Peris Horseshoe

Shit weather today Dyl.
The fog, wind and rain was nuts!!!
The climb up to Y Garn was the worst. Luky the wind was blowing from the Ogwen side otherwise would of blown down to Bethesda!!!

Had a good ascent of Glyder??? the last climb on the Half Peris course.
I got the win on the Half Peris in 01:49 and a new course record, but nothing to write home about as it's a weak new record should of knocked at least 15mins off that as I went lost on way up to Elidir, and started ascending Foel Goch???
Didn't have a clue where I was for the whole race hahaha!!! Gutted about the weather the views would of been awsome.

Cant understand though:confused:, for the Wfra series they put the Half Peris course in as the 7th counter, and if you wanted to do the full Peris then your time for the half course wouldn't of counted for the series?????
Not complaining though the half was enough in that weather:rolleyes:

Yep the weather was pretty damn awful today! Still enjoyed it though. Was going great until the descent from Glyder Fawr - I definitely didn't pick the right line and lost quite a few places because of it. Finished in 2:20, not sure whether that's good or bad - apparently I was 3rd under 23 but that ain't saying much, I didn't see many under 23 there!

Serious respect to the marshals on the summits today, they had to hang around in some pretty horrendous weather, I definitely wouldn't have fancied their job!

well done Ifs,
ye the selection of the WFRA races to include this one is a bit odd as the half is only suppose to be a race to let runners who arent up to the challange of the full for whatever reasons feel included in the whole event.if its going to be a race in its own right then it should be held on a different date than the full i think.

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Originally Posted by gafrymynydd

Shit weather today Dyl.
The fog, wind and rain was nuts!!!
The climb up to Y Garn was the worst. Luky the wind was blowing from the Ogwen side otherwise would of blown down to Bethesda!!!

Had a good ascent of Glyder??? the last climb on the Half Peris course.
I got the win on the Half Peris in 01:49 and a new course record, but nothing to write home about as it's a weak new record should of knocked at least 15mins off that as I went lost on way up to Elidir, and started ascending Foel Goch???
Didn't have a clue where I was for the whole race hahaha!!! Gutted about the weather the views would of been awsome.

Cant understand though:confused:, for the Wfra series they put the Half Peris course in as the 7th counter, and if you wanted to do the full Peris then your time for the half course wouldn't of counted for the series?????
Not complaining though the half was enough in that weather:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by gafrymynydd

Shit weather today Dyl.
The fog, wind and rain was nuts!!!
The climb up to Y Garn was the worst. Luky the wind was blowing from the Ogwen side otherwise would of blown down to Bethesda!!!

Had a good ascent of Glyder??? the last climb on the Half Peris course.
I got the win on the Half Peris in 01:49 and a new course record, but nothing to write home about as it's a weak new record should of knocked at least 15mins off that as I went lost on way up to Elidir, and started ascending Foel Goch???
Didn't have a clue where I was for the whole race hahaha!!! Gutted about the weather the views would of been awsome.

Cant understand though:confused:, for the Wfra series they put the Half Peris course in as the 7th counter, and if you wanted to do the full Peris then your time for the half course wouldn't of counted for the series?????
Not complaining though the half was enough in that weather:rolleyes:

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Math and I were 1:44 for half way so reckon you're right on that. Well done anyway, wins a win.

I won the 'long' but shortened long, 3:08, I found conditions fine really, wind rain cloud, but that was forecast, but understand shortening it for the marshalls, not for the runners, as that was what was forecasted and it was nothing that bad, that a fell runner shouldn't be able to deal with.

Math and I started quick, into the cloud and never saw anyone and I put a burst on the climb to Snowdon and then Math second, 3:18, Hugh O'DoOnnel Third, 3:27. Felt more like a training run at times as it was just me and Math running together chatting. Conditions underfoot were slow though, you just couldn't gamble on your footing.

Well done to IainR and Gafrmynydd on winning their respective races today in that weather! Who were 2nd and 3rd in the half?

