Hi AdyQuote:
Originally Posted by Ady In Accy
nice to see you yesterday. have ordered 3 pics off your website
cheers
Ade
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Hi AdyQuote:
Originally Posted by Ady In Accy
nice to see you yesterday. have ordered 3 pics off your website
cheers
Ade
Well done on the PBQuote:
Originally Posted by geronimo
Interesting reading back through this thread and noting folk saying the race starts at Hill Inn. Looking at my progress on the SI page i was 470th at Hill Inn, 411th on Ingleborough and finished 365th overall. 105 places up from Hill Inn to finish. Not really my tactics, tend to run how i feel, but set off steady, felt good at Hill Inn and pushed it from there. Ingleborough to finish was hard into that wind though and took a tumble near Sulber Nick, no cuts but a nice big bruise on my back today and my legs snapped together when i landed crushing my you know whats!
Hes's stats will be the same as she caught me at Hill Inn and was a second behind me at the finish, don't think she fell though and if she did she wouldn't have crush injuries!
9 EQUIPMENTQuote:
Originally Posted by FRAFixtures
Competitors should arrive at races prepared to carry any or all of the following equipment:-
Windproof whole body cover
other body cover appropriate for the weather conditions.
Map and compass suitable for navigating the course.
Whistle
Emergency food (long races)
This is what is mandatory in AL and AM and I don't think most runners would class hat and gloves in with full body cover - if that is what the FRA intend, then they should clarify that. I have also assumed that a jacket with a hood is covering the head for example.
If it was mandatory then the organisers wouldn't be asking for it would they as additional items - so clearly the race organiser doesn't see hat and gloves as mandatory for an A category.
The athletes didn't either, hence Pete Blands sold out of hats and gloves on a Sunny Spring day.
1 SENIOR EVENTS
The general philosophy behind the following requirements is that the COMPETITOR should take primary
responsibility for his/her own safety on the fells
Now I run most XC races in hat and gloves, so it's not that I am averse to them - but surely this places the ultimate responsibility on the athlete?
Surely the easy way round all this is to carry hat and gloves all the time, they pack up small and weigh nothing and wouldn't slow the slowest of runners down in any way. I keep them in my bumbag all the time if i'm not wearing them.
I agree, Graham earlier said he was fed up of people mentioning this but it would be pretty easy to stop it happening if the kit requirements were clarified slightly to make it clear (I'm not having a dig at you Graham by the way).Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
This is a true story.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Furness
I used to be very involved in a multi-terrain race and one year a guy turned up to compete in a wheel chair + his "pusher". He was adamant that he be allowed to enter. Now it was impossible for him to complete the course without a lot of man-handling assistance etc etc.
I have not checked but I don't think it says in the FRA Rules etc that you cannot compete in fell races in a wheel chair...but I am sure you catch my drift?
A great race, a great event, a great occasion - let's celebrate with a little whine!
But seriously:
This was my first three peaks, and I thought it was hard as nails. My target was to break four hours and I crested that final rise to see the whole of the finish area below me just as my watch bleeped four hours - final result 4:03:04.
I will be back next year after an early spring beasting myself on the climbs.
I don't normally hang around for awards ceremonies as I never win anything, but I'm glad I stayed for this one. It was inspiring and moving by turns and made me proud to be a part of this sport and this tradition.
I'm looking forward to doing the 60th 3 Peaks.
Cheers.
I'm with you Steve, below is what lives in my bum bag.Quote:
Originally Posted by stevefoster
Full body cover + Buff and gloves, compass and whistle along with 2 compeed plasters, 2 anti inflams, 2 pain killers, small amount of Vas, 5m bandage, 2 KFC salt bags & 1 energy gel.
All that plus 500ml and 300ml went up Coniston Old Man just to watch a race, and it and me all returned safely, except the water. I had the 300 and I shared the 500 with the runners.
