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So the statistics seem to support the fact that what we have been doing for years is perfectly good enough and one isolated incident, albeit a very sad and tragic one, does not change this, statiscally it is an anomolly. Please, I don't want to offend anyone and I might feel differently if I were personnally involved but I would hope not to.
So, rather than write or phone you repeatedly put the same complaints over and over on here? Where they are available for anyone to see and for people to potentially use to show that the FRA hasn't taken the matter seriously? (Which I believe they have, by the way.)Quote:
Originally Posted by alwaysinjured
Interesting.
If somebody repeatedly had a go at something that you had done in a public forum, would you eventually get fed up with them and stop responding?
They would not have to do it repeatedly: I would do them the courtesy of responding the first time, taking note of what was said, without insulting them in the process, and I would certainly look into whatever was said to make sure I had not missed something.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lecky
Repeating comes from failure to address the issue, not my failure I hasten to add.
I think if you were an RO hauled across burning coals you would think very differently.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigfella
These documents are only read by hostile lawyers when something goes wrong, which is rare - but the documents are also the safety net.
If I am landing on a safety net, I would prefer it was not full of holes, indeed the nature of the safety net would make a massive difference to whether I was willing to take to the high wire (ie organise a race) in the first place.
This safety net seems to have some very sharp spikes in places! ( or should I say it has hazards in compulsory sections! - my form of acerbic/sarcasm, which is rather more on topic)
I think things have changed now.. you do get many incompetent runners.. many total novices.. its great more are getting into the sport but we've had a few there by the grace of god incidents.. Wendy Dodd was talking about one lakeland race where she found someone wanting to lie down, they were very cold, awful weather, they'd have been dead in minutes..Quote:
Originally Posted by bigfella
I was marshalling in the Elidir race in pretty shocking weather and I'd say 1/3rd of the field had no idea of the route.. nor had a map.. or couldn't have used it. It was a bit of an eye opener how much people think a race is a safe environment..
Statistically it is still low, and will remain that way but runners are putting more pressure on RO's.. so you can understand more rules and regulations.. I think their hand is somewhat forced there. As someone said it is down to runners to take responsibility for themselves, but unfortunately that isn't enough.
We've seen it on here, people will advise people to do races if they cant get around a route solo.. which is just staggeringly incompetent.
I do agree with Wheeze that fell running should have as few rules as possible, but unfortunately thats just not the way of the world anymore and its not enough.
The "follow the number in front of you" mentality worries me too! I remember a langdale race in clag where people were coming in from all over the map , hours later, having followed the number in front of them into armageddon. Those are my kind of races, I can out navigate a lot more people than I can outrun.Quote:
Originally Posted by IainR
I even took the time and trouble to explain in the car park to someone who had not yet done it how to navigate at sedbergh, explaining the critical part over the cols to checkpoint before the path up to the calf, even citing the key bearings and gave him a highlighted one page map. Yet who shall be nameless , followed a well known lady runner, straight up the wrong ridge to the calf one checkpoint to early , and retired failing to finish the route.
The problem with navigation in clag is , if you do not know where you are, working out what to do next can be a problem, and unless navigation is in the back of your mind at all times, you are not keeping tabs on where you are. That needs to be impressed on runners, keep checking the features you expect to see check off in your mind as you pass them, then at least you have some inkling on where you are , or were at the last known location.
More races run in pairs might be one partial answer to the safety concerns: they do it at county tops and on mountain marathons.
Would it not be beneficial to request a meeting to sit down and chat about all this? All sides are doing it all for the good of the sport, unless we iron out issues all this typing will be pointless.Quote:
Originally Posted by alwaysinjured
None of us are perfect, no one has made any mistakes on purpose if any has been made, but surely to god we are able to sit down round a table and iron it out??
Just a thought?
I backed away from this thread for a little while. Partly in consideration of what Lecky posted as I have plenty of respect for him, what he has done on the junior side and I was under the impression he felt similarly of me, based on the "working" relationship we had back then and the regular chats we have when we meet up.
So was I being just objectionable for the sake of it?
I think not and I think Lecky acknowledged himself that he hadn't read the thread through - who can blame him after all it's so long and it has many twists and turns.
I genuinely feel that AI has raised some genuine concerns.
I'm an experienced RO and that covers all the main athletic disciplines and what this thread has done has made me read the RO's literature more thoroughly. So regardless of all other matters, that should be a good thing in itself, as I'm sure other ROs will do likewise.
I think that Sam Harrison has got it about spot on and I do hope that people in positions to re-look at this are gracious enough to do so.
If they do not want to do so in the public glare of the forum, then they can certainly instigate a dialogue away from the forum.
I also think the letter idea might be useful and may well go down that route myself.
I agree Amex. A good idea. I've recently seen a shift at England Athletics and attended a road show at Trafford.Quote:
Originally Posted by Amex
They listened to everyone's opinions and you can see that they have taken quite a lot on board.
So maybe the way forward would be to have a ROs conference and invite ROs to come along and discuss the matter.
I'm sure a venue such as Marl Pits in Rossendale, or Horwich RMI could be set up.
'AI' could you clear some space in your inbox? I have a PM for you.