Shame we didn't get to go up to the top of Snowdon in the full race, as if we had we'd have seen a 4x4 pickup on the path a few hundred meters from the summit! Some numpty had driven up last night trying to get to the summit! I think that he didn't quite manage it and the 4x4 is still up there between the finger stone from the PYG track and the summit! The plonker has apparently been arrested so if anyone wants some spare parts for a 4x4 pickup you know where to get them!!

well done to the winners, weather was pants but what a cracking race so chuffed to complete the full in under 4 1/2 hrs

Well done Iain and Math to.
Gutted i didn't do a recee. First race I've done, that I've never been on any part of the course!! Got 8.9 miles from start to Pen y Pass. went lost on way up Elidir and went up Foel Goch!! haha never mind.

2nd in the Half was Callum Musket a young jnr!!!!!!!!! very strong and a bright prospect :-)
3rd Paul Jenks Eryri
4th Mark Atherton Meirionnydd

Well done Ian.

I had a really bad day out, felt urrgh/cold from the off. All my layers, hats etc, on.

Glad to get to PyP in one piece.

Thanks to the lady who subbed me a quid for the bus ride back down the hill in my marginal state.

Dreams of beating my last time for the full will have to wait till next year.

Thanks to Mike for putting on the race and all the Marshalls.

Epic
epic, epic, epic (I tells yer)
I completed the full, having gone on the early start with a mate who decided to do it at short notice
he was struggling with the multiple steep clims and was getting cold, so packed at PYP
I was thinking of doing the same, but as I was paddling/@rse-sliding my way down off Glyder Fawr, I started to enjoy myself in a perverse kind of way
I started to get cold again myself towards the top of the Miners, but the Rangers descent warmed me back up a bit
biggest thankyou of the day must go to the marshals on Cynghorion who had no protection from the wind at all :w00t:
pansied my way down to Maesgwm due to lack of decent studs on the steep wet grassy stuff
felt surprisingly strong on the run in and was (almost) sorry to see the finish as I was enjoying the forest trail so much

Congrats to Iain - you and Math were certainly looking very impressive as you cruised past us going up Y Garn!

Many Thanks to Mike Blake - fantastic event :thumbup:

Cheers Daz..well done for keeping going, the descents were the hardest bit,

One day I'll work out the first local rule.

The race Peris Horseshoe...does a loop of Nant Peris..I live in Nant Peris..yet as winner it was still debated if I should be first local as I'm not Llanberis...yet first woman..Dinorwic...yet no debate....

To be honest the only race which seems to have a transparent first local policy is Snowdon Marathon and that's simply if you live in a village on the route, you are local..

Anyway, shortened course but there's no comments on the winners trophy, just year and name....so finally have a local long to my name.

Here's a picture of that car on Snowdon: http://yfrog.com/kfrckauj

I'm not sad to have skipped this year's Peris, given the weather. Fingers crossed for a nice one next year!

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Originally Posted by IainR

the descents were the hardest bit

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I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought so - I usually love descents struggled yesterday. Taking a dive across a patch of grass (thank god there weren't any rocks!) on the way down Y Garn probably didn't help...

Credit to the guy who started down Glyder Fawr in front of me (probably ended up two places in front) who's descending technique was to sit on his bum and slide down the grass! It worked because he left me for dead.

Well done Daz, sure was wicked the descent off Glyder.

Ahhhhh the dreaded "first local" gremlin strikes again!!!! Well done on getting a well deserved trophy :-)

I've felt the wrath of this with Cader. I live in Brithdir 2 miles from Dolgellau and was told that first local is the catchment area of the highschool which basically is Dolgellau and any village within a 5 mile

In 2009 having only been running 2 months i was 25th and a clear first locall, and all that kept me going was the thought of winning that trophy. Come the pesentation "NO TROPHY THIS YEAR, we decided not to give it this year"

In 2010 I got 2nd in the race, got 2nd prize. Trophy was back this year and gave it to someone else because i was allready a prize winner!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Came back in 2011 got 6th and my fastest time on the course (with a very strong field) so was out of the overall prizes, so this trophy is mine I thought. Wrong!!!! "hope Ifan doesn't mind but we have to give the first locall trophy to a girl who did Cader today for the first time" she was well over 2hrs and in 80th (ish) good effort mind.
So despite my efforts the trophy has still escaped me :-(

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Originally Posted by rocksteady

i remember running a shortened course a few years ago,it was due to very strong winds,some of the rocks on top of Elidir fach were getting blown along the ground you could hardly stand up.the route by-passed the lliwedd and went up the pyg track to snowdon,but the weather did improve during the day though as i remember.personnaly i cant see the fun in running in such difficult conditions,i`d just opt out and do some quality training session lower down,the race will still be there next year and the mountain will most certainetly be.