Thanks AS! Wise words and I will take them onboard! :thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Antisocial
And thanks to everyone else for your well wishes and messages xxx :)
One good thing...I didn't expect to be walking like a normal person today! :wink:
What has that got to do with anything? It also doesn't say anywhere in the rules that I can't compete with a Giraffe in my rucksack but that doesn't mean it's a good idea does it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Graham Breeze
I wasn't intending that you write every single possible rule you can think of, but maybe changing "full body cover" to jacket, trousers, gloves and a hat might be a good idea.
groan
Know what you mean Clive, double groan!Quote:
Originally Posted by Clive
Apologies for getting involved folks, what started as an observation has re-opened the obligatory can of worms.
No apolgies needed Rob, everyone's entitled to their opinion, just think if everyone took a kit bag full of tackle and saw what was needed on the day job would be right, mind you Pete Bland wouldn't take as much brass.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Furness
You're absolutely right, I certainly do that and my clubmates do the same. My input was just to suggest that this apparent "confusion" that crops up all the time would disappear if the rules were re-worded very slightly even though it would effectively mean exactly the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by stevefoster
I've always carried what I think I need anyway, which is often more sensible than the mandatory requirements anyway.
Surely the fact that this issue keeps coming up tells us that the kit requirements need to be clearer. As Rob has said the actual change in the wording that is needed is tiny.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Furness
It was my first Three Peaks yesterday. Crumbs, that was hard. I've been injured on and off for the last six weeks, but had a good mileage / climbing base and better performances early this year, so I thought I'd get stuck in.
I had a great chat with Manhar at the start, and then got stuck in on my plan: 1 minute up half way up PYG, on top spot on time (48 mins), and still bang on at Ribblehead (2 hrs 1 min). By then though I was suffering badly with a blister on my right heel. I wondered about getting it looked at but it wasn't too bad and the next bit was uphill anyway so I though sod it and just kept going.
I didn't find the top bit of the Whernside climb too bad, it's more the two steepish bits between Hell Gill and the bottom of the very steep final ascent that were hard. I walked almost all of this :(. I did have jellied legs at the top though and staggered badly in the wind trying to cover the five yards to the marshall with the dibber thingy. I struggled a bit to get running on the descent and never really found a rhythm again. I made it to Hill Inn with about 7 minutes to spare and about 5 minutes down on my (5 hours ish) schedule.
The Ingleborough section was really hard - I lost a lot of time on the ascent, walking all of the flat bit about 200 yards behind Manhar. He must have made a very good fist of the steep bit and the descent to finish 10 minutes ahead of me. The spectators on this section were superb - I had several drinks of water on the way up (my energy drink was interfering with my guts) and just the general encouragement can carry you along for a bit. It was very hard running on the top, and also disappointingly difficult down the first part of the descent. I had a walk and a breather just before the ladder stile and then managed to run the rest of the way to the start of the limestone pavement at Sulber Nick. I had to walk almost the whole of the flat bit after the check point and couldn't work out why, reading the preceding posts it must have been the wind as well as just general knackeredness. Anyway when the gradient steepened I got moving again and eventually managed a sprint finish to skip in front of Nigel Crompton, who I'd followed much of the way down (sorry Nigel) and stay in front of David Timmins, without who's encouragement I'd have finished another minute and a half down. Anyway, despite falling apart a bit I did finish, in 5:16:26.
My feet are destroyed, no skin on either heel and various smaller blisters on the balls of my feet from having to midfoot strike from about 4 miles in. Crumbs, those paths were hard and rough! Other than that, I'm ok tonight and certainly learned a lot of things (mostly ones I already knew - don't race in untried gear, in this case socks, or use untried nutrition etc. etc.)
I'm sure I could take a lot of time of this if I run this race again - I may even come back!
Thanks to Dan, Pete, Andrew, Manhar, Tim and Helen (and countless others) for their support. I've achieved one of the ambitions I had two years ago when I started fellrunning.
