be worrying about using up all our insurance cover.

Yes, chuffed to bits to have 'tested' recovery after exercise. Ahh the zapping! Basically its the DC cardioversion, after anesthetic, and acknowledging the risks, one shock is enough to stop me and revert to normal sinus when the heart starts again. Did have a slight concern this time as I had nine medics in to observe the treatment.........just as I was about to go under, I gathered this was a 'first time' for the young doctor, being observed, about to deliver the shock!

My episodes of AF have all been at night or first thing in the morning, when still in bed or on getting up. The last was at the end of August 2011 and since then I have been given a mandibular responding splint to wear at night to prevent sleep apnoeia (which can trigger AF). After 4 months without an attack I was hoping not to have any more.

BUT today about 7-8 miles into my 12 mile run my Garmin began showing alarming readings with maximums up to 200bpm and an average for over a mile of 151. Before this, I was averaging mostly 120-130 with a max of 132, which is what i was aiming for. I wasn't feeling super-fit on this run, but I wasn't aware of palpitations or of feeling bad when my HR went up. I was able to go on running, though anxiety caused me to run more slowly. If I hadn't been wearing a HRM I wouldn't have been aware of a problem, except of feeling tired, which is not abnormal for me on a 12 mile run.

This evening I do feel rather tired, but again perhaps as much from anxiety as anything else. Since my HR is now completely normal, there is nothing to be done until/if it happens again. I am wondering if there is any chance this could be an expiring battery - but it seems rather a coincidence. I'd welcome comments.

I've had a few high readings on my own HRM, they sometimes occur in roughly the same places - part of one of my regular runs stays close to the railway for a bit, I've had it there and it goes when I turn away so I suspect the overhead power lines. Theres another location where it happens occasionally, no visible lines but maybe a buried one? Was there anything near where you were that could have explained it? It sometimes happens in other places, I think maybe the signal gets interfered with more than we think.

Mark, I run there - by Eccup Reservoir - most weeks and I've never had this problem there before. I am more hoping it may be a battery problem, but I fear a low battery would lead to no reading rather than high ones.

Hi Alexandra. I think it's pretty unlikely, especially given your previous symptoms when in AF, that you were in AF when your HRM jumped so far. It would be very unusual to go in to such rapid AF whilst running and be able to carry on without symptoms when you don't tolerate it entirely without symptoms at rest. HRMs of this type have lots of foibles and a factitious reading is the most likely explanation IMOCheers Paul

Antoher suspect (I think) is simply the vibration/banging of the HRM strap against your chest as you run. I think it might momentarily break the contact or at least interfere with it and generate false additional signals? I've noticed mine on other occasions shoot up to 160+ with no apparant physical effects - ie I'm not out of breath or feel as if I'm running at anything like that pace. If I slow to a walk it usually drops back immediately to 130 or so which is where I would expect it to be for the perceived level of exertion (ie it doesn't go 165, 163, 160, 158 etc, it usually goes 165 - 128 just like that) which is another reason why I suspect the strap, walking stops it bouncing about I suppose - it also happens more frequently on road stretches where I suppose it is jarring about more.

Thanks Paulo & Mark. Paulo, I think you're right (anyway I hope so!) - when I have had episodes in the past I would not have been able to run more than a very few steps without feeling bad. Mark - I notice that Garmin recommends that if one is having problems one can get a better connection by siting the electrodes on one's back instead of on the chest, so in view of your comments I shall try that next time. I have replaced the battery today so as to take that out of the equation.

Tuesday morning I woke around 4am & realised I was having an episode of AF (high & irregular heartbeat), my first since the end of August 2011. I had been hoping I had seen the last of AF since I got a responding splint for my sleep apnoea, so that was disappointing. However, I had a letter from my consultant asking for me to be given intravenous Flecainide in hospital to see if it would bring my HR down without bad side effects. If it did, I could then have the drug as a "pill in the pocket" to take at home whenever I needed to. That sounded such a good idea, I was actually hoping my HR would stay up long enough for me to have the treatment.

Well, I thought with the consultant's letter it would be just ask & have, but he was on holiday and having arrived (on foot, which caused some surprise) at 9.30am I was still having tests at 2pm. At this point a very nice female junior doctor was tapping my back (they seemed to think that as I am old I must have pneumonia - they had already x-rayed my chest) when my HR, which had been varying between 140-150, suddenly dropped to 83.

So - no drug treatment this time. I'd be off home. Well, no - a senior doctor had to see me before I could be discharged. I spent the afternoon pacing up and down the corridor in my hospital gown, psyching myself up to announce that I was discharging myself. I knew there would be an awful fuss, but luckily the senior doctor turned up just 10 minutes before my 5pm deadline.

He told me that I was very lucky to see him, that the drug my consultant wanted me to take was dangerous for someone as old as me & he had seen terrible things happen to patients who had taken it. In any case he would not give me a "pill in the pocket", but rather a drug to take every day that would lower my HR permanently. When I objected that I would then be unable to run any more, or even hill-walk, he told me that endurance running strains the heart.

