:D Barefoot Running

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Originally Posted by eLBee!

I've been hoping that inov-8 would respond to the pendulum swing that is seeing people rejecting the sofa shoes, for shoes that allow the feet to work in the way they were designed.
The f-lite 230 makes an excellent road shoe - I ran 10 marathons in 10 days in mine - and I'll be taking delivery of the 220PK in the next couple of days, which also looks like it'll be an excellent road shoe.
I've been waiting for some indication that there was a 1 or 0 cushion shoe in development - as well as wider shoes for the platypus-footed amongst us.
It's great to see that this has ALSO been taken on board.
And the ground 'feel' of the lighter shoes is something I've always liked, so an even further pared down fell shoe is really something to look forward to!
:)

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Leon
You and I need to have a chat:cool:

inov8 insider - are you able to be a little more specific about when in 2010 the 0 and 1 shoes will be available? After all 2010 is only 3.5 months away. I run barefoot at times and use aqua shoes but desperately need something with grip. I'm thinking of getting the X talons but suspect that even they will feel too heavy. If the new shoes came out early 2010 I would persevere with my aqua shoes.

Please do not leave us dangling!!!

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Originally Posted by Richard36

inov8 insider - are you able to be a little more specific about when in 2010 the 0 and 1 shoes will be available? After all 2010 is only 3.5 months away. I run barefoot at times and use aqua shoes but desperately need something with grip. I'm thinking of getting the X talons but suspect that even they will feel too heavy. If the new shoes came out early 2010 I would persevere with my aqua shoes.

Please do not leave us dangling!!!

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I am sorry I cant be more specific, we are testing and tweaking at the moment.
Maybe I shouldnt have said anything and got you excited.:D

I've been interested in these last couple of comments because I face a little decision to make. As mentioned, I've recently ditched the ortho-clogs (as Mr Pirie would call them) and been doing all my running in either Terrocs, aqaus, or nothing. Road marathon in Florence in just over 11 weeks and thinking I'd give the F-lite 230s a try. I thought the only difference with the PK was the sticky rubber sole (and colour). Am I right in this and is the F-lite probably the most suitable shoe for road marathons in the Inov-8 range? Was "220pk" a typo or is there a new F-lite available?

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Originally Posted by Graham Chapman

I've been interested in these last couple of comments because I face a little decision to make. As mentioned, I've recently ditched the ortho-clogs (as Mr Pirie would call them) and been doing all my running in either Terrocs, aqaus, or nothing. Road marathon in Florence in just over 11 weeks and thinking I'd give the F-lite 230s a try. I thought the only difference with the PK was the sticky rubber sole (and colour). Am I right in this and is the F-lite probably the most suitable shoe for road marathons in the Inov-8 range? Was "220pk" a typo or is there a new F-lite available?

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The f-lite 230PK is pretty much the same as the 230 except black! They both have the Performance rubber outsole

The f-lite 220PK is a new shoe - different upper fabrics and the clear rubber outsole (which I'm told is slightly less 'sticky' than the Performance rubber and slightly more sticky than the Endurance rubber)

I run in F-lite on and off road with no problem. Its its dry then off road is fine but in the mud they don't have enough grip.

Recently I have been trying them with the footbeds removed. You feel even more in contact with the ground but it does hurt your calves and achilles a bit more to begin with as your body gets used to them. I've been thinking about getting the 285 as these are pretty much the same as the F-lite but with the roclite sole I believe.

I have used the f-lite 230 exclusively as my road shoe for quite a while now - and have run over marathon distance in them.

I'm looking forward to giving the 220PK a good thriping too, as it should retain most of the excellent traction qualities of the 230, but be a little more hardwearing
(That's my hope!)

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Originally Posted by sjedwardz

I run in F-lite on and off road with no problem. Its its dry then off road is fine but in the mud they don't have enough grip.

I've been thinking about getting the 285 as these are pretty much the same as the F-lite but with the roclite sole I believe.

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Yup the 285 has a similar fit to the 230, the same low profile ( 2 cushion) but has a sticky rubber Roclite lugged sole and a rand for protection.

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Originally Posted by Inov-8 Insider

Yup the 285 has a similar fit to the 230, the same low profile ( 2 cushion) but has a sticky rubber Roclite lugged sole and a rand for protection.