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I don't know I enjoyed it, its just good fun.

I don't think it should have been shortened, I know others do, and don't think it would have been in any other part of the UK bar Wales and to be honest the lack of proper fell races in Wales explains the general poor ability here. The lakes runners would have just sucked it and coped for sure. Running through the half you could see that people had grouped to the few who knew the way or could navigate.

We only have a few proper fell races left. The 1000m peaks is being increasingly marshalled, check pointed so route choice is now minimal if any at all, the Rhinogs has gone. If we want runners to come from around the UK to race the classic welsh longs then leave them be. Look at the numbers now for this race, 50? for one of the top 5 toughest fell races in the UK. At the start we were told full race and only got told otherwise at the lliwedd turn off, not even at PyP...chatting at the start everyone wanted to run the full.

The Carneddau is left, the Peris, but then what else? SO what if people get lost? In the peak, lakes it seems there is much more scope for letting people get lost cold and wet. I've been lost and DNF'd, cold, wet so what? get out, learn and get back.. The amount of races left in Wales where one really does need to get out a map and compass is few. It's almost a lost art now and recceing is the preferred option. So all that happens is people lose the recce'd line, don't know the rest of the hillside, can't navigate to get back and end up running in circles, meet someone else, repeat until the group coalesces to such a point they finally find a navigator.

Compare snowdonia races to the lakes? Numbers of longs? brutalness of races. Then look at how much stronger the general lakes runners are. Tuesday evening traily races are the highlight of the fell running calendar in North Wales where as the likes of Garn, Hebog, Cnicht, Peris et al..i.e. the classics, proper fell races struggle. In the Lakes they'd get much bigger numbers.

It's the organisers and marshalls call but whilst understandable I thought yesterday was just classic mild frontal weather. In fact great fun to be out in. The word attrocious was banded around, it looked bad, but in reality it can get way way worse than that. Once we'd done the glyders there is no more nav, swing up Lliwedd, then you can follow major tourist paths all the way to Bwlch Brnnog, climb Cynghorion and then get the descent and the race is done. Lliwedd would have been slippy and slow to be sure, but that's just a test of general mountain sense and foot placement.

Anyway think we should also shift to dibbers, save the marshalling then. Maybe Eryri could invest some of that £15k they have in the bank and purchase modern equipment. Then you wouldn't need a marshall at Lliwedd, just a dibber. Its fine for MM's so why not fell races?

In the ultra world 30-50% DNF rates are normal, maybe this should be the case in fell running, the onus is on the runner to be safe, if they get too cold, out of their depth, get out DNF, have a go again. Not for the organiser to tame a route for the lowest denominator.

No doubt this won't go down well, but that's my opnion on yesterday.

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Originally Posted by IainR

I don't know I enjoyed it, its just good fun.

I don't think it should have been shortened, I know others do, and don't think it would have been in any other part of the UK bar Wales and to be honest the lack of proper fell races in Wales explains the general poor ability here. The lakes runners would have just sucked it and coped for sure. Running through the half you could see that people had grouped to the few who knew the way or could navigate.

We only have a few proper fell races left. The 1000m peaks is being increasingly marshalled, check pointed so route choice is now minimal if any at all, the Rhinogs has gone. If we want runners to come from around the UK to race the classic welsh longs then leave them be. Look at the numbers now for this race, 50? for one of the top 5 toughest fell races in the UK. At the start we were told full race and only got told otherwise at the lliwedd turn off, not even at PyP...chatting at the start everyone wanted to run the full.

The Carneddau is left, the Peris, but then what else? SO what if people get lost? In the peak, lakes it seems there is much more scope for letting people get lost cold and wet. I've been lost and DNF'd, cold, wet so what? get out, learn and get back.. The amount of races left in Wales where one really does need to get out a map and compass is few. It's almost a lost art now and recceing is the preferred option. So all that happens is people lose the recce'd line, don't know the rest of the hillside, can't navigate to get back and end up running in circles, meet someone else, repeat until the group coalesces to such a point they finally find a navigator.

