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Thread: Tonight's football thread

  1. #5291
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    Quote Originally Posted by Llani Boy View Post
    keeps putting his arms around his precious little things, and probably reads them bedtime stories, instead of putting a firework up their arses.
    It's a bit more complicated than that, though, isn't it? For example, I'm sure Roy Keane was very good at putting a firework up the arse of a player, but his managerial record speaks for itself. (I'm thinking of a word that rhymes with 'tight'.)

    Speaking of Roy Keane's managerial record, I'm reminded of the time in the late 80s (I think) when Mick Hucknall (out of Simply Red) played for Fulchester United (alongside, if I'm not mistaken, Shakin' Stevens, as well, of course, as Billy The Fish), as chronicled in Viz magazine. As I recall, the lad Hucknall (out of Simply Red) had quite an explosive start to the game, only to fade significantly shortly afterwards, missing numerous easy opportunities to score, prompting someone in the crowd to opine "in a bizarre recreation of his musical career, Mick Hucknall's considerable early promise has been followed up by a series of lacklustre disappointments".

    In contrast to the likes of Roy Keane, Brian Clough was able to put his arm around those who would respond positively to having an arm put around them, and put a firework up the arse of those who would respond positively to having a firework up their arse (which included Keane himself, of course). Unfortunately, Mr Keane seemed only to learn part of the lesson.

    Mind you, I couldn't stand Brian Clough in his pre-Forest days. Ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now.

  2. #5292
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    I think Southgate, and managers in general, cop far too much criticism, particularly where our national team is concerned.

    Look at the calibre of managers we've had in recent times.... Capello, Eriksson, (arguably) Hodgson, i could go on.

    Did Capello suddenly become an awful manager after a couple of poor games with England? If you listen to the media and large sections of the publicc you'd think so.... or is it the usual story... that we far too easily follow the media line that we have the "best league in the world" and therefore the best crop of young talent in the world.

    When in fact we produce decent quality youngsters and teams... not world beaters... there isn't much separating us from the likes of Denmark and others that we feel we should be superior to.... and by the same token there's a bit of a gap between ourselves and the likes of Croatia, France, Holland, etc (although not necessarily a huge gulf).

    There are such small margins in football, particularly cup competitions like the world cup... we were the width of a post from being out on penalties to Colombia in the last world cup, and had that happened, Southgate would have been pilloried and sacked almost immediately. However we went on to a semi final without ever playing really well, and Southgate and the players came back as "heroes"...

    I think the sole reason we have looked so promising in the past couple of years, is that the world cup result (rather than the actual performances) afforded Southgate some breathing space from the media, and allowed a bit of sorely-missed continuity in the England job... it still amazes me that nobody takes note of Manchester United who ultimately dominated for years because they allowed Ferguson to build an empire.... nobody gives their managers a chance (not even Manchester United, amazingly enough!).

  3. #5293
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    I don't really follow football and can't find any recent figures but only 25% or so of premier league players are eligible to play for England.
    Cause tramps like us, baby we were born to run

  4. #5294
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    Been a good day for culture what with the Pre-Raphaelite work on another thread and then Billy the Fish getting a nod in the post above
    Poacher turned game-keeper

  5. #5295
    Quote Originally Posted by Flem View Post
    It's a bit more complicated than that, though, isn't it? For example, I'm sure Roy Keane was very good at putting a firework up the arse of a player, but his managerial record speaks for itself. (I'm thinking of a word that rhymes with 'tight'.)

    Speaking of Roy Keane's managerial record, I'm reminded of the time in the late 80s (I think) when Mick Hucknall (out of Simply Red) played for Fulchester United (alongside, if I'm not mistaken, Shakin' Stevens, as well, of course, as Billy The Fish), as chronicled in Viz magazine. As I recall, the lad Hucknall (out of Simply Red) had quite an explosive start to the game, only to fade significantly shortly afterwards, missing numerous easy opportunities to score, prompting someone in the crowd to opine "in a bizarre recreation of his musical career, Mick Hucknall's considerable early promise has been followed up by a series of lacklustre disappointments".

    In contrast to the likes of Roy Keane, Brian Clough was able to put his arm around those who would respond positively to having an arm put around them, and put a firework up the arse of those who would respond positively to having a firework up their arse (which included Keane himself, of course). Unfortunately, Mr Keane seemed only to learn part of the lesson.

    Mind you, I couldn't stand Brian Clough in his pre-Forest days. Ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now.
    My,what a perceptive and profound post! Well, the last sentence anyway.
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  6. #5296
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    That sounds about right. Look at any given Champions League set of midweek fixtures, and it's rare to be able to throw together 11 English players from the four English starting lineups.

    Which in itself is no issue at all in footballing terms... until everyone throws their dummy out of the pram and wonders why England can't dominate at international level, when our best domestic teams are generally propped up by overseas players.

  7. #5297
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    I'm perhaps being a little unfair on Southgate, but I have a few observations.

    Tyrone Mings - he made 17 Premier League appearances for Bournemouth in 4 seasons. He was initially brought in to the squad for a year ago on the basis of a few months on loan at Villa in the Championship.
    Villa connection?

    Eric Dier - even Spurs don't seem to know where and what he is as a player. I tend to think he's just a useless big lump who is out of his depth in the Premier League.

    Joe Gomez - he looks like a good player in the making but he hasn't got there yet. He's error prone, a bit like Stones.
    He's probably also looking better because he's playing in he best team in England alongside possibly the best centre-half in the world at the moment.

    Meanwhile James Tarkowski at Burnley received his first cap 30 months ago in March 2018. He's never been called back in to the squad since.
    I'd argue that Van Dyke aside, he's been the most consistent high performing centre-half in the Prem during that time.
    I can't remember the last time he made a mistake and he played all the Prem games last season.

    In Midfield we had Kalvin Phillips from Leeds, perhaps a great prospect but a bit early.
    Declan Rice from West Ham who scraped survival and he was an ever present in a pretty ropey West Ham team - I've seen him a few times and he's been ineffective and I sense he's over-rated as he's a West Ham youngster.
    James Ward-Prowse - well he's had a decent year for Southampton so I wouldn't be over critical on his selection.
    Harry Winks - hasn't cut it at Spurs after some early promise.

    Another Burnley player Ashley Westwood never gets a mention. I wouldn't take any of the above over Westwood.

    The team against Denmark had a back 4, with a right back playing left back. It had a midfield 3 of sitters, and we had 3 attacking players who's current form is questionable.
    Sterling and Kane are top class on their day, but particularly Kane has been struggling.

    It wasn't a good looking team or squad.

    I take on board what Travs says. I think our players aren't as good as they often get hyped up to be. But I think you have to pick on form and/or quality. I don't think Southgate is doing that.
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  8. #5298
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    I don't think Southgate is using any Villa bias with reference to Mings... in fact, most Villa fans i know seem to think the opposite... they say he is bitter about the way he was treated by their fans when he left them, and that is the reason why he won't pick Jack Grealish.

    Personally i think both theories are off the mark.

  9. #5299
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travs View Post
    I don't think Southgate is using any Villa bias with reference to Mings... in fact, most Villa fans i know seem to think the opposite... they say he is bitter about the way he was treated by their fans when he left them, and that is the reason why he won't pick Jack Grealish.

    Personally i think both theories are off the mark.
    well he picked Jack Grealish, who's claim to fame is the most fouled player in a season. He should try and stay on his feet a bit more.
    I wouldn't want him near my team.
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  10. #5300
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    Totally agree with you there. Blatant cheat, and not much end product, given that everything goes through him at Villa...

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