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Swelling has gone down considerably thanks to icing and wearing a compression sock. Did a 5 mile run tonight including 2.5 mile @ tempo pace with no pain, swelling or otherwise. I must just be a drama queen :o as clearly it wasn't as bad as I thought. It did look it though.... honest
Be careful. I have had problems with my ankles and still twist them every now and then. Like you it rarely causes me long term problems but once you start going over you may find it happens more and more. Do all the exercises that you will read about on the forum and you may be ok. Don't be complacent. Go on the r**d for a while if necessary.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yorkshire Rob
Already way ahead of you there :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Deadlegs
It can be strangely addictive. One minute I was running on t****c, the next thing I knew I was in the Loch Ness Marathon. Have barely seen a hill since Borrowdale. I am going cold turkey now and have locked my flats away.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yorkshire Rob
Done it again!! Same ankle, 4 weeks later and this time it went whilst walking down a ramp at work and sent me flying. It's now the size of a grapefruit again and extremely sore. I went to hospital this time and had it looked at and strangely when they x rayed it they found an avulsion fracture on the lower edge of the malleolus which they said looked old (possibly the original injury?) but they weren't concerned about it. They point blank refused any sort of scan even though I told them about having an operation on the other ankle for exactly the same injury so it looks as though I'm probably going to have to nag the gp or go private like last time. Bloody NHS drives me mad at times.
Sorry to hear about that YB. Just got running on my knacked ankle today, 5 weeks after humungous sprain. Seems to be holding out OK but I know I am just one unguarded moment away from square one like thissen!
I'm running in a brace at present just to give it some healing time as I keep pulling it before it's had time to heal up. All well so far
update - finally had and got MRI results which show damage to both CF and ATFL ligaments plus bone marrow oedema in the malleolus, talus and calcaneum. That said, I'm now running on it without a brace and it seems reasonably sturdy at the moment. I've been referred to orthopaedics so I'll see what they say
aaarrrhhh the joys of fell running twisted my ankle sunday bruising coming out
training off for a few days (bugger)
I'm confused? Has this thread been constructed out of lot's of other threads? I thought I started this one, but now it goes back to 2007?
Have you been tidying up Brett?
Rob, the description of your injury is exactly the same as my experience last night. Ankle turned over accompanied by a loud cracking noise followed by my yelping being heard across hardcastle crags and cold clamy sweats, after about 30 seconds i was walking about followed shortly be returning to normal running pace. We finished the last couple of miles with hardly any pain. Back at the car whilst doing my right quad stretch the bloody thing turned again although with no noise. The picture you took is identical to how mine looks now. The pain is not too bad was even considering a quick r**d blast tomorrow, not too sure that would be a good idea now although fortunately i am booked in my physio for an ongoing knee niggle on Saturday so think it may hijack my session.
Hows your progress now?
Sorry to hear that MM. Mine's pretty good mate to be fair, I bought a lace up ankle brace to allow me to still run off road (at the risk of going over bigstyle if anything went wrong) and took it reasonably steady with that for a while before ditching it and resuming normal running. I still find I go over on it fairly easily compared to the other ankle but now I can catch it before it actually does any damage, just a slight twinge usually. My opinion is that the ligaments are stuffed, but the surrounding muscles and tendons are strong so are holding things together ok.
I stand on one leg whilst brushing my teeth every day now to keep my balance good and that seems to help a fair bit too. If it feels ok I would run road on it, I don't think it will do it any harm. I've found that the sooner you resume running the faster the swelling goes down provided you don't go over on it again. Good luck getting it sorted.
Cheers Rob, I am trying desperatley to get some reasonable fitness back and like most the thought of enforced time out is not good. I have some tubigrip that may be of some benefit even if it is just enough for quick 45min road blast tomorrow lunchtime.
Well unfortunately the outcome ain't good. I have apparently ruptured my ligament and will have to have at least two weeks off any running. The physio said ligament damage pain sometimes lessens with the severity, hence being able to run home. Ok to ride so the bike will be seeing some action.
If you've ruptured it I imagine you'll need some surgery to put it right. That's what happened to me when I did the other ankle a few years back (ATFL rupture), I had a tendon graft and was in a pot/boot for 6 weeks. Took me a long time to get it fully right tbh. Fingers crossed the outlook is better for you.
On the plus side, the ankle they operated on for me is now rock solid and stable.
