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Thread: Wind Power

  1. #21
    Senior Member Mr1470's Avatar
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    Re: Wind Power

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike T View Post
    particularly the " I want to be able to use power ad infinitum, but I do not want to see any turbines " brigade. We all know what to do - much less travel/buy local/recycle/let the car rot/fewer children/fewer pets/no BBQs/etc but we choose not to act and future generations will suffer accordingly.
    Funnily enough, I know few, if any, who take such an appalling attitude but I do see people who are against turbines for good reason tarred with this brush in the media if they dare to speak out.

    I actually think the vast majority who are against turbines care passionately about the environment and the problem of global warming. The fact is that we should be finding a realistic solution, not pouring money into one that doesn't work.

    And, yes, you are 100% correct about the priorities that we should have. Power usage is the main point governments and individuals should be attacking, not spending billions on creating new energy. Go through any town or city at night and tell me how many of those lights in office blocks and on advertising boards NEED to be on. How many people do you know who leave every light in the house on?

    The way forward, I've come to the conclusion, is electricity rationing. Allow so much per month per household, flex it based on the number of people in the household. Everyone gets so worked up about how scarce a resource it will be...well let's start now by stopping people having their televisions on 24 hours a day etc.

    Of course, that's not going to happen - it makes governments unpopular with the masses and makes no profits for the energy companies. Better to continue with an inefficient energy programme which transfers money from the people to big companies and rich landowners.
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  2. #22
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    Re: Wind Power

    Attachment 4945
    the future maybe?





    some would argue that this is a good use of unproductive land.. such as this
    Last edited by creaky; 12-07-2011 at 08:51 AM.

  3. #23
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    Re: Wind Power

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr1470 View Post
    Funnily enough, I know few, if any, who take such an appalling attitude but I do see people who are against turbines for good reason tarred with this brush in the media if they dare to speak out.

    I actually think the vast majority who are against turbines care passionately about the environment and the problem of global warming. The fact is that we should be finding a realistic solution, not pouring money into one that doesn't work.

    And, yes, you are 100% correct about the priorities that we should have. Power usage is the main point governments and individuals should be attacking, not spending billions on creating new energy. Go through any town or city at night and tell me how many of those lights in office blocks and on advertising boards NEED to be on. How many people do you know who leave every light in the house on?

    The way forward, I've come to the conclusion, is electricity rationing. Allow so much per month per household, flex it based on the number of people in the household. Everyone gets so worked up about how scarce a resource it will be...well let's start now by stopping people having their televisions on 24 hours a day etc.

    Of course, that's not going to happen - it makes governments unpopular with the masses and makes no profits for the energy companies. Better to continue with an inefficient energy programme which transfers money from the people to big companies and rich landowners.
    The best way to ration power usage is to price it accordingly, but then we would all moan, particularly about "the rich" being able to afford more than us - but in world terms we are the rich, and there will always be people who can spend to avoid any rationing ....

  4. #24
    Senior Member Mr1470's Avatar
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    Re: Wind Power

    No, surely the rationing of power would be easy? Companies control the supply of electricity to our houses, they can turn off that supply. Pricing is NOT the way to control it. Or at least, if it is, then we should be looking at a "ration" at reasonable cost, following which the cost jumps ten-fold.

    Anyway, as an aside, and as something to ponder on.....
    http://breakingnews.heraldscotland.c...1304251519691A
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  5. #25
    Master Trig's Avatar
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    Re: Wind Power

    This is fascinating stuff - and I can see that at very best the jury is out on wind power - even if you can't see a problem with eliminating any of Britains few remaining wild spaces .

    One subject puzzles me...why is it that disadvantaged areas like the South Pennines (Halifax, Bacup, Tod, Burnley, Bradford, Oldham, Rochdale etc ) must take the brunt of the impact of these experiments whilst I see the Lakes, and Dales appear to be turbine free.
    It seems grossly unfair that, as these deprived areas seek draw investment, visitors, and tourist income to replace their vanishing industrial base, the potentially magnetic appeal of the South Pennine landscape is being lost for ever - whilst better off communities retain their protected landscapes - further polarising the haves from the have nots.
    Presume this is government policy is to avoid upsetting wealthier voters in Conservative Heartlands? Or is it the case that Langadale, Helvelyn, Borrowdale, Whernside , Peny Ghent are due for major wind farm developments too?