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My new 285s arrived yesterday. Much snugger fit than 305/315. I was sceptical re sticky rubber but a 20min walk in them was interesting :) Rand is relatively soft and I suspect is more to protect shoe from wear and tear than runners' toes ;)

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Originally Posted by eLBee!

I have used the f-lite 230 exclusively as my road shoe for quite a while now - and have run over marathon distance in them.

I'm looking forward to giving the 220PK a good thriping too, as it should retain most of the excellent traction qualities of the 230, but be a little more hardwearing
(That's my hope!)

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I am looking forward to the 220pk being a bit more widespread as I could only find from beyond extreme, and I would like to try them on before I buy.

They look great shoes! Let me know how you get on with them

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Originally Posted by AJF

I am looking forward to the 220pk being a bit more widespread as I could only find from beyond extreme, and I would like to try them on before I buy.

They look great shoes! Let me know how you get on with them

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OK - a first short and easy 7 mile road run in the f-lite 220's, and here are my Initial impressions:
Snug around the ankle but with enough room and 'looseness' in the forefoot for the foot to be able to do it's thing. In a way it 'feels' like a more substantial shoe than the 230, but that may just be the newness of it. You can tell that the rubber compound is different, but the ground 'feel' is pretty good. I'll reserve judgement on them until the materials have lost their 'newness'.

The upper is very similar to the x-talon212 and will 'soften' significantly with use, and the forefoot is higher volume than the 230 (also very similar to the x-talon)
This will be great news for people that find the 230 too low profile.
Now the odd bit.
Measuring the actual soles against the 230 - they are the same - but wearing them, the 220's FEEL broader. I suspect that is because there is more nett room with the extra volume.

I want to wear these a bit more, because I'm making a comparison with my 230's that have 450 miles on them, and ALL inov-8's soften and become more flexible with use, and in fact improve with use from the perspective of allowing the foot to work in the way it was designed to !!
I also want to wear them in the wet - the 230's are fabulous for traction in turning sharp 90 degree bends at 6 min/mile in the wet. One of the best shoes I've ever worn from that perspective - and I an intrigued to find out how well the 220's compare.

That said, I could feel the joints in the asphalt and any surface imperfections much in the same way as I can in the 230's, and the ability to 'stealth run' and scare the bejeezus out of swaggering chavlings was very much in evidence :D

Thanks eLBee,

Appreciate your mini review of the 220s. They could be just what I am looking for especially if they are a little broader in the forefoot.
I've found them at Beyond Extreme, but nowhere else, can't even find them on the Inov-8 website yet. I guess they will feed out to other suppliers soon, hopefully some here down south too.

barefoot running experiment

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Originally Posted by Graham Chapman

Thanks eLBee,

Appreciate your mini review of the 220s. They could be just what I am looking for especially if they are a little broader in the forefoot.
I've found them at Beyond Extreme, but nowhere else, can't even find them on the Inov-8 website yet. I guess they will feed out to other suppliers soon, hopefully some here down south too.

barefoot running experiment

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Its now on our site. HERE
More dealers will be stocking this, the F-Lite 230 & Roclite 285 as the demand for minimalist "natural running" shoes is starting to be on their radar:)

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Originally Posted by Graham Chapman

Thanks eLBee,

I've found them at Beyond Extreme, but nowhere else, can't even find them on the Inov-8 website yet. I guess they will feed out to other suppliers soon, hopefully some here down south too.

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You could try these Guy's, they have just taken delivery and the owner is a Pose coach so some good advice.
Faster-Feet
Tel: 0845 652 4327
Fax: 0845 652 4328
Mob: 0779 555 1099
email: [email protected]

No offence to anybody.

But it does strike me as a bit ironic that this thread about nice-and-simple barefoot running is one of the most shoe-techy-geeky ones ever to emerge.

I'm glad I just wear normal shoes. Can't remember what they are now.

Brown ones.

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Originally Posted by Inov-8 Insider

You could try these Guy's, they have just taken delivery and the owner is a Pose coach so some good advice.
Faster-Feet
Tel: 0845 652 4327
Fax: 0845 652 4328
Mob: 0779 555 1099
email: [email protected]

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I know the guy from Faster Feet, he tought me how to run uphill :) and I get my shoes from him :)

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Originally Posted by Mud

No offence to anybody.