Er no mention of surgery from the physio but your the second person to say that. She did say that it could be pretty u/s now and will give me muscle strengthening exercises when rehab starts in a couple of weeks to compensate for it. She did prove the injury by showing me how my foot can flop around like a wet dead fish. Looks like Fairfield will be a non starter now. Bugger.
Have they only diagnosed it by examination? Normally you'd have a scan to confirm. Basically, if the ligament has ruptured it most probably will not heal back together without intervention. If there's enough of the ligament left (mine was wrecked) they can reattach the damaged pieces and immobilise it to allow it to heal properly. If not then they need to do a tendon graft in place of the damaged ligament.
You can strengthen the surrounding tendons such as Peroneus Brevis/longus which should hold things fairly well, but won't stop you going over on the ankle and pulling the tendon instead or breaking your ankle. Also it leaves the possibility of problems in the future if/when you lose strength in those tendons as you age.
It was just my physio who has diagnosed it, she gave it a blast on the ultrasound machine to help speed the healing process apparently. Hopefully it may not be too bad and heal naturally. The more daunting thing is the thought of removing the tape she has put on today.....
Sorry to hear about all this Mart, you must be good and p*ssed off. Fingers crossed it isn't as serious as Rob's.
If she has only diagnosed it through exam then it might not be a full rupture (a bit like saying you haven't broken a bone without doing an x ray), I'd be tempted to ask for a scan to confirm because the sooner it's operated on (if it is a rupture) the easier the op is. Just a thoughtQuote:
Originally Posted by martmason
If it is a rupture it must be as serious, rupture means the ligament has completely severed so there's not that much of a grey area.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eleanor
I know, I was trying to cheer him up but I think it may be too late for that, he's already grumpy as hell about it. Sympathies to all who have injured themselves this weekend and I'm relieved I'm not one, not this time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Furness
Well everybody in the Mason household is glad to hear I,m over the grumpy stage, I,m now starting with some tinternet retail therapy, say hello PBsports to your new number one customer lol.
Sore again today after coiners race yesterday, more strapping and a bigger hole in the sand needed.:angry:
Major case of groundhog day, I am sure I did'nt turn my ankle again on Sunday but it started to hurt up the side of the round sticky out boney bit on the outside of joint. It was manageable whilst running but now two days on and I can hardly walk on it, any ideas anybody. Oh and its rather swollen now :-(
Uh... reading back on this... did you actually get diagnosed with a full on ligament rupture- as in, the ligament is in 2 bits...?
My physio likened it to a piece of plasticine stretched past its elastic limit but not snapped. This is in a different place as damage was more on the side of my foot where this is higher up the joint but the bone feel very tender to the touch now.
well... its all very connected down there... I'd ice it and get it properly checked out by a sports doctor who can actually diagnose what the heck is going on there. and take some enforced rest. Maybe not the answer youre wanting, but what I would do.
Thanks for the advice Zephyr, you are correct rest is needed.
I've wrecked my ankle again yesterday morning. Rock gave way under me on a narrow path choked with undergrowth and I fell with my foot underneath me. It was pretty painful at first but I was able to run the remaining 2 miles or so back to the car albeit slowly and in a bit of discomfort. Today it's the size of a grapefruit again and my whole foot is swollen and going purple. Lovely, just what I wanted.
I've not bothered getting it looked at (I don't see much point really) so I'm just R.I.C.E.'ing it and hoping I can walk on it ok tomorrow for work. I can sort of hobble but that's about it today. Fingers crossed for a swift recovery.
I suffered a badly swollen leg following knee surgery after I started back running too soon after the op (2 weeks). The swelling just wouldn't go away, until my physio told me to elevate my leg above my waist at every opportunity, so that the fluid could get past my knee where it could be re-absorbed. I did this while watching TV etc and slept with my feet on a pillow. The swelling soon went away.
I still get swollen legs after high mileage walking (over 30 mile), but following this procedure it's gone in no time.
This thread has been really useful for me so thanks to everyone and sorry to hear you've just hurt your ankle today Rob. I sprained mine three weeks ago coming off of Robinson and heard a snapping noise shortly before feeling very sick. Had to slither down on my bum and then hop to the road. I got it x-rayed at A&E the next day and they said that it was probably torn tendons. I've had three weeks of hobbling about and now the bruising has gone and most of my foot is the normal size except around the joint which is still quite swollen and it has gone sort of solid!
