Resignation fromCommittee

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Originally Posted by Witton Park

Ditto

and all this guff about volunteering and experience. The sport of athletics is full of experience and volunteers.
The people on the FRA committee are no more learned or worthy than those at club, County, XC league committee level.
Criticism is not coming from a bunch of anarchic firebrands, it's coming from other experienced volunteers who may in some cases have greater or broader experience.

Andy W actually had long and specific experience that most right minded people would have expected to have been utilised by the exec of the FRA.

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My long obsevation in athletics context, is that the only people who seem to want to run a committe are those least suited to do it because they seem to be motivated by authority rather than fulfill responsibility. I am glad we do not have a blazer brigade!

The ones I take my hat off too, are the ones out in all weather every week for decades in hands on event management and coaching, who suffer at the hands of committee decisions in which they have no influence.

I am describing you Richard!

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Originally Posted by alwaysinjured

My long obsevation in athletics context, is that the only people who seem to want to run a committe are those least suited to do it because they seem to be motivated by authority rather than fulfill responsibility. I am glad we do not have a blazer brigade!

The ones I take my hat off too, are the ones out in all weather every week for decades in hands on event management and coaching, who suffer at the hands of committee decisions in which they have no influence.

I am describing you Richard!

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Although I can understand your point of view,I have to differ from you here Mike. I'm on a few committees as well as you know. The Club committee and Lancs AA function very well, but perhaps the one I've been involved with that impresses me most is the Red Rose Cross Country League which is run really well by my friend from Rossy, Steve Duxbury.
I have seen some people land on committees for the wrong reasons, but they don't tend to last that long or have much impact.
I was asked a few years ago to stand in for Alan Barlow at a CAU meeting as he couldn't make it. I had a real good feeling about that group as well. Very welcoming, immersed in the sport and with the welfare of the sport in their hearts.

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Originally Posted by Witton Park

Although I can understand your point of view,I have to differ from you here Mike. I'm on a few committees as well as you know. The Club committee and Lancs AA function very well, but perhaps the one I've been involved with that impresses me most is the Red Rose Cross Country League which is run really well by my friend from Rossy, Steve Duxbury.
I have seen some people land on committees for the wrong reasons, but they don't tend to last that long or have much impact.
I was asked a few years ago to stand in for Alan Barlow at a CAU meeting as he couldn't make it. I had a real good feeling about that group as well. Very welcoming, immersed in the sport and with the welfare of the sport in their hearts.

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The days of carlings "boring old farts" are probably long since done. It is the best part of a decade since I was much involved, and I am sure things have moved on, although the decisions of guys like collins, at the time of Bejing, and athlete contracts that allow such people to override athletes and own coaches, complete with gagging clauses, Illustrated the mentality of that generation.

I have to say I avoid committees, for the main part I just had to live with decisions. I much preferred running a hammer event, to talking about one! I guess I also consider officialdom together, committees and senior graded officials in blazers, where in reality they are two different things.

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Originally Posted by alwaysinjured

The days of carlings "boring old farts" are probably long since done. It is the best part of a decade since I was much involved, and I am sure things have moved on, although the decisions of guys like collins, at the time of Bejing, and athlete contracts that allow such people to override athletes and own coaches, complete with gagging clauses, Illustrated the mentality of that generation.

I have to say I avoid committees, for the main part I just had to live with decisions. I much preferred running a hammer event, to talking about one! I guess I also consider officialdom together, committees and senior graded officials in blazers, where in reality they are two different things.

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Certainly Collins, De Vos etc are paid execs that in the main have little affinity for the sport and will come and go. They have no bearing on the volunteer committees that exist up and down the country where in some cases people are clocking up many decades.
There is a problem though - that of renewal.
Despite my relatively young years (in terms of committee folk and officialdom) I have found that the incumbents rarely get challenged.
I had team managed our NATYAL (Junior T&F) team for 5 years. The team had done very well gaining promotion and staying in the top division.
I wanted out.
No one would take the job on.
I did a 6th year and decided to resign that job.
5 people came forward to offer their services. One committee member and 4 others.