But it does strike me as a bit ironic that this thread about nice-and-simple barefoot running is one of the most shoe-techy-geeky ones ever to emerge.

I'm glad I just wear normal shoes. Can't remember what they are now.

Brown ones.

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I agree. This thread is all about flogging inov8's under the cunning disguise of pretending to be talking about running with no shoes at all :D

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Originally Posted by Stolly

I agree. This thread is all about flogging inov8's under the cunning disguise of pretending to be talking about running with no shoes at all :D

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Thats very cynical:)
I'm not trying to Flog anything just give advice to folks who ask the question about barefoot/minimalist shoes.

Yes it is slightly ironic that the self-confessed tea boy for a trainer company has three times more posts than anyone else ;)

Pesonally I'm worried about scott b. Has all this talk of sticky rubber, footbed removal and the 'ultimate racer' been simply too much for him :eek:

I'm also surprised some wag hasn't signed up yet claiming to work for Walshes :)

I find it quite refreshing that a representative from a shoe manufacturer is prepared to get involved in discussions and be so helpful. Yes, I know it's marketing, but it's also good customer service.
The fact that the company is British and seems to be going out on a limb to embrace topical and (as viewed by many) controversial ideas is a bonus.

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Originally Posted by Graham Chapman

I find it quite refreshing that a representative from a shoe manufacturer is prepared to get involved in discussions and be so helpful. Yes, I know it's marketing, but it's also good customer service.
The fact that the company is British and seems to be going out on a limb to embrace topical and (as viewed by many) controversial ideas is a bonus.

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I couldn't agree more. The more a company communitcates with the customer, the better the service or product provided will be.

Interesting website of a man running through America barefoot:

RunTellmanRun

Have a listen to this before you head out the door foot naked.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Gh5j8oUoyE

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Originally Posted by Terry the Tortoise

I couldn't agree more. The more a company communitcates with the customer, the better the service or product provided will be.

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I agree. I like the fact that II posts one here and he is pretty much inpartial, its not like we don't know who is and he's trying some kind of stealth marketing.

It's actually made me go back to Inov8 and give them a 2nd go after some bad experiences. I now have some F-lites and am thinking of getting some 285's. He also send me a VERY nice freebie so I'm not going to knock him!

Shame some of the other manufacturers are not present on this or any other board, but I don't think they share the same level of focus as the smaller brands.

Agreed.
It may be a bit techy, but the whole idea with running minimalist is to get as close to bare feet as possible and still be able to run in terrain that would be inaccessible unshod, ie rough rocky paths and fell.

To be able to achieve this could be done in a low tech manner, by simply wrapping animal skin around the foot as our ancestors may have done. Or by buying a product such as VFF, which to be fair aren't the greatest things in the wet, but have probably gone through loads of R&D nonetheless.

I think it's great that inov 8 have got a presence on here and there is no reason why Walsh or anyone else could not come on here to advise us of their products

Hear, hear! Good work to Insider and I'd love for reps of some of the other larger brands to get on on here and put their balls on the block.

I love the techy stuff but whenever stuff seems to be simple it often gets the most complicated.... have you ever seen a fixed gear thread on a cycling forum:eek:

Trying to give a natural feel/response but still afford protection and grip is a big ask but I think Inov-8 are heading in the right direction.

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Originally Posted by Graham Chapman

I find it quite refreshing that a representative from a shoe manufacturer is prepared to get involved in discussions and be so helpful. Yes, I know it's marketing, but it's also good customer service.
The fact that the company is British and seems to be going out on a limb to embrace topical and (as viewed by many) controversial ideas is a bonus.

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I agree, and he is hardly hiding who employs him, is he? :)

Over on an other running website I used to frequent I was once known as 'Miss Inov8 2008'... and I don't even work for Inov8! It is just that the shoes really suit me and the running I do :)

Cunning plan eh!

