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Thread: "It's OK, He won't bite"

  1. #271
    Master PeteS's Avatar
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    I would also have thought reporting this type of threat to the appropriate authorities would do no harm and could only be for the wider good.


    Quote Originally Posted by helix View Post

    I actually believe that farmers should be able to shoot dogs that are genuinely causing distress to their livestock. Unfortunately peoples interpretation of where the line is differs.
    I agree in general and I have seen at first hand the results of loose, out of control dog on a flock of sheep. Not pretty. However, where that line falls is always going to be a matter of interpretation.
    I know of farmers who have erected signs stating all dogs to be kept on a lead. I'm not sure how enforcible this is as the law states the animal has to be under close control which does not always necessitate a lead. Physical injury does not have to be caused to livestock - the farmer only needs to have reasonable grounds to think that the risk is imminent and unpreventable by other means. At this time of year, just chasing a pregnant ewe could lead to abortion so its easy to see how this could easily escalate. Also, because of the rural nature of these incidents you could end up in a situation where it is just the farmer's word against your own and at the end of the day its your dog that's at risk. Personally if it came to it I would put a lead on first and argue the toss later.
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  2. #272
    Senior Member helix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeteS View Post
    However, where that line falls is always going to be a matter of interpretation.
    Exactly, we have an argumentative legal system in the UK. Which does not console you if you have had your dog shot or your livestock mauled. I'm always happy to put mine on the lead around livestock and to heel or sit around runners and cyclists. It's common courtesy and common sense really. I don't take them running anymore as they sulk during the run and for hours afterwards.

    When I lived in West Cumbria a friend of mine who grew up a farmer told me of a farmer in the Cockermouth, Brigham, Tallentire area who had a love of wildlife. He would happily dispatch of any dog he found working on his land as he never gave anyone permission to hunt (when it was legal). On one occasion he challenged 2 men who he had seen coursing; they had placed the dog one the lead and stated that he couldn't do anything as it was on the lead. The farmer then promptly shot it at point blank range. The farmer was lucky that these men had no love of the police and didn't make a crime complaint as aside from the criminal damage issues it was a reckless use of a firearm which may have led to prosecution or the loss of his firearms licence.

    I have more trouble with people letting their dogs urinate on my kids toys or sand castles when we're on a beach.

  3. #273
    Senior Member RaceTheSweeper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeteS View Post
    I would also have thought reporting this type of threat to the appropriate authorities would do no harm and could only be for the wider good.




    I agree in general and I have seen at first hand the results of loose, out of control dog on a flock of sheep. Not pretty. However, where that line falls is always going to be a matter of interpretation.
    I know of farmers who have erected signs stating all dogs to be kept on a lead. I'm not sure how enforcible this is as the law states the animal has to be under close control which does not always necessitate a lead. Physical injury does not have to be caused to livestock - the farmer only needs to have reasonable grounds to think that the risk is imminent and unpreventable by other means. At this time of year, just chasing a pregnant ewe could lead to abortion so its easy to see how this could easily escalate. Also, because of the rural nature of these incidents you could end up in a situation where it is just the farmer's word against your own and at the end of the day its your dog that's at risk. Personally if it came to it I would put a lead on first and argue the toss later.
    I agree too and as we stated in a field with livestock he is always on the lead. Not because he needs it but because it gives assurance to farmers. There were no animals in the fields where our dog was threatened while running next to my hubby's leg. We have ran through here several times and have only once seen the horses in the field, never sheep or other animals. Any time we see animals in a field we automatically put Beau on a lead.
    We have reported it and I have spoken to our Community PO today. We have not reported it as an official complaint but as a concern.
    Last edited by RaceTheSweeper; 29-03-2016 at 04:49 PM.

  4. #274
    Master PeteS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaceTheSweeper View Post
    I agree too and as we stated in a field with livestock he is always on the lead. Not because he needs it but because it gives assurance to farmers. There were no animals in the fields where our dog was threatened while running next to my hubby's leg. We have ran through here several times and have only once seen the horses in the field, never sheep or other animals. Any time we see animals in a field we automatically put Beau on a lead.
    We have reported it and I have spoken to our Community PO today. We have not reported it as an official complaint but as a concern.
    I think that was the correct thing to do. It does no harm but at least the concern has been raised should anything further come of it either with yourself or other parties.

    I take a similar stance with Mungo and usually put him on a lead around sheep or any other livestock in fields or farmland. On the fells its often a different matter though as he will not chase sheep anyway and, as he is generally stuck to my legs, he is in more danger from a misplaced size 8 mudclaw than a shotgun. I also share your concerns that anyone trying to take out the dog would be most likely to take me out at the same time!
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  5. #275
    Master PeteS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by helix View Post
    Exactly, we have an argumentative legal system in the UK. Which does not console you if you have had your dog shot or your livestock mauled. I'm always happy to put mine on the lead around livestock and to heel or sit around runners and cyclists. It's common courtesy and common sense really.
    Absolutely. Likewise I stop and make the dog stay around horses, bikes etc. if I can't avoid them
    Going downhill fast

  6. #276
    Senior Member Lemmy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brummievet View Post
    'Tis a good article. Also interesting as RTS doesn't say that this gent / lady was a farmer - a different ball game completely. What constitutes a farm??
    Last edited by Lemmy; 29-03-2016 at 09:08 PM.

  7. #277
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    Slightly off-topic but related in some part to recent posts:

    A landowner erects a sign on a footpath through a field which states "Sheep - Keep dogs on a lead."
    Can a landowner stipulate such an action on a public footpath and is this legally binding?
    To my knowledge (and I traverse said footpath at least once a week) there have never been any sheep in the field. Occasionally, a couple of horses and a few wild bunnies. I'm not sure of the real reason for wanting to keep dogs on a lead but the signs are renewed on a regular basis and have been there for years now. Needless to say very few people take much notice of them but I have often wondered on the legalities of such a sign.

  8. #278
    Master DrPatrickBarry's Avatar
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    Interesting question PeteS and I don't know the answer but I would assume it would not be legally binding.

    According to below a footpath is 1 metre wide, so how likely is a loose dog to stay within that metre?

    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/public-r...sponsibilities


    It is discussed here.

    http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forum...egarding-leads
    Last edited by DrPatrickBarry; 31-03-2016 at 02:37 PM.

  9. #279
    Senior Member barnyc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeteS View Post
    Slightly off-topic but related in some part to recent posts:

    A landowner erects a sign on a footpath through a field which states "Sheep - Keep dogs on a lead."
    Can a landowner stipulate such an action on a public footpath and is this legally binding?
    To my knowledge (and I traverse said footpath at least once a week) there have never been any sheep in the field. Occasionally, a couple of horses and a few wild bunnies. I'm not sure of the real reason for wanting to keep dogs on a lead but the signs are renewed on a regular basis and have been there for years now. Needless to say very few people take much notice of them but I have often wondered on the legalities of such a sign.
    that sign is a grammatical mess so probably wouldn't stand up to much scrutiny!

  10. #280
    Quote Originally Posted by barnyc View Post
    that sign is a grammatical mess so probably wouldn't stand up to much scrutiny!
    Do the sheep hold the dogs' leads in their mouths then?
    Last edited by Graham Breeze; 31-03-2016 at 09:36 PM.
    "...as dry as the Atacama desert".

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