Compare snowdonia races to the lakes? Numbers of longs? brutalness of races. Then look at how much stronger the general lakes runners are. Tuesday evening traily races are the highlight of the fell running calendar in North Wales where as the likes of Garn, Hebog, Cnicht, Peris et al..i.e. the classics, proper fell races struggle. In the Lakes they'd get much bigger numbers.

It's the organisers and marshalls call but whilst understandable I thought yesterday was just classic mild frontal weather. In fact great fun to be out in. The word attrocious was banded around, it looked bad, but in reality it can get way way worse than that. Once we'd done the glyders there is no more nav, swing up Lliwedd, then you can follow major tourist paths all the way to Bwlch Brnnog, climb Cynghorion and then get the descent and the race is done. Lliwedd would have been slippy and slow to be sure, but that's just a test of general mountain sense and foot placement.

Anyway think we should also shift to dibbers, save the marshalling then. Maybe Eryri could invest some of that £15k they have in the bank and purchase modern equipment. Then you wouldn't need a marshall at Lliwedd, just a dibber. Its fine for MM's so why not fell races?

In the ultra world 30-50% DNF rates are normal, maybe this should be the case in fell running, the onus is on the runner to be safe, if they get too cold, out of their depth, get out DNF, have a go again. Not for the organiser to tame a route for the lowest denominator.

No doubt this won't go down well, but that's my opnion on yesterday.

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I don't know much about the racing situation in North Wales but I've done a few classic races there such as Carneddau, 1000m Peaks (although DNF :o), and Peris (although only half this year) I'd hate to think of them being undersubscribed and they deserve to be as popular as any Lakes/Peaks race. May try to get to the Black Mountains in a few weeks and will try to get to more in future.

Personally I like a bit of mixed weather. Always thought dealing with variable weather to be just part of the sport (a good part) and I don't consider going out in the conditions we had on the Peris to be a waste of time/too dangerous etc (I only did half though and felt fine at the end - it wasn't very cold) although I have some sympathy with the decision the organisers had to make. Great fun, and memorable. Plus a bit of compass work is great and part of the competition in fog etc - not just something for emergencies surely. s'pose it come under that dubious heading of 'mountaincraft' although I never really liked that phrase personally. 'Common sense' is probably better. As for getting lost - long may it continue: Tankys Trog is definately enhanced by the tales of people having wandered around for 5hrs in freezing blizzards on Bleaklow :thumbup:

S'pose if people don't experience bad weather occasionally then they won't develop the skills to help themselves if they really end up lost, cold, alone etc sometime.

Well done on your run - think you and your mate passed me as I was tottering off Glyder Fawr. you were going very well.

lot of sense there Iain & Will
even at my lowly level, I'd've been quite happy to do Lliwedd - I was "enjoying" it in the rain too, and the only reason I was getting cold was my slowness on the ascents - I had a spare dry top in my bag that I could've changed into to see me round
I think they probably dropped it due to how nasty it would've been for marshals

I'm on record as being gutted as to the loss of the Rhinogs race, as I've never got to run it, and would happily volunteer my services (such as they are) to help get it back on

the Lakes longs have benefitted from the LCT - perhaps a Welsh equivalent would help...?

Couldn't agree more Iain, you've raised some good points.

When I started fell running a couple of years ago I was expecting races like yesterday to be typical, but when I actually started racing I was surprised at how little I actually use a map and compass during a race. I think I'm right in saying yesterday is the first time I've had to use a compass during a race, and I've done a lot of races (most fortunately in good weather!). It's great that there are marshals that volunteer and give up their time to help out these events but surely it's taking away part of the fun of fell running when you're getting pointed around the whole route.

The weather yesterday was "bad" in the sense that it was raining and there was a fair bit of wind, but definitely not untypical or unusual for Snowdonia - as Iain says it could have been a lot worse. I also quite enjoyed being out in it and enjoyed the different atmosphere that weather like that gives a race.