Inov8 secretly embed an employee (called Inov8 insider) in a fell running forum.
Wow thats sneeky, had me fooled;)

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Originally Posted by Derby Tup

My new 285s arrived yesterday. Much snugger fit than 305/315. I was sceptical re sticky rubber but a 20min walk in them was interesting :) Rand is relatively soft and I suspect is more to protect shoe from wear and tear than runners' toes ;)

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First run in my 285s today and really like them. Much 'racier' feel than 315 and very comfy :cool: Don't know if I'd want to run 4hours in them but great for an hour 'blast' ;)

Had another go at barefooting. This time the grass was dry and my feet didnt get too cold, unlike last time(imagine ice creame headache in your feet calves:eek:).
It felt good only ran a couple of hundred metres but will be doing it again:D

i did 5 x ~ 100m sprints mins this week on nice short park grass, was nice n cool on the tootsies. aiming to build up my barefoot sessions in distance but really enjoyed it

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Originally Posted by Derby Tup

First run in my 285s today and really like them. Much 'racier' feel than 315 and very comfy :cool: Don't know if I'd want to run 4hours in them but great for an hour 'blast' ;)

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The 285 was my shoe of choice for the Lakeland 50 this year. the 'sticky' rubber outsole is SO worth having for the slightly rougher,wetter, rocky bits which although are not THAT common, are a pain in shoes that you can't 'trust' on that terrain.
They are great on the road sections too!

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Originally Posted by eLBee!

The 285 was my shoe of choice for the Lakeland 50 this year. the 'sticky' rubber outsole is SO worth having for the slightly rougher,wetter, rocky bits which although are not THAT common, are a pain in shoes that you can't 'trust' on that terrain.
They are great on the road sections too!

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I love my 285's :) They are quite universal. Provide good grip off road, allbeit not in the muddiest of conditions, but are also comfy enough for longer road sections on runs where I have a bit of tarmac to navigate.

I like the slipper like feel of them and they are RED :D

I never got on with my 285's . They kept sliding off my heel on the up hill bits . ( funny shaped heels probably :rolleyes:)

I've just done another , slightly longer , bare foot session . 20 min warm up in field . I still felt all the little stones ,but , slightly less this time . I then donned a pair of 230's and did 6 times 15 second sprints .
I bought the 230's last year . Although they fitted really well I found them not to have enough cushioning at the time . Since reading this thread and trying to improve my midstrike foot placing I now think there will be a place for them once My legs have got used to the new style .

I'm running the village fun run http://www.funrun.hinstock.com/ on Sunday and I'll have the dilemma of which shoes (if any:D) to ware . Difficult as I don't really run on roads .

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Originally Posted by nightingale

I'm running the village fun run http://www.funrun.hinstock.com/ on Sunday and I'll have the dilemma of which shoes (if any:D) to ware . Difficult as I don't really run on roads .

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Go barefoot :)

Last year I ran a 4 mile road race, barefoot... you should have seen the faces of fellow runners and spectators!!!

I started off racing that series (one a month over the summer months) on road racing flats, Saucony Grid Fastwitch, without socks... The next race I ran in F-lite 230's which I also always wear without socks... and the third one I started off warming up by running a few stretches barefoot and though what the heck... especially when someone asked if I was going to race barefoot... OK, no pb... and slightly sore and 'glowing' hot footpads afterwards, but no other ill effects :)

It maybe a bit soon for bare foot action . It's only 3 miles but I don't think My legs are ready yet . I think I will give the 230's a road runout though instead of digging out an old pair of 60's style platform trainers .

Number of things you need to work on when going barefoot.

The calf issues happen barefoot or in VFF or in minimal shoes and you worrk through that as form gets better.

I can do 12 miles in the VFF and have done 6 barefoot but that was in a park.

None of these things prepare the soles of your feet for barefoot on tarmac or concrete or trail.

I have had to drop to half a mile on the pavements around me, on smooth concrete I can fly but I just cant find enough of it which does not have a lot of debris on it.

The Human Foot
26 BONES
33 JOINTS
107 LIGAMENTS
19 MUSCLES & TENDONS
Let them work as nature intended.


Natural Running Courses
HERE

Tried a barefoot fell run this afternoon... well for about 1.5 miles of it anyway.

What strange sensations! Once my feet were numb enough didn't even mind the stony bits! No grip for steep descents though... did that on my backside. Was ok scrambling up a steep climb (Spring Bank from Alden Brook nr Bull Hill) but would have preferred a bit more grip. Loved the feeling of mud squishing between my toes!:D

Just finished reading Born To Run.

Exellent book enjoyable and inspiring.

thanks for the recomendation.