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Originally Posted by Witton Park

Certainly Collins, De Vos etc are paid execs that in the main have little affinity for the sport and will come and go. They have no bearing on the volunteer committees that exist up and down the country where in some cases people are clocking up many decades.
There is a problem though - that of renewal.
Despite my relatively young years (in terms of committee folk and officialdom) I have found that the incumbents rarely get challenged.
I had team managed our NATYAL (Junior T&F) team for 5 years. The team had done very well gaining promotion and staying in the top division.
I wanted out.
No one would take the job on.
I did a 6th year and decided to resign that job.
5 people came forward to offer their services. One committee member and 4 others.

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A sorry experience.

It is also what I do not get. When a committee is offered willing advice, and willing solvers of problems as Andy did on safety (and my volunteering to help) , it is amazing they turn it down, when so few are willing to come forward.

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Originally Posted by alwaysinjured

A sorry experience.

It is also what I do not get. When a committee is offered willing advice, and willing solvers of problems as Andy did on safety (and my volunteering to help) , it is amazing they turn it down, when so few are willing to come forward.

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Hear, hear! Quite incredible!

When a certain direction has been taken and much work done, then someone comes along and says excuse me, I think that you need to rethink and start again, it would be very frustrating for anyone.

I imagine that part of the reason Andy W was obstructed was a sort of instinctive defence mechanism. "You pesky varmint coming along so late in the day when the work is almost done! How Dare you!!"

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Originally Posted by Witton Park

When a certain direction has been taken and much work done, then someone comes along and says excuse me, I think that you need to rethink and start again, it would be very frustrating for anyone.

I imagine that part of the reason Andy W was obstructed was a sort of instinctive defence mechanism. "You pesky varmint coming along so late in the day when the work is almost done! How Dare you!!"

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I understand that. But see my thread "A perfect Storm"

By the same token, fellrunning would perform Brain Surgery on the basis of who has elected authority, rather than qualification to do so, and those who could put a stop to it, seem to sit on sidelines being "Impartial". Since FRA is now a company and the committee are de facto directors, they should consider their role. Much of the role of non execs is to question what is done, and ensure compliance of it - and that is the role of committee outside the narrow niche of their specific responsibility in a properly functioning organisation

My criticism is not that they did not heed his advice on what should happen, they used all means to refuse to even HEAR it. And that is manifestly irresponsible with safety. He asked for a seat at the safety table, where they could outvote him anyway, so there is no justification for excluding him. His other request to keep matters open, rather than close them as tablets of stone is simply common sense - and by inviting him into the process, less will spill out into public debate instead. Cannot see what is gained.

It is also ridiculous in other ways. What I cannot get through to the powers that be, is every single RO does a plan ranging from back of fag packet quality, to near professional. So we are not suggesting anything that is not already being done. Just making the RO do it to a proper standard and including some parts they may not have thought of, but are essential. Rules are not a plan, they only influence how one is written. (or not written in some cases!!)

A pity we don't have a system as in New Zealand, as far as I can gather their ACC(accident compensation corporation) covers everyone for everything, there is no need for any liability insurance. http://www.acc.co.nz/making-a-claim/...ered/index.htm

For instance, there is no need for car insurance, this is financed by a levy on fuel and car tax.

So, organising a fell race doesn't need insurance or any worry about claims, automatically covered. This is how I understand it, interesting concept, but put a vast numbers of lawyers out of work!!

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Originally Posted by Graham Breeze

But there is not a single assertion that has been made on this Forum or facebook that cannot be truthfully and completely answered by the Committee. But there are only 22 of us and 7500 members and Officers do have other things to do in the interests of the membership and if the Committee starts responding to every point on here it will need to grow to 23 people by employing a full time media officer.
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some of us wonder who will step forward to take our places if members really believe what they can read on here .

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So how come no such answer has been made? A single reply that truthfully and completely answered even just the main points that have been made, would have put an end to all this weeks ago. I am a complete outsider, know nobody involved, and just run in a handful of events each year. I have served on several committees and know what a thankless task it can be; my default position is to trust those who are running things. Yet I see what on the surface seems like a reasoned argument from one group of people, and I see no response other than occasional insults from the other.

If you don't want members to believe what they read on here, you really need to tell us the reasons why its is wrong.

And I know you're all busy. But what is more important than the subject of safety?