He asked me how long was my longest run - 13 miles, but very slow - & said that however slow running that distance would damage the heart. I was naturally deeply interested & questioned him as to whether he would recommend me to train for eg 5k races instead, which would involve less distance but higher intensity? He hadn't a clue - he was left stammering "It stands to reason that all running stresses the heart" in front of the nice female junior doctor. He had lost all credibility and quickly left. So did I.

Luckily, Ian DP has mentioned that HIS consultant told him that runners are MORE likely to develop AF but LESS likely to have heart attacks.

I'm now all the more motivated to find new ways to prevent episodes of AF & new alternative (non-drug) ways to treat it if it occurs. I'm also curious to find out what my consultant will say when he gets back next week. Meanwhile I've found a 10k trail race I plan to run at the end of July. Dr G, eat your heart out!

I wondered where you had got to Alexandra, not seen you on here in a while. Re: your post, I've had similar experiences when seeing general consultants for my Crohn's. Generally, only your consultant will know your history and be able to advise, the "jack of all trades" type consultants are not usually specialist enough imho to give detailed advice (plus he sounds a bit daft). I would simply book a consultant visit and relay your experience to them for a better opinion.

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Originally Posted by Rob Furness

I wondered where you had got to Alexandra, not seen you on here in a while. Re: your post, I've had similar experiences when seeing general consultants for my Crohn's. Generally, only your consultant will know your history and be able to advise, the "jack of all trades" type consultants are not usually specialist enough imho to give detailed advice (plus he sounds a bit daft). I would simply book a consultant visit and relay your experience to them for a better opinion.

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Sound advice Rob.

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Originally Posted by Rob Furness

I wondered where you had got to Alexandra, not seen you on here in a while. Re: your post, I've had similar experiences when seeing general consultants for my Crohn's. Generally, only your consultant will know your history and be able to advise, the "jack of all trades" type consultants are not usually specialist enough imho to give detailed advice (plus he sounds a bit daft). I would simply book a consultant visit and relay your experience to them for a better opinion.

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Hi Rob, good to hear from you, and Mike T too. Actually, far from being a jack of all trades, Dr G is an electro physiologist. All the hospital staff, (including Dr G himself!) told me how lucky I was to get to see him. However, he came to a snap judgment on my case without knowing me at all, and he was obviously in the "consultant as God" mode rather than being prepared to discuss or even explain. I am still in a rather uncomfortable limbo, as when my consultant eventually rang me back 10 days after the event I was out, and although Dr G has sent recommendations to my GP the surgery has ongoing computer problems which means no-one can read what he said!!! I fear both consultants will agree that I should go onto Warfarin (for life, obviously) but I am very unwilling. I would consider the new Dabigratran instead, as it works without diet restrictions and without testing, but it is very expensive so unless my consultant can prescribe it for me (my GP says he can) I may have to try and stay alive another 5 years til the Nice guidelines say I can have it (at 75). Of course by then it may be cheaper, and there are other equivalent drugs coming soon.

As for Flecainide, I have been researching it and it seems like Hobson's choice - dangerous but very helpful for some. Natasha on Daily Mile gave me a link to DR JOHN M for extremely useful discussions of Flecainide/Pradaxa & other aspects of AF. He is a fanatical cyclist, so not keen on treatments that disrupt exercise (eg beta blockers). A great find.

I have not been posting on the Forum much as I have been plagued with medical investigations that took up a lot of time & attention. Also, I have found a home on DAILY MILE and, if I'm honest, I feel less & less like a fell runner & more like a trail runner. I hope I can find time for both.

If anyone has any comments or experience around AF, Flecainide, Warfarin etc to share, I'd be glad.

I thought I'd give you an update on my heart issues.
Last night I did a 2.5 hour reccie of the HPM on Howden edge. on returning to the carpark I bumped in to Peat Water at Langsett. we'd both been out for long runs over Howden reccieing the HPM. Just after he left I became "ill" I managed to get my self home but realised soon after another trip to hospital was needed.

Once again the Northern general were fantastic, whipping me through the queue and in to a resus room where after the nurse, doctor, resident and consultant had seen me it was decided to try a paticularly Nasty drug called Adenosine which basically stops the heart straight away and gives the "Impending doom" feeling you get when having an heart attack. after the first dose which was unpleasant but failed they doubled the dose and tried again with even worse feelings also with no success, third time lucky and I have to say that was the worst but still with no cure..... Out came the defib. the knocked me out and then zapped me....success!

I had to stay in over night but I'm home now. The worst bit was trying to get the sticky electrodes off my hairy(not so much now) chest at 2.00am in the Cardiac intensive care ward.

Anyway home now but will take a a few days off. no drugs or conditions applied on the discharge sheet so for the moment in ture Sharpe style...IDP will soldier on...