Race the Sweeper loses plot

[RaceTheSweeper]

well, that was bigger than I thought

Not often in life I've uttered those words :w00t:

[RaceTheSweeper]

Thanks for that. Think i understand it. I don't use a hrm but the bit about conversation makes it easier to understand. Thank you

This is how I understand these terms:
Long run: as easy as you like, don't worry about pace at all.
Recovery: hmm, not so sure but I'd say easy (60% effort?) as well - you're recovering, not pacing. If I'm doing a recovery I just go at whatever pace my legs want to and don't check pace, wear a heart rate monitor, etc.
Steady: a pace you can sustain for an hour or more without feeling too strained, but faster than easy. If you were running with someone you'd be able to hold a slightly disjointed conversation but not natter continously. About 65-75% effort, if you use a hrm or are good at judging effort levels.
Tempo: harder than steady, but far from flat out. You probably have to concentrate at least some of the time to maintain this (as opposed to steady, which most of the time should feel natural once you've got into the rhythm). If you had someone with you, you could maybe hold a conversation in snatches but it would be limited. 80-90% effort on a hrm.

Sorry I can't put it all on a pace scale relative to race pace, but I've never worked it out in those terms - for one thing my 'race pace' varies enormously depending on the race.

[sw04]

As Sebastian Coe allegedly said, "I've always felt that long, slow distance produces long, slow runners." Long runs have their place in a training program, but you need to run fast to get faster - simples. For most people two 'quality' sessions a week is sufficient, and these should be hard work. For a quality session (for which a warm-up jog and cool-down are recommended), the actual intervals or reps need only take 20 minutes in total, but it shouldn't be that enjoyable - which is why doing these as part of a group makes the world of difference. If you enjoy the sessions then be honest as to whether you are working hard enough. Doing a short race (such as the Trunce) is equivalent to a quality session.

There are plenty of training programs that will advise on what a quality session could be, but as long as you are working hard each time and doing a variety of different types then you can't go far wrong - I am not one for planning every session weeks in advance. The difference this could make over even 2 months can be significant.

A remember the rule of training specificity. So for hill races, a good quality session is hill reps. Even if you opt to do hill reps once a week you could do different hills, gradients, distances, quantity etc.

Colin

[Trog]

There are plenty on here who are saying that you need to train faster to race faster. Be careful though you need to take things slowly. If you change too much too soon your body will rebel and you will be sat at home injured.

Fell races are difficult to compare like for like. But have a look at a few of your results for races of similar distance and climb. Work out your approximate speed in minutes per mile. For example 50 minutes divided by 5 miles equals 10 mins per mile. This is your 'Date pace'. Look at the times for where you want to finish (middle of the pack) and work out the pace required to finish there. Perhaps that would be 7 mins per mile, this becomes your 'Goal pace'. You need to work from your date to goal pace slowly, start at say 9.5 mpm, then lower it to 9 once you are comfortable with that pace and so on.

[RaceTheSweeper]

This makes loads of sense. Thanks very much. Quick question if I aim for a quicker pace slowly as you say what distance should I do at the quicker pace to sustain it. Should I build up the quicker pace distance bit by bit too? I like this part of the plan as it's a measurable strategy. Love my running and on long run days I don't even look at my pace till I get home, I only know I increase my time by 15mins each week. On my other runs though I'm a bit of a stat nerd and like to have an aim.

There are plenty on here who are saying that you need to train faster to race faster. Be careful though you need to take things slowly. If you change too much too soon your body will rebel and you will be sat at home injured.

Fell races are difficult to compare like for like. But have a look at a few of your results for races of similar distance and climb. Work out your approximate speed in minutes per mile. For example 50 minutes divided by 5 miles equals 10 mins per mile. This is your 'Date pace'. Look at the times for where you want to finish (middle of the pack) and work out the pace required to finish there. Perhaps that would be 7 mins per mile, this becomes your 'Goal pace'. You need to work from your date to goal pace slowly, start at say 9.5 mpm, then lower it to 9 once you are comfortable with that pace and so on.

[Stolly]

RTS all of the advice you've been getting is excellent don't get me wrong but, at the same time, don't try too hard and turn a really fun thing into a dreary trainathon

[RaceTheSweeper]

RTS all of the advice you've been getting is excellent don't get me wrong but, at the same time, don't try too hard and turn a really fun thing into a dreary trainathon

Thank you Stolly. Don't worry I won't. I love getting out running and really can't imagine ever not enjoying it. Some use crap weather as an excuse not to go running but I think that adds to the fun. Im pretty lucky where I live as I never need to run on road. My navigation is good when I'm walking so I can get myself out of trouble if needed (still working on the running and navigation).
Im a bit of a has been and although I know I'll never get to that level again I still remember how it felt to be good at something. I just want to get a bit faster so I add to the enjoyment I already feel.
I really do get what you are saying and if ever you see me out running at a race or on the hills you will be able to tell how much I enjoy it x

[DrPatrickBarry]

I am 47 years old (and never been as fit in my life) and there are guys in Pennine 10 to 15 yrs older than me that just blow me away on the hills. Since starting fell running I have to reevaluate the meaning of age. And to think I was 27 yrs old when I was first told I was too old for a job.

[Stolly]

I'm a neverbeen, rather than a hasbeen

[shaunaneto]

don't try too hard and turn a really fun thing into a dreary trainathon

You're a wise old soul Stolly