I did Blisco Dash (up Pike o' Blisco) a few weeks ago in the Lakes. It was a short 6 mile jaunt up n down on a Wednesday evening with pretty much no advertisement and yet it attracted more runners than the half Peris yesterday. It's a shame as yesterday's race was fantastic and what I've always imagined as a "proper fell race".

Firstly well done Iain on your victory.Also agree that the race shouldnt have been shortened i ran with a vest nearly all the way and wasnt a problem.Fair enough visibility was poor and cost me 3rd place definately and given how strong i felt possible catching matt for 2nd due to poor route choices this is fell running its supposed to be tough.Brilliant event and brilliant route very much enjoyed.

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Originally Posted by gazj1979

Firstly well done Iain on your victory.Also agree that the race shouldnt have been shortened i ran with a vest nearly all the way and wasnt a problem.Fair enough visibility was poor and cost me 3rd place definately and given how strong i felt possible catching matt for 2nd due to poor route choices this is fell running its supposed to be tough.Brilliant event and brilliant route very much enjoyed.

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Wondered how you'd got on, we'd just nipped back for a shower when you all came in. Well done for getting through that first half, if you don't know the course its a big disadvantage on the Peris so I was glad when Math and I got clear in the quarries and got into the cloud, getting across Elidir can be a bit of an issue if you don't know the features, and then if we could stay head to Glyder Fawr and get a good descent I thought we'd open up a gap. When the said it was shortened I was worried you could have got back on us as the rest of the course was quite runnable.

In fact just before we were turned off at the Lliwedd turn off I was thinking about how mild it was, so was quite taken back when we were told to carry on to the standing stone. Reckon it'll be a few years until I go for it again, still want to run 3:25 or so, which on a good day should be possible. I reckon I was on for a 3:35 ish in that weather, and to half way we were about on my usual schedule for a 3:30-3:40 ish finish.

I think the secret to the peris is to treat it as a race of two halves,take it steady to pen y pass and then pick up the pace along the miners track,a steady climb up lliwedd and snowdon and this should give you a strong run over cynghorion and to the finish.
I think Gavin bland took it easy up Elidir and just started to pick up the pace over the rest of the course on his stormin course record of 3:02

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Originally Posted by rocksteady

I think the secret to the peris is to treat it as a race of two halves,take it steady to pen y pass and then pick up the pace along the miners track,a steady climb up lliwedd and snowdon and this should give you a strong run over cynghorion and to the finish.
I think Gavin bland took it easy up Elidir and just started to pick up the pace over the rest of the course on his stormin course record of 3:02

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I was talking to Trefor about that, he said Gavin was one of the last to leave the field that year and didn't pass him until way up into the quarries.

Saying that though the course is slower now, less sheep grazing, but also fewer inclines in the quarries, which they used in the past..

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Originally Posted by rocksteady

I think the secret to the peris is to treat it as a race of two halves,take it steady to pen y pass and then pick up the pace along the miners track,a steady climb up lliwedd and snowdon and this should give you a strong run over cynghorion and to the finish.
I think Gavin bland took it easy up Elidir and just started to pick up the pace over the rest of the course on his stormin course record of 3:02

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I think if I took it as a race of 2 halves I wouldn't make the cut at Pen y Pass!:o

results are out on eryri site

my time seems to be slightly off (I'm down as 5:30, whereas I'm fairly sure I clocked about 5:42) but I know the marshals had probs with paper disintegrating in the rain, so we can forgive them I think!

oh, and proudly showing off my mug to Lady Slugge this morning... "What's a Horsehoe?" she asked - I hadn't noticed the misprint - guess not as much care had been taken with the English translation :wink:

Daz
Forgive my general ignorance but I can't find the results on the Eryri site. Can you post a link for thickie me?
Cheers
Dave

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Originally Posted by TheMadRunner

Daz
Forgive my general ignorance but I can't find the results on the Eryri site. Can you post a link for thickie me?
Cheers
Dave

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They were quite hard to find! And they're only of the full horseshoe, guess I'll have to wait to find out where I came! :(

Results...

[QUOTE=IainR;431350]I don't know I enjoyed it, its just good fun.