Jim
PS: Mandatory gear discussion seems a bit tedious - surely if the RO asks you to carry something you can just b****y carry it, after all he's the one who'll end up at an inquest if something goes badly wrong. I'll be taking over one of our races in a year or two and I would be well fed up if someone came to grief because they didn't carry kit when they were asked to. OK it probably wasn't the right call on the day yesterday, but the RO and team put a lot of effort in so we can enjoy ourselves - why can't everyone just respect their decision?
I didn't really mind having to buy some children's gloves & a balaclava. Or having a thorough kit check at the start. I had my whistle, compass, waterproof, gels, fluid etc. What irks me slightly is people being told, upon having a kit check & having some kit missing, that it was ok to race. What's the point have kit stipulations if they're not adhered to ? One rule for one etc.
Referees decision is final.Quote:
Originally Posted by jtinnion
My slowest Three Peaks out of 9 races. Got round trouble free and with no cramp problems, it must be the Nuun tablets,they really do seem to work
But then if it was correctly graded as a BL then the mandatory kit requirements would be different anyway??
Lights blue touch paper and walks away....
I suppose the said nice lady could, and should, have disqualified you on the spot. But I don't think the fact that she didn't is grounds for complaining about the "inconsistency" of rule enforcement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
Good one Dom :) - I prefer to think of the 3P as a nightmare AL but with an effing nightmare of a 5.5 mile run in bolted on the end!Quote:
Originally Posted by dominion
As for the gloves and hat debate its all a bit of a mountain out of a mole hill but announcing that they wanted what might have been 900 + runners to carry hats and gloves on the morning of the race, when Pete Bland had half a dozen of each to sell, when the weather forecast was 16 degrees and sunny, albeit windy, when the previous two days weather had been the same and it had been hot (not cold) and breezy, when the definition of 'full body cover' is hardly bleeding obvious and, when queried, the officials for many runners changed their tune stating that gloves and hats were recommended rather than compulsory was lets face it a bit of a farce :)
What's the story with its rating by the way? Because as you say it's technically a BL. Is it because it's so close to being an AL that its classed as that instead? I've probably missed many a debate about this in the past so apologies for any repetition!Quote:
Originally Posted by dominion
Any AL under the sun could be made a BL by just adding a long straight and/or downhill bit on the end ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Harrison
The inconsitency was what (if anything) irked me slightly. I had a mad panick when registering I was told "at the full kit check we are particularly loking for hat & gloves", because I hadn't taken any. I ended up buying a pair of socks from PB for gloves and the only hat I could find was one of the big think 3P ones, somehow I fit them in me OMM bumbag as well as the other kit, gels & water. The only kit check I had was a guy at the start asking if I had everything on his list without opening the bag & it was blatantly obvious from the size of some people's bags that they did not have everything.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jez Hellewell
However, I consider arriving without hat & gloves to be me showing my fell running inexperience & it's a lesson learned for future. I can't criticise the organisers for what was a fantastic day, my first PPP and cannot wait until next year! Hopefully by then my quads will have recovered from the ascent up Ingleborough & painful descent. I struggled on to a slightly disappointing 5:04 but just to have finished feels good, worry about times next year.
Many many thanks to all involved in organising this fantastic race, and to all the supporters out on the course, without those extra sweets dished out I'm sure I wouldn't have made it!
Really looking forward to a second go at Holme Moss now, hopefully see some of you there.
Anyway, getting away from hat and gloves, this Kiwi lady is an experienced runner, she ran a slightly faster time in the 2008 3 Peaks but didn't win, think there's been an article on her in the Fellrunner mag as well, well done to Anna for winning and Tom Owens:thumbup:Quote:
Originally Posted by TheReverand
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSD0Dka1ukI
How on earth not? Surely it's a perfect example of inconsistent rule enforcement; someone was found to be breaking a rule that had been emphasised repeatedly over the tannoy and the sanction imposed was 'oh well, never mind'?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark L
I suspect the marshall involved (and probably all of them involved actually) had not been told what to do in the event of a kit check failure. Had there been an incident (made worse by inadequate kit) that resulted in legal action then the failure to apply effective kit checks could have caused a lot of trouble for the organisers.
Bottom Line; If you impose a rule then that rule should be fair (which it probably was) and consistently applied (which it clearly wasn't). It's a shame to dq someone from a race just for kit but perhaps it would emphasise just how important kit really can be. The FRA advice to organisers (an excellent and easy to read document btw) makes it clear that random or complte kit checks should be performed and that failure to comply should result in instant disqualification
I have no problem with the mandatory kit on this race; hat and gloves could make quite a difference to an injured, dehydrated runner stuck on whernside waiting for mountain rescue. I spoke to several spectators, dressed in fleece etc, who had given up spectating yesterday because of the windchilll. I agree that hat and gloves should be specifically mentioned in the kit requirements; to suggest that they should be inferred from the phrase 'whole body cover' is just self important pedantry (but then we're used to that; it's a forum after all!). Maybe the FRA should look at re-wording the advice that they give on the subject.
Well put AA.Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyA
Lets not argue about the merits of carrying a giraffe in your bumbag or the intricacies of getting a wheelchair down Whernside, here's a pic to remind you what the day was really about:
http://adyinaccy.smugmug.com/Other/M...%20pics-XL.jpg
Hi did not run on sat due to injury so took some photo's ,here http://www.flickr.com/photos/marcus351/sets/72157626624715920/feel free to take any,Cheers.
Making you money on the side?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ady In Accy
Indeed Auntie. How much are they ?
They're £3.50 Jez, which I don't think is bad if you get a good picture. A lot better than the £10-20 some race photographers seem to charge
How was I breaking a rule? It was a request - that was how it was put to me. I advised that I did not have the said equipment and was told nevermind. As for the tanoy - I never heard any announcement on it, perhaps due to where I was parked.Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyA
I am not an athlete who travels light, I take more than what is required.
Windproof whole body cover
other body cover appropriate for the weather conditions.
As I posted earlier, this is what it says - I class hat & gloves as the "other" and it says appropriate for the weather conditions. Taken with the Section about a runners self responsibility I think that it is CLEAR that
1. Windproof Jacket and Trousers are required.
2. The organiser may insist on a stricter line such as Waterproof, hat, gloves.
3. Ultimate responsibility lies with the athlete.
The organiser didn't insist - they asked - certainly of me. If I'd been told it was a must, I would have tried to do something about it.
BUT
I would have been compromised in other ways. My OMM bumbag was full to the brim with OTHER products that I felt were appropriate to the conditions and my requirements as a runner.
I would have also needed to buy a new bumbag, or leave some of my water, 4:1 Energy Powder, Salt Sachets, Gels, Ibuprofen Gel.........
Stolly's post 3031 sums it up perfectly. The RO were wishy-washy in their delivery of the information and therefore the response was confused and patchy.
True Rob, a great memento of a fantastic day. Still didn't see you mind.....................
Is that because for another £1.50 Adey will photoshop your head onto an athletes body. So Rob actually had his feet up watching Swapshop or whatever is on telly on a Saturday morning these days.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jez Hellewell
I had a poor run, wasn't my day at all. Struggled up Penyghent with a tight chest (think it was the wind and the dust making it hard to breathe) so didn't really get started till near the top. Picked up ok on the descent and overtook loads of people, carried on fine to Ribblehead where I was in 200th place then twisted my knee in the small boggy area (misjudged it) and struggled like hell up whernside. By the time I got to Hill Inn I was in 400th place and hurting so had to pull out :angry:Quote:
Originally Posted by Jez Hellewell
I probably should've done just thatQuote:
Originally Posted by Antisocial
Can he photoshop someone else's face onto my body please; preferably someone who looks like they're having a good time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Antisocial
Actually, I was well chuffed with my time; did 4:20 on my first PPP last year, was hoping for 4:10 at best on sat but managed to fight the recurrent cramp warnings off to finish in 3:57. I don't carry water so i factored in a 30 sec drink stop at every water point, combined with 4x snack bars (Asda brand milky way, very tasty!). Wind probably helped more than hindered; reduced the sweat loss to keep me just the right side of the dehydration point.