Better than owt we've got?
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Better than owt we've got?
Check out the website his people forgot to register: www.thebrexitparty.com
He reminds me of that antibiotic resistant clap - you just can’t get rid of him can you? What kind of clown would be taken in by him?
Me. He's got my vote and i have no idea of his manifesto.
Anyone's better than the 600 spineless wasters we currently have.
I'm just looking forward to Brexit Party and UKIP tearing each other apart.
That does appear to me to be a problem for Farage. Obviously the people on these threads are more politically interested than most so can make the distinction between the Brexit Party and UKIP. But it wouldn’t surprise me if some voters will think that Farage is still in UKIP and vote accordingly.
I’m struggling to make the distinction but in fairness I’ve not been trying very hard
Edit: that Tommy Robinson looks a proper nutter; not just an idiot like Farage. He’s ex-BNP etc. A wretched human being
Re-edit: Farage had at least a couple of deeply unpleasant ‘colleagues’ in his party until recently
UKIP are neo-Nazi, whereas Farage’s party is ‘just’ deeply racist. Is that correct?
Interesting debate for you 17.4M types. Some of you are I understand quite cross, but would you vote in a European election umpteen years after voting to leave?
Vote in every election.
Someone fought to get me a vote.
Least I can do to honour them.
and yet only 2.9 million fought to rid Europe of fascism......
Are you out of touch DT or Stolly in disguise?
Out of touch with what?
Your inner self?
My inner self was fully exposed recently. I have a scar to prove it
You keep that to yourself :)
Why is it these discussions are always hijacked by emotive nonsense? There is no correlation between restricting population and racism, convenient though it is to make the accusation.
E.g. One thing migrants do not bring is accomodation. Even the most optimistic manifesto offering for house building , even by that swivel eyed despot and lie machine corbyn, comes nowhere near to housing previous rates of migrant influx levels. It doesn't matter who they are, we have an accomodation crisis, particularly in the capital. And because of the very high population density of England, by EU standards, and the 10 percent population increase we have a serious problem. How is that argument racist?
It is offensive to call others racist without due cause. Australia, Canada, New Zealand, USA and many others restrict migration.
We aren’t talking about migration or accommodation; we’re barely talking about politics with the people UKIP are mixing with - were talking about fascism. They are evil. Nazis; real Nazis not your metaphorical ones Oracle. Farage and friends - racists at best. They are bad if not truly evil
And before somone pipes up Corbyn is an utter disgrace too. An absolute letdown and about as far from a leader as it’s possible to imagine
Farage is right when he says we need new politics and new politicians: leaders, thinkers, brave people who are interested in the common good and the welfare of the people. We don’t need the way of the jackboot but sadly that could be the way we’re going
That's where I agree with you DT.
Its not my preferred route but change is needed and any good younger MPs are corrupted by seniors of their relevant party.
It will take a massive vote for the numpties to bring our regular parties back on side.
As per trump in US.
No one cares for him but he was the only option because the electorate were sick of the regular suits.
If you look at the history of UKIP it was set up out of Labour once Labour had transformed to a pro EU party in the 90s.
It failed to make any traction, especially as in the late 90s we had Goldsmith forming the referendum party. They had more money and a higher profile and I think at that time, the public hadn't really a strong opinion either way on the EU.
UKIP really didn't get anywhere until the later days of "new" labour.
The causes of the rise of UKIP were largely:
1. The EU Constitution which morphed in to the Lisbon Treaty and EU nations were getting a say, but the UK yet again didn't.
2. The open door immigration that Blair allowed, anticipating no more than 10,000 people of the new Eastern European states coming here, but the numbers went off the scale, putting pressure on housing, public services, schools places...
At the time we also had the Multiculturalism agenda - the effect of this was to shut down any discussion about immigration, accusations of racism, hard-right, fascism - these were all levelled at anyone who raised any concerns regardless of the tone.
It was as a result of this agenda that UKIP gained traction. Not because they were racist, alt-right as the thought police opined, but because they spoke like the bloke in the pub, or the couple at home, tapping in to some of the concerns people had whether they lived in a Northern town, or a Devon fishing port.