I don't think it should have been shortened, I know others do, and don't think it would have been in any other part of the UK bar Wales and to be honest the lack of proper fell races in Wales explains the general poor ability here. The lakes runners would have just sucked it and coped for sure. Running through the half you could see that people had grouped to the few who knew the way or could navigate.

Firstly I think everyone should respect the decision of those who take on the responsibility of orgnasing races. If you don't like it offer to organise the race or a new one yourself. Look forward to a Llanberis, Rydd Du traverse in the calandar next year Iain.
There seems to be a lot of things mixed up here. One of the reasons for my appalling time was I came of the last top completely wrong, panic sat down and calmed down for 5 minutes and added a mile to ther route. Shaken yes but never really in danger. Partly tiredness, partly rushing trying to shake off someone who could not map read behind. Llewydd would be different. A twisted ankle and in the wet you would be hard pressed to get down without the mountain rescue. Map reading wouldn't help you.
My understnading is that the Welsh1000s is flagged because of the landowners so may be we should do some PR with them. The Rhinogs went by the board because the orgnaisation wasnot good. The WFRA (i.e. us) might have stepped in earlier and helped save it.
More long races in wales would be great but that needs more organisers.

[QUOTE=Mary;431754]

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Originally Posted by IainR

I don't know I enjoyed it, its just good fun.

I don't think it should have been shortened, I know others do, and don't think it would have been in any other part of the UK bar Wales and to be honest the lack of proper fell races in Wales explains the general poor ability here. The lakes runners would have just sucked it and coped for sure. Running through the half you could see that people had grouped to the few who knew the way or could navigate.

Firstly I think everyone should respect the decision of those who take on the responsibility of orgnasing races. If you don't like it offer to organise the race or a new one yourself. Look forward to a Llanberis, Rydd Du traverse in the calandar next year Iain.
There seems to be a lot of things mixed up here. One of the reasons for my appalling time was I came of the last top completely wrong, panic sat down and calmed down for 5 minutes and added a mile to ther route. Shaken yes but never really in danger. Partly tiredness, partly rushing trying to shake off someone who could not map read behind. Llewydd would be different. A twisted ankle and in the wet you would be hard pressed to get down without the mountain rescue. Map reading wouldn't help you.
My understnading is that the Welsh1000s is flagged because of the landowners so may be we should do some PR with them. The Rhinogs went by the board because the orgnaisation wasnot good. The WFRA (i.e. us) might have stepped in earlier and helped save it.
More long races in wales would be great but that needs more organisers.

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TBH I will when i have time..but whilst I'm fit I'll race. Llanberis Rhydd traverse sounds brilliant.......one we may hold an informal race next year on the course, a hush hush race to get feedback...the other I don't know.

the 1000m peaks is flagged for access but then the additional points are safety points, almost no nav on it now.

I find the attitude that you can't have an opinion rather strange though. You pay to race, therefore you can say what you feel. I said I understood, just disagreed. I'm not sure that's so out of order.

Also seems to missed fell running is about racers, fields in wales are pityifully weak compared to other areas so I'll keep doing the odd race here and mainly race in the Lakes, yorkshire et al where the competition is. we need to encourage people to race, and proper races, the only competitive races we really have are the tuesday nighters. the rest the fields are too sparse, you don't get the stride for stride battles you have in the lakes or yorkshire/lancashire/peak, it just makes you run so much harder. I'm not saying uncompetitive as I win, I rarely do, but I can turn up, say '3rd today' and run around with no chance of catching 2nd and no chance of 4th catching me unless i blow. Doesn't bring you on the same.

One of the great runners of Eryri used to say whenever he felt cocky he'd leave North Wales and race elsewhere to get put in his place, so its obviously not a new view I have.

re getting lost of MC? Did you follow the direction of the marshall....if so that could be why..she was pointing too far right as you look down, so a number of people dropped into the wrong valley

I remember needing my map and compass 2 years ago in the 1000m from Aber to PenyPass, since then the course has changed and extra points have been put in, partly to abide by the landowner. In the Lakes there is a lot more tolerance with the major landowner (NT) allowing open access for many years before CROW came into force. Aran Fawddwy is a point - 10 years ago access was a real issue for everyone, now it is more open due to CROW with reluctant landowners mostly abiding.
Iain, you have a real point - at racing at Aran, the difference between this race and others that I've done in N Wales the last couple of was immense, the field being packed with Pudsey, Borrowdale etc... runners of real quality. There is some of that quality in Wales (Davies', Roberts', Jones', yourself, Ifs), just not every week at every race so it doesn't inspire others (myself) to attain to bridge the gap.
I'd love to do a Ridgway Long Race!