    Discuss
    Last edited by Trig; 12-07-2011 at 10:09 AM.

  6. #26
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    Re: Wind Power

    We set up our eldest daughter who's just finished 2nd year at Warwick Uni with a contract mobile with Vodafone. It has a usage cap. If she goes over a certain amount, it is blocked for outgoing use and she has to wait until the bill is paid by the direct debit each month.
    We didn't plan this, it's just there - and it caught her out last month.
    It would be better is she could at least have an emergency few quid of credit, but lesson learnt hopefully and she'll be more careful going forward.

    No bad thing really it as it makes her think twice about her phone usage and clearly it doesn't help Vodafone profits, they could quite easily let her run up another Xs a month and take the money, so a degree of responsibility exercised by them.

    Most of us are on smart meters now at home, so of course it shouldn't be impossible that we could be rationed, but I'm not sure that's such a good if idea. The great unwashed would be likely to stay so where as they well heeled could nip down to their local health club and take a sauna and a shower.

    But I would suggest a cap system may be a good idea with a pay element on the metres. So once you have reached your daily, weekly or monthly limit, you could then insert your debit card to get an additional amount of "emergency" water or power.

    That way no one could go without, but certainly it would make everyone consider their usage.

    That deals with Domestic. Commercial users clearly they will not abuse the utilities as it hits them in the pocket so we then only need to address the issue of the Public Services.
    Pi$$ing against the wind turbines there I think :/

  7. #27
    Master Witton Park's Avatar
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    Re: Wind Power

    Quote Originally Posted by Trig View Post
    Presume this is government policy is to avoid upsetting wealthier voters in Conservative Heartlands
    With most of this coming from a Blair / Brown led govt of 13 years I doubt that is the reason. I imagine more to do with National Trust status and perhaps access.

    http://www.bwea.com/ukwed/google.asp
    If you click the 4 tabs on this map for "Operational" etc then the sites of current and planned farms come up and you will see that the spine of the Pennines doesn't have that many, yet there are some in the Lakes, around the fringes near Ulverston and Cockermouth.

  8. #28
    Master Trig's Avatar
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    Re: Wind Power

    Quote Originally Posted by Witton Park View Post
    With most of this coming from a Blair / Brown led govt of 13 years I doubt that is the reason. I imagine more to do with National Trust status and perhaps access.

    http://www.bwea.com/ukwed/google.asp
    If you click the 4 tabs on this map for "Operational" etc then the sites of current and planned farms come up and you will see that the spine of the Pennines doesn't have that many, yet there are some in the Lakes, around the fringes near Ulverston and Cockermouth.
    Just looked at the map......Todmorden/Bacup.....things will soon look very diiferent around Stoodley Pike/Widdop etc....6 seperate mega wind farms. Shows some lack of imagination to site so many in one place? Think Tod Harriers might need to change their logo.

  9. #29
    Senior Member Mr1470's Avatar
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    Re: Wind Power

    Yes, you're right, it's all to do with National Parks and other types of status for land. Unfortunately, despite the high use of land for recreation in the southern Pennines, and particularly Calderdale, the status isn't high enough to protect it.

    That said, the humble twite is probably doing a good job ensuring there aren't more wind farm proposals in the area!
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  10. #30
    Master Witton Park's Avatar
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    Re: Wind Power

    Quote Originally Posted by Trig View Post
    Just looked at the map......Todmorden/Bacup.....things will soon look very diiferent around Stoodley Pike/Widdop etc....6 seperate mega wind farms. Shows some lack of imagination to site so many in one place? Think Tod Harriers might need to change their logo.
    It's not Stoodley Pike, unless I'm reading wrong, the next ones are in the Sourhall to Wardle area.

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