It was the establishment, versus the ordinary person.
If UKIP were right wing under Farage between say 2010 and the referendum, then a large chunk of Labour's northern vote must also have been, as they really did tap in to that demographic.
The UKIP Tories were largely old Eurosceptic Thatcherites, the UKIP Lefties were working class northern factory workers, builders...
If you look at the 2015 General Election manifesto, it was nowhere near right wing.
But since the referendum, job done (as if :D ) and the collapse of UKIP, you could say the sensible side of UKIP have left and what has been left behind are largely the right wing reactionaries.
What is left of UKIP will disappear, maybe not quite yet as they still have a degree of brand recognition, but I expect by 2020 they will be struggling to get 3% in the polls.
But now with the Brexit Party in campaign mode, I think more Eurosceptics will be drawn there, become aware of the gap between the two.
Anti EU is not right wing.
The communist party are for leave.
The SDP are for leave.
Farage will have to appeal to the left, he will have to be fairly centrist, or he'll struggle to break above the 10% level.
I think he knows that as well.
Wonder how many in this queue are from Eastern Europe? It amazing how you can lie to yourself and write that. Farage is a racist, who appeals to racist. He just has to keep a lid on it and not make it too obvious.
https://images.app.goo.gl/S7RasHvcDzTiDux86
Farage is the perfect politician for the ‘I’m not a racist but’ brigade
This Pat is a blatant out of context snippet and just demonstrates the point I was making.
I wrote quite a long thread and what do you focus on? Immigration and twist what I said, which was purely to outline that the policies of the mainstream were the driver for the UKIP's increase in the polls.
and what lie? It is on record that Labour decided not to use the limits on migration from the new EU members that others did. They did so as they didn't expect the numbers to come that did (or they did and they lied about it)
Why did he not use a queue of white people?
Out of touch with the majority of people's votes and feelings.
I don't know, but I assume as it was in reference to Turkey. It was an awful poster, not relevant to any of what I posted.
But this is what the debate has sunk to.
Migration - racist, fascist, alt right.... if you attempt to discuss it.
Referendum - let's have another in a few years when a chunk of the 52% will have died.
Farage - let's put the fear of God in to them - a torrent of indignation comes down on him including calls for him to be banned from the BBC.
Lammy - compares ERG to Nazis - reaffirms it again today on Marr - the BBC.
Tusk - there's a special place in hell for brexiteers - not an eyelid is bat by the thought police.
There’s a bit more going on in the country than this stupid ideological squabble. Think about:
The NHS
Housing
Food banks
Crime / policing budgets
Public transport
Care for the elderly
Child poverty
Then have a think about who’s (supposed to be) running the country and their input into the above. Think about how much money’s been wasting in (belatedly) planning for a no deal ‘Brexit’. How many millions wasted on a ferryless ferry deal. Wise up a bit. And do not think the likes of Trump is the answer
Aye.
Thought about it.
You're in a bubble.😂🤣
I was stopped on my run tonight and asked if I’d torn down someone’s UKIP sign (I hadn’t) apparently a runner who goes the same way as I do had, the conversation was initially quite agressive (from their side) until the fella realised we’d worked together many moons ago, I did actually tell him that I didn’t like his massive banner but explained that I am the sort of person that thinks anyone has the right to do whatever they want within reason, it did set me thinking though, how ticked off I am with the state of the nation at present, this sort of thing has never happened before, it p*ssed me off good and proper, people need to refocus, we’re being wound up by a bunch of political tossers who only care about themselves, who to be quite honest I wouldn’t have a beer with if they were the last folk on earth :mad:
Where`s WOLFIE SMITH when you need him.
http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMKsR_wUSfA
Come the REVOLUTION BRUVVERS & SISTERS;)
Theresa May's a pragmatist. That is do whatever is practical to get a result even if it's not what you want. And the guiding principle is compromise even if those you are dealing with don't want to compromise. If you follow that to it's root you see why we're where we are with Brexit. No deal is better than a bad deal becomes it's my deal - a bad deal - or no deal to it's my deal or not leaving the European union at all. Followed by we're absolutely leaving on this day to now we're leaving next month to now we're leaving next year. That's the end line of pragmatism for you.