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Originally Posted by felltrumpet

I remember needing my map and compass 2 years ago in the 1000m from Aber to PenyPass, since then the course has changed and extra points have been put in, partly to abide by the landowner. In the Lakes there is a lot more tolerance with the major landowner (NT) allowing open access for many years before CROW came into force. Aran Fawddwy is a point - 10 years ago access was a real issue for everyone, now it is more open due to CROW with reluctant landowners mostly abiding.
Iain, you have a real point - at racing at Aran, the difference between this race and others that I've done in N Wales the last couple of was immense, the field being packed with Pudsey, Borrowdale etc... runners of real quality. There is some of that quality in Wales (Davies', Roberts', Jones', yourself, Ifs), just not every week at every race so it doesn't inspire others (myself) to attain to bridge the gap.
I'd love to do a Ridgway Long Race!

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steady I'm not in their class by a long way..but that and Snowdon is where we really get a good work out, and I suppose the tuesday nighters, which I should do more of but I'm not a huge fan of short races, but there's a few classics in the series. Math is the one who has been looking at one, we ran around the course this year and there's a 10 mile version we'll do first, but the full horseshoe, nice 14-15 miler will be a classic, problem is I'm constantly away, off for another 6 weeks this weekend, and Maths a supposedly hard working teacher with only 10 weeks holiday a year..

Access was an issue and the national park are actively against any new events, but there used to also be a long in the Carneddau, from the conwy valley side, and the rhinogs has gone, so we should get some more.

[QUOTE=Mary;431754]

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Originally Posted by IainR

I Partly tiredness, partly rushing trying to shake off someone who could not map read behind. Llewydd would be different. A twisted ankle and in the wet you would be hard pressed to get down without the mountain rescue. Map reading wouldn't help you..

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I really do not get this point at all. In many races a bad ankle could be an issue. So what only race in weather where it would be safe to be immobile..Lliwedd would have been slippy, good fun, its just a few drops though and if you can't handle wet rock why do a fell race over 3000ft peaks in September. I understand shortening it for marshals, it'd be grim for them, but for me if it was shortened for fear of runners not coping in what was just a bit of weather, then I despair at the sport. 35 mph-40 mph winds are just strong winds. Above 50 and it'll start to cause an issue. Many guiding companies in the area have a 30 mph limit on winds to guide on crib goch, and thats a proper knife edge ridge, not a major path like lliwedd.

Rushing over dangerous ground seems a bit silly, over lliwedd it would be take it steady time, both Math and I agreed that as we ran towards it, we'd race up and then be careful across it, then get racing, that's just common sense, and tbh if I'm worried about the competency of the person behind me, I'd stop and help them through. had I not done that at the weekend with math he'd still be up there.

I've raced in far worse conditions that Saturday. What I am saying is that in the Lakes, the full race would have been run without a doubt. I think runners know that, they travel in big numbers because when they get there they know there will be a race. 53 runners for one of the best fell races in the country. Sets of a few alarm bells for me. Great that I have my name on one of the big race trophies but realise the field wasn't exactly strong. Look at the womens field now in Wales...has it ever been weaker? It must set off alarm bells about the state of the sport here.

I do think its a bit rich you have a go about criticising organisers...then have a go at the Rhinogs organisers...I was quite clear that I understood, just disagreed.

Cheers for the link Sam.

Hmmmmmmm!!! Cant see the results for the half anywhere????
Or is it classed as a Pussy race and not worth publishing the results???? :-/

Not that i did it through choice, just it (the half) was part of the Wfra N.wales series and was told if i did the full then my time to halfway wouldn't be counted for the series placing!!!! So why chuck my efforts of the season for the sake of draging myself over some mountains in not very nice weather for no reason???
My opinion is the half should not of been included in the series, as for geniune series contenders lost their oportunity to race one of the best races in britain :-( These sort of races (Full Peris) should be included in welsh champs, british champs etc.

