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Thread: LDMT why not more popular

  1. #171
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    I quite liked it when they released the venue near to the date.

    I suspect that they decided to release the venue early in an attempt to help boost entries, as some people need to organise travel and accommodation.

  2. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fellwanderer94 View Post
    Just out of interest, what is the view of the LDMT/fell runners on embargoing the area before the race?
    For orienteering events and mountain marathons the rules explicitly state that you are not allowed to visit the competition area in advance of the race with the aim of gaining a competitive advantage. Obviously this varies as e.g. with a mountain marathon, if you know the general area (e.g. northern fells) only it might be ok to go walking in the area staying on footpaths only, but not with the explicit aim of familiarisation in mind and certainly not when you know the exact location. (For orienteering with a much smaller area it can be much stricter, e.g. the sprint orienteering world champs are to be held in Edinburgh in 2022 and at one point there was talk that several top orienteers who attend the university might delay their course or not visit certain buildings so as not to gain an advantage!)
    Obviously with the current trend in MMs of releasing the locations ridiculously early, avoiding the area is much harder. If you live in Langdale are you just not meant to go training in your local area? (If you knew it was in the Lakes but didn't know the specific location until 3 days before it would be much easier and could run guilt-free!) The mountain trial is technically run under FRA rules and reccying for normal fell races is most definitely allowed... but I would still feel uneasy about specifically running round with the aim of familiarisation. Just wondered what other people's thoughts were.
    Not sure it could be enforced really. After all, Stool End Farm gives an absolute plethora of possible routes. Last year's Classic Course ranged from High Raise (west), Dove Crag Fairfield (east), and from Blea Rigg to Dunmail south-north... how do you put an area like that (approx. 20 sq miles?) out of bounds.

    The potential area from Stool End Farm is also potentially much larger than last year, as really could go in any direction north, west or south.

  3. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew B View Post
    I quite liked it when they released the venue near to the date.

    I suspect that they decided to release the venue early in an attempt to help boost entries, as some people need to organise travel and accommodation.
    It did give an air of anticipation about it all but was a pain if you needed to book accommodation etc.
    As you say, I think it put more people off the event rather than it attracted hence the decision to release the start location earlier. I don't think it has adversely effected the nature of the event - it will still be a best guess as to where you end up. I for one did not anticipate last year's event heading east of the main road for example.
    Last edited by PeteS; 10-04-2019 at 01:11 PM.
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  4. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travs View Post
    Not sure it could be enforced really. After all, Stool End Farm gives an absolute plethora of possible routes. Last year's Classic Course ranged from High Raise (west), Dove Crag Fairfield (east), and from Blea Rigg to Dunmail south-north... how do you put an area like that (approx. 20 sq miles?) out of bounds.

    The potential area from Stool End Farm is also potentially much larger than last year, as really could go in any direction north, west or south.
    Absolutely. An embargo would be unenforceable and as stated, this is really a FRA race with a emphasis on navigation and mountain craft rather than a pure "O" event. The sheer scale of the potential area that could be included is not practical to recce in any detail unlike a smaller orienteering course.

    That said, I will be up in the Lakes in a few weeks and will definitely be having a run out around upper Eskdale, Moasdale and the like!
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  5. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by PeteS View Post
    Absolutely. An embargo would be unenforceable and as stated, this is really a FRA race with a emphasis on navigation and mountain craft rather than a pure "O" event. The sheer scale of the potential area that could be included is not practical to recce in any detail unlike a smaller orienteering course.
    Agreed; the first mountain trials were pretty much all a test of local knowledge! If they were to try to enforce an embargo I guess it would have to be on honesty (I think Shane Ohly was discussing this issue in his race director's report after the Marmot Dark Mountains), but like you said, it gets harder as the area gets bigger. Anyway the Kong Mini MM is from Chapel Stile in Langdale this Sunday, and I'm not going to not race that because of the mountain trial! But it would be much simpler if I just didn't know where the mountain trial was going to be. Ignorance is bliss :-)

  6. #176
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    Likewise... i'm in Wasdale & Keswick next week, and although primarily there to bag some Wainwrights (and a couple of races thrown in for good measure!), i'll hopefully get a bit of a look around.

    Aside from gaining a better overall familiarity with the general race area, i'm not sure what more there is to gain for the regular LDMT types... i get the feeling that most of them can picture a great deal of the Lake District in their heads anyway. I know i certainly would feel reasonably happy in most areas of the Lakes without a map (although i always carry one), and i'm an absolute rookie in LDMT terms...

  7. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travs View Post

    Aside from gaining a better overall familiarity with the general race area, i'm not sure what more there is to gain for the regular LDMT types... i get the feeling that most of them can picture a great deal of the Lake District in their heads anyway. I know i certainly would feel reasonably happy in most areas of the Lakes without a map (although i always carry one), and i'm an absolute rookie in LDMT terms...
    Me too. I think of the last few LDMTs I have seldom looked at the map other than to remind where the next CP is!
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  8. #178
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    Didn't Joss run his first from memory as he knew the area so well?

    O embargos (especially sprint O) are to stop over familiarity or testing of route choices as well as getting to know the mapper's style. With MT/MMs covering such wide ground and the area limits not defined beforehand it would be a job to get to know the area so well beforehand and those racing have much better things to be doing. Getting to know an MM/MT area through running over it doesn't imo offer much more than map nerding at home. Apart from where undergrowth is concerned...
    Nic Barber. Downhill Dandy

  9. #179
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    Just entered again for this year. Another "short" one though I may up this to medium if I suddenly make a miraculous return to form.
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  10. #180
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    Hi all
    Just a quick reminder that entries are now open at Sportident. So far we have about 50 signed up. The LDMTA committee has a vacancy for a general secretary at the moment so if anyone's interested in the job get in touch by PM
    Mike Hind
    Borrowdale Fell runners

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