And I know the likes of Witton believe that David Davies and co would have done it differently but they wouldn't. Davies, Johnson, Rudd etc. are just not up to it. You can see in the way they talk, their facial expressions and their constant going back on what they've said that they don't have the strength to lead a country as volatile as ours. I'm not saying they're bad people just that their belief in pragmatism dooms them right from the start.
Boris Johnson was torn over whether he was a Remainer or Leaver before the referendum. What good is he going to be when the going get's tough and he realises that us leaving the EU could possibly lead to it's destruction. That's what it could mean and he won't have the strength to take us out.
The only one who has stood his ground is Farage. Compared to May, Corbyn and nearly every other prominent politician this guy is a giant. On his radio show he's constantly predicted what May would do. And whilst Rees Mogg, Davies and Johnson were backing Mrs May's deal Farage was saying it's better to have an extension than put up with her treaty.
And you snipers on the forum who call him a racist and a fascist and all the other pigs swill hatred to try and get people away from him won't succeed. And you won't because when this country continues to wind down people will look for someone who means it, a leader. They will have to decide whether to continue with this indecisive, rotten lot or support a real patriot.
Oh and at the first opportunity I'll be voting for him even though I don't always agree. I would never vote Conservative, Labour or Liberal. Those parties don't stand up for us they just sell us out.
I agree with this entirely - I didn't use to.
I'm gobsmacked at Labour. Whilst I disagree with their policy solutions to issues on almost everything, I did genuinely think they had got their party back.
When you see a party led by Corbyn assisted by McDonnell putting forward the position on Brexit they are, the only conclusion is that it is a sell-out for political reasons.
The LibDems will never have power, but they also have known for some time that the EU is a way to paid employment for some of their key people, that was until the 2014 EU elections anyway when they were almost wiped out.
As for the Tories, they are dominated by centrist SDP aligned mush. They are in the same boat now as Labour were in 15 years ago.
The most successful political party probably in the history of the world is at a crossroads. They will either survive or suffer a terminal decline.
I reckon they've got around a month to decide which way they want to go.
Actually Tup only one policy ever actually matters:
Because any fool can find 100 useful ways to spend other peoples money in ever increasing quantities. It takes neither skill or compassion. You name but a few. We and you can all add more to your list.
The problem is hard choices with limited resources.
The trick is how to create more wealth to pay for more, which is to encourage entrepreneurs who are the start of every job and every new source of income. To make a bigger cake, not to slice it up differently which is largely inconsequential unless it actually demotivates entrepreneurs as Corbyn plans. He is definitely aiming at a smaller cake.
As a serial business creator, I would not start here again with legislation as it is now. It is already tooanti enterprise. Thats before corbyn smashes it to bits.
Sure there are disingenous and fools who claim you can spend more on everything, whilst simultaneously destroying the goose that lays the golden eggs that pays for it. There will always be some to promote that lunacy.
The sad thing is seemingly intelligent people who vote for such baloney. The same fools who will spend today failing to recognise they are stealing from the next generation, as labour invariably does. They will leave it to others to clean up the mess. But the hole corbyn plans to dig is so deep we can never get out.
There is no politician that would not increase spending in the areas you name and a few more if it could be done within present resources.
There are too many who pretend it is possible. And simply list what is wrong, whilst having no solutions. Young people are too easily bribed into voting for "more for me". Self entitlement is Corbyns mantra.That is not engaging in politicis. Engaging in politics is considering whether to spend more on somebody else.
Only one policy matters. How to make a bigger cake. The rest is easy.
Corbyn plans to reduce it day 1. 4 new bank holidays reducing GDP by at least a percent, so an instant recession. Having never done a useful days work in his life, Corbyn thinks everyone else can do nothing too.
In reality if he wants to spend more he should reduce the bank holidays (and actually enforce the state retirement age on public sector employees who seem largely immune from it)
I do agree brexit is too much of a distraction.
It would not have been if they had just done it.
Having lit the blue touch paper, I shall retire immediately...to the nearest hill.