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Originally Posted by gafrymynydd

Hmmmmmmm!!! Cant see the results for the half anywhere????
Or is it classed as a Pussy race and not worth publishing the results???? :-/

Not that i did it through choice, just it (the half) was part of the Wfra N.wales series and was told if i did the full then my time to halfway wouldn't be counted for the series placing!!!! So why chuck my efforts of the season for the sake of draging myself over some mountains in not very nice weather for no reason???
My opinion is the half should not of been included in the series, as for geniune series contenders lost their oportunity to race one of the best races in britain :-( These sort of races (Full Peris) should be included in welsh champs, british champs etc.

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Aye its strange. I lost out on 2nd in the welsh mountain running champs by going for the full. North Wales does have some of the best mediums around, Moelwyns, Cader, Moel Eilio, Wyddfa, Carneddau, so surprising they didn't go for one of the classics. The Half Peris is a good race, but it'll never be the Peris and at the weekend certainly detracted from the Peris. Second time the half has been a counter though.

The Peris was the full champs back in 2006, ludicrously hot day, incredible heat going through the quarries. Results are here. http://www.wfra.me.uk/459.pdf

Not a great course for a major championship race, especially now as its too restricted climbing at the start as you climb the zig zags. The 1000m peaks is much more suited to a large field.

That is a very impressive field in that race, and Tom Owens racing for Mercia. Must of been a hell of a race with that field of runners and a good entry to! Haha impressive list of DNF's to. Yup would be quite congested in the z-zags early on.

Anyone else having problems getting results for the half? There's now a link up for it on Eryri's site but it just links to the same Excel file with just the full results in it...

http://www.eryriharriers.org.uk/serv...r=2&newsid=383

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Originally Posted by Sam Harrison

Anyone else having problems getting results for the half? There's now a link up for it on Eryri's site but it just links to the same Excel file with just the full results in it...

http://www.eryriharriers.org.uk/serv...r=2&newsid=383

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Same here. I'll speak with Math, could take some time, he's back at work after only a 7 week summer break so he's just mega stressed. I don't know how teachers cope with their work load and lack of holidays.

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Originally Posted by IainR

Same here. I'll speak with Math, could take some time, he's back at work after only a 7 week summer break so he's just mega stressed. I don't know how teachers cope with their work load and lack of holidays.

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Only 7 weeks? Us students get 14! :p I'm definitely not looking forward to entering the real world...

Just found a window of time to respond to a post or two, although as a teacher don't yet have the time to respond to some of the slanderous accusations being made by a certain forum poster. Regards results - aye half clearly not working, it was Eryri's two sisters who were typing them up (as well as the full and the C'fon 10k - all on the same day) so I'll get in touch with them to see if they can sort it.

Good news is that the New Pedol Peris 5/6th route used on Saturday is being incorporated into these championships next year:

http://www.ldwa.org.uk/challenge_eve...L&event_type=N

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Originally Posted by RhosgadMath

Just found a window of time to respond to a post or two, although as a teacher don't yet have the time to respond to some of the slanderous accusations being made by a certain forum poster. Regards results - aye half clearly not working, it was Eryri's two sisters who were typing them up (as well as the full and the C'fon 10k - all on the same day) so I'll get in touch with them to see if they can sort it.

Good news is that the New Pedol Peris 5/6th route used on Saturday is being incorporated into these championships next year:

http://www.ldwa.org.uk/challenge_eve...L&event_type=N

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Thanks Math. Half Peris results now up (errrk - wish I hadn't seem em:o). Not sure what you meant about the LDWA thingy? (couldn't see anything Peris-like in the challenge events).

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Originally Posted by Will

Thanks Math. Half Peris results now up (errrk - wish I hadn't seem em:o). Not sure what you meant about the LDWA thingy? (couldn't see anything Peris-like in the challenge events).

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SILENCED.. Just been written to by the Eryri Chairman no less saying I've embarrassed the club... by saying I disagreed with the decision to shorten the Peris, which I admitted was 'understandable'...

BRILLIANT!

How do you form a new club?