I've just ordered a wobble board from Amazon and today I managed a slightly uncomfortable (but not unbearable) 1.5m run on the flat and a careful yoga session leaving out any movements that hurt. The Tree position (stood on one leg with other bent with foot pressed against inner thigh of supporting leg) seems to be a good one for interim conditioning before my board arrives. I'm going to go and see my sports physio too though. I'm desperate to get back on the fells but want to make sure I give myself the best chance of not getting a repeat injury straight away.
Be careful Hes, I went through a similar process after an initial ankle sprain, visiting A&E , physio etc but after 5 weeks still no progress (including physio exercises). My last physio session was done with a specialist how very quickly had me back down to x-ray to find out my fibula was broken. :-(
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Nice!
Hi Martmason, thanks for the post. As an update, yes, I think you are right to be cautious. My physio is a sports physio and deals with rugby players, football players and runners and he understands fell running. He has had a good look at me and says that the diagnosis at A&E was a bit out and that I've torn ligaments not tendons and that I won't be fell running for about three months (although I'm counting the three weeks since I did it in that). He's set me loads of exercises to do using theraband, a cushion (moving to a wobble board) etc and has recommended that I keep fit with lots of cycling, keep my overall strength up with various core exercises and squats etc and in a week or so he suggests that, if I must run:), I run on the flat only with an ankle brace. Basically he says that at this stage, if I go over on it again, my ankle has lost the ability to stabilise me and that a further injury will be much more serious and I'll be looking at surgery.
Running is a passion for me, it keeps me sane, healthy and gets me outdoors. I can't bear the thought of not being able to run in the longterm so I'm going to bite the bullet and take the time off now, get on my bike and do the exercises. He also said that he will push my ankle further than you'd normally need for general day to day use and road running and get it strong for the fells. His attitude has given me confidence (despite my initial disappointment) and maybe I'll come out of this better in the long run (excuse the pun).
Quote:
Originally Posted by martmason
Watch it Rob...that's exactly what mine looked like only mine was a bit less hairy.:D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Furness
This is about the 5th or 6th time I've done it to that ankle (the other one I had an op on after a fully ruptured ATFL) and this is probably the worst so far but not by much, the last 4 or 5 times it has swelled about the same but not been quite as badly bruised. I suspect that was caused by having no choice but to continue to run on it to get myself off the hill and back to the car, and no chance to cool it down (last time it was bad I dunked it in a beck for several minutes soon after doing it) until I got home which was about an hour after injuring it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hes
I'll be taking things steady for a bit when it's feeling better, and will probably still run the fells but with a lace up brace on. That worked ok last time.
Only you know what you should or shouldn't be doing and I hope that you recover quickly and are back out there soon.
For what its worth, my physio said that we runners are our own worst enemies because we just want to get back out there asap and don't do the appropriate strengthening and reconditioning or allow the healing to take place and he said the result is repeat injuries and usually the injury is worse each time until surgery is required. He gave me all the technical reasons why it would be ill-advised to run on my ankle at this stage and I am going to heed his advice. I'm no wuss and I ran through an untreated knee injury over two years ago which was the reason why I ended up seeing him last year due to all the problems caused by compensating with my other leg and not reconditioning the injured one. That's just me though. He did advise an ankle brace for running on the flat in a few weeks but not as a longterm solution which he said would be the conditioning that I'll do over the next couple months and preparing ankle to get used to the stretching, balance and load bearing required for fell running.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Furness
Hes's physio sounds like he knows his runners to me! My ankle injuries are an annual delight now, except this year i've had to write off the whole spring/summer instead of trying to wing it. I've never had any luck with trying to run through ankle injuries, my latest is a pretty nasty Anterior Talofibular Ligament strain, and all the strength has left my ankle completely. My only saving grace is that the Strid Wood trail has around 1000' of climbing in it.
That's the same ligament that I've damaged Mr B. Really hope you get better soon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mr brightside
I'm starting to wonder if I've done something serious to mine. It feels stable enough but the bruising is mental, my whole foot is purple including my toes and I have bruising as far up as about a 3rd of the way up my lower leg as well as serious swelling, especially after a day on my feet at work. I've been using compression socks whilst working to try and keep the swelling down but it hasn't helped hugely. It's really odd feeling as well, if I press my fingers into the swollen area and then remove them, it leaves a deep dent in the skin which takes a few mins to fully disappear. It's also still really uncomfortable to walk on nearly 6 days after doing it. First thing on a morning it's almost impossible to weight bear for several minutes until it warms up a bit.
I think I'm going to have to bite the bullet and go get it x rayed :thunbdown: