5 month puppy...how far?

...how far can our 5 month puppy go?

i thought a pup would be self limiting on exercise and if asked to do too much would sit down/look tired

but a bit of research indicates that they don't self limit and too much exercise could be bad for their physical development and lead to problems later in life.

molly is a bedlington terrier - whippet cross, she has been for a few 2 mile jogs (hopefully to no permanent damage) since the weekend.

should we hang fire on this til she's older?

hoping IainR and other dog owning forumites can advise.

I'd hang fire until a bit older, a friend of mine told me once we'd got our dog to take it easy for the first twelve months, it's a lab, and then do what you want. He did however say once the dog has passed the stage where there are no longer any massive growth spurts they shuld be ok for exercise. As such I was taking mine out from about ten and a half eleven months old. He loved it, but he wasn't allowed off his lead because of his fondness for sheep. Hope that helps.

We were advised by our vet, who knew we went out on the hills with our previous dog, not to take our then new Lab puppy up any "mountains" until he was a year old to let his bones grow and settle. (The vet is possibly the same that Iain uses as we lived near Caernarfon at the time)

He was more than ready for it and his first birthday was a trip (hare brained run for him) up Moel Eilio. In the long run (sorry no pun intended) it was probably a good thing as he was fit and active until he was eleven, running alongside us on mountain bike rides and going for longish runs in the fells. For a Lab he was very fit.

Just be patient - this time next year you'll be posting about not being able to keep up with him!

thanks guys - any feel for how long time/distance is ok for walkies?

in google research i think i read 5 minutes per month (rule of thumb) - does than sound right?

i also read that the stairs, jumping, and stop start games like fetch can be bad for them.

We took ours out a bit earlier, just before she was 6 months, but only for shortish fell runs where we were taking it easy, she's always hated the roads. But didn't let her jump styles, or too much steep rocky ground to save her joints.

Things like Eilio were perfect for her because it was just nice soft grass. For a fit collie our slow steady run was basically her walking pace anyway.

We asked the vet and she said just see how she goes, just avoid styles etc because there is a risk of hip displacia.

We also didn't take her out that often. We'd run every day and she's be out a few times a week running with us I think.

She did pick up a knee injury but the vet reckoned she'd done that by running up and down the steep stairs in our house. She's very injury/accident prone though. Fell over and had a cry last night as she fell in a river running in the dark..

poor dog in a river!

our stairs are really steep too.

focus currently on the "not puling on the lead" (basically stopping when she starts pulling) and "recall training" - any tips gratefully accepted (random bumper treats of cheese or ham instead of normal biscuit working quite well)

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Originally Posted by ratfink

any tips gratefully accepted (random bumper treats of cheese or ham instead of normal biscuit working quite well)

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Just concentrate on sheep, a sheep chaser is the biggest impediment to aving a nice relaxing day out. Take them to sheep as soon as possible, really work on it. Saves a lot of stress and easier to do sooner rather than later.

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Originally Posted by ratfink

thanks guys - any feel for how long time/distance is ok for walkies?

in google research i think i read 5 minutes per month (rule of thumb) - does than sound right?

i also read that the stairs, jumping, and stop start games like fetch can be bad for them.

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We used to give ours three ten-15 minute walks a day, once he'd learned to walk on his lead. He refused to go anywhere on his lead until he quickly learnt that we may be going fun places like the park, the we had the nightmare of getting him off the park, not eating everything he found.

Looking back on it, it was really funny.

Graeme - she is better than TV!

Iain - what do you do with sheep? Do you have to scare her? (i'll go search for that thread on UKC)

I had a Beagle I took on runs once she was fully grown and she loved it till one day we were caught in a mini blizzard in the hills just a few miles from home.
She sat down and wouldn't budge for me despite much encouragement, lead tugging etc. In the end I had to pick her up, stick her under my cag and walk back!.
She liked sheep as well unfortunately:(

This is bringing back memories when i first took our dog out for a walk on my own. I was 12 and Henry (our dog) wasn’t very old.
I took him to the local lodge/park/woods and we had to cross and cattle grid. I accidently slipped and got my foot stuck down in the cattle grid, and with my wriggling i eventually accidently let go of the lead....the little pup came bounding back to me and decided that whilst i was unable to get away he would pounce on my head and start to chew and lick me.:D
Managed to slip my wellie off and get out in the end....scared for life from that day!

Re sheep, we just take them in the field on the lead and walk them around and just say no everytime she pulls towards them, that lays the ground work, main thing is work on them walking to heel first, then once they show no interest on the lead try letting them off. If they do go for them then we do go over the to with them, only done that once to Bella and she's neevr moved near them. T'other one will look and always watches sheep, but we think she was an ex farm dog, never chased though.

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Originally Posted by ratfink

what do you do with sheep? Do you have to scare her?

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On the farm we would get fairly regular requests for a dog to be "tupped" - basically shut in a pen with a angry testosterone fuelled, fully armed(horned) tup which would then batter the dog around until the dog decided that sheep weren't such a good idea after all.

Usually quite effective:rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Bob

On the farm we would get fairly regular requests for a dog to be "tupped"

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she is only little - she might break - looks like i need to actively seek sheep fields so she gets to know what they are and that they're out of bounds

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-...92042_7044.jpg

you might only see this if you've got facebook

Oh, she is so cute!

Last reply got lost somehow :-)

Don't let my wife see her, I'll get pestered for evermore for another dog!

The main issue is that she will see sheep as something to play with, of course the sheep will run away from what they see as a predator and this just reinforces her ideas. Keep her on lead round sheep, it's coming up to lambing time and ewes with lambs can be quite aggressive and feisty!

Good luck catching her when she decides to play silly buggers! :D
I'm in the enviable position that it's me who wants another dog and not my wife, she's got a baby to look after.

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Originally Posted by Graeme

Good luck catching her when she decides to play silly buggers! :D
I'm in the enviable position that it's me who wants another dog and not my wife, she's got a baby to look after.

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Tell her it's company for Barney, then it's not as bad for him when you are out! ;)

The only place I'm allowed to go is running!

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Originally Posted by Graeme

Good luck catching her when she decides to play silly buggers! :D
I'm in the enviable position that it's me who wants another dog and not my wife, she's got a baby to look after.

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don't you have to look after the baby then? :p

here's hoping i don't have to chase her too often!

how far can our 5 month puppy go?

Attachment 1725

This is Misty at just under 6 months on Boxing Day on our way from Hayfield up via Edale Cross to the Woolpacks and Crowden Tower, over Kinder to the Downfall and back down Sandy Heys. That's about 8 miles but walking with the kids whose main aim was to get very dirty so it took quite a few hours!

He's been walking this sort of distance since about 5 months old about once per week but only occasional days with as much climb. He gets about an hours walk most days and often about 20 minutes chasing a ball and training.

He came out on Pennine training last night for the first time - about 6 miles out of Hayfield.

Nothing seems to tire him out so it is tempting to do too much - he's quieter around the house if he's been out plenty.

He never goes more than about 200yds on the road or other hard surface.

We have been told things like not more than 15 minutes until they're 6 months old then build it up gradually but I think that applies more to some of the more pet type breeds. Our older collie Gem is 11 yrs old and is happy running 14 miles still, although she does lag behind on the downhills if I'm running quickly. She'll go all day at walking pace and would chase balls/sticks all day. We did similar amounts of walking and running with her from about 8 months.

Two different shepherds that I've spoken to have said that between 6 and 10 months old they will increase from an hour, twice a day walking to going out with them for a full days work. One of them said that she took them round the perimeter of their farm's intake fields in the Lakes following the quad bike most days from around 8 months to get them ready for work. They both expected their dogs to retire from working at about 12 to 13 yrs old.

Iain's advice re-sheep seems to be working for us; it worked with Gem.

Re: sheep it's worth remembering that a beddie x whippet has a different motivation to a collie or lab etc. All dogs have a repertoire of eye-point-stalk-chase-kill-retrieve, but in different breeds there is more or less of these different steps bred in or out. Your dog is a sighthound and has alot of 'chase-kill'. I'm a vet and dog behaviourist and suffer from an incurable obsession with sighthounds, and i have found it really difficult to get one anywhere near reliable around sheep, even with quite radical aversive therapy that would be very effective on my collie. As Iain says it can be an impediment to a fun day out!! I just take no chances and get them on lead which is a pain but better than the constant anxiety. I make sure they get plenty of chances to run loose where they are safe. That said, this is with adults with pre-existing issues- you have much better success with a pup if you do something similar to what Iain was saying.

I don't agree with the mentioned comment re: stiles and HD- hip dysplasia is mainly genetic and that is significantly more important than environmental factors. In a early maturing dog like bed x whip with low incidence of orthopaedic problems you can take more risks- i would do quite alot with it from 6m plus and no holds barred after 9m, wheres this would be insanity with a Lab for example.

Sorry to butt in but can't help myself when dogs come up on the forum :)

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Originally Posted by ratfink

don't you have to look after the baby then? :p

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I do, but I'm not very good at it. I've even managed the unthinkable and got worse with practice :eek:
He seems very comfortable round his mum, but she's still on maternity so it'll all change when she goes back to work.
On the plus side the dog thinks I'm brilliant!

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Originally Posted by Longdogs

Sorry to butt in but can't help myself when dogs come up on the forum :)

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You're definitely not butting in - you actually know what you're talking about!! Having now read your reply I can't get the Show of Hands track Longdog out of my head!

Do you think collies from working stock can be damaged by punters like me from 6 months onwards by doing too much with them?

Thanks

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Originally Posted by ratfink

she is only little - she might break - looks like i need to actively seek sheep fields so she gets to know what they are and that they're out of bounds

http://photos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-...92042_7044.jpg

you might only see this if you've got facebook

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Wow. Your dog looks exactly like ours. We had him from a similar age when he came into our lives by jumping in through a friends car window! I'll see if I can track down a picture.

He is good with sheep these days , but is mad for rabbits etc. therefore we don't trust him with lambs.

In terms of how far he can run, we didn't run when we first had him, but as an adult dog he's done lots of very long days out - BG recces and similar and also the Kinder Dozen.

I'm just remembering how utterly mad he was when he was a pup...

i have a 14 month patterdale terrier and she was fine but when we took her on the fells for the first few times she ran off with other runners mistaking them for me she did come back tho so if on the fell just keep an eye on her/he :)

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Originally Posted by RichT

Do you think collies from working stock can be damaged by punters like me from 6 months onwards by doing too much with them?

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Anything has the potential to be affected until it's skeletally mature, but cos collies are usually bred for an athletic job they don't suffer so much from genetic predisposition to the various developmental diseases that dogs can get. They're so well designed to be very active you'd have to be really going some to do alot of damage. Unless you're doing a BGR daily i wouldn't worry!

I reckon it's worth bearing in mind that most dogs will follow their pack beyond the point where it hurts them if they're asked, so we have to remember it. Shame that for most dogs it's the opposite problem- they're fat, bored and understimulated by owners who think a 20 minute stroll is alot of exercise. Oh well...

By the way do any dog lovers out there want a 9 stone deerhound x greyhound?

1/2 hour maximum
build up steady and you will soon have a very very healthy and fit dog

be careful on warm days

Sorry to disagree with Longdogs but I think to say hip dysplasia is mainly genetic is misleading and might lead people to think that if they've got a pup from parents with good hip scores they don't need to worry - have seen it happen. "While selective breeding can alter an animal's genes, factors such as diet, bodyweight and exercise have a major influence on the phenotypic expression of an individual's genotype" In Practice 2007 (not sure of issue number). Basically if you have a dog which has the genetic risk of developing HD you can reduce the risk of it actually having problems by the way you look after it in the first 12mnths or so, similarly you can take a dog with genetically good hips and still ruin it by overfeeding, over supplementation or overexercise. I don't think stiles are a problem either. Nor is sensible consistent exercise as it builds up muscle support for the joints - swimming is also good - (so don't listen to breeders who say not to walk the dog or let it go up stairs for 12mnths), but if the dog is stiff or sore after a run you're overdoing it. I'd also try and avoid very rocky routes or tussocks as the which will put abnormal stresses on the joints

wow thanks for all the responses!

longdogs - molly is from my mum who does volunteering for tia greyhound rescue (they end up with lurchers, whippets and any vaguely thin dogs) - i know what you mean about sight hounds, fine with most things - until it moves!!

Parents have recently got a rescue greyhound, about the only thing she uses her sight hound skills for are locating duvets. You have to throw her out the back door because she won't go out if its raining/cold/windy. Big dog as well, and she knows this so she plays dead when you try to get her to go outside and just acts like a dead weight. Not seen her chase yet, she watches a lot, but we don't trust her much yet so she's only allowed off the lead in areas we know are good. They've really taken to her though, and gone back to the rescue centre to sponsor a few of the older dogs which won't get homes. When she first arrived though she was a bit machine like, nothing going on, I think just institutionalised after her first 2 years of life in kennels, but she's developing all the time. Failed racer and you can see why.

Jackie i agree with you re: HD. What i wrote was poorly grammarised and read a bit wrong! I was just trying to say that you can't make a dog get HD unless it has the genetic potential for it, but the extent to which it develops is influenced by environmental factors if it already has the right genotype. I guess i'm just fed up of clients who blame their next door neighbour's cousin's grandma's laminate flooring that the dog once walked on in 1989 when in fact they've just bought a duff puppy and failed to research it. Not many people seem to understand the difference between genetic and congenital!

Hello!

Lovely pup!

I go on the 5 min per month of life rule with exercise till they are a year old. One of my friends over exercised her pup and ended up with a dog who hasn't grown right. With some breeds you have to be more careful.

Sheep - oh God - my dog is a nightmare with them she is an Alaskan Malamute and she comes fell running all the time in winter with me on a waist belt and harness. And when we enter a field with sheep she has an extra lead on - in case the harness breaks!
Have fun!

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Originally Posted by vburke

in case the harness breaks!

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Blimey!

:D Sorry should have said not the whole harness that would break just the loop of rope on the back that the tug line clips on to! She is strong but maybe not that strong!