Have you read any of the comments at the bottom of that article? To say he is getting a ringing endorsment of his view would be a stretch.Originally Posted by Muddy Retriever
Have you read any of the comments at the bottom of that article? To say he is getting a ringing endorsment of his view would be a stretch.
I have read his article in full. I think it is very damning. If you can read it and not think so then I'm staggered. The comment just below the headline says it all really about the euro.
"It was supposed to bring shared prosperity, but instead it has slowed growth and sown discord"
Don't you think it is interesting that in 2000 the US economy was 13% larger than the eurozone but by 2016 it was 26% bigger? He also confirms my point about Italian growth (or lack of) since euro inception.
Then there is the other article I linked by Paul Krugman. He is a nobel prize winning economist. I thought you might like him because he is left of centre in his leanings. He lists a number of countries that have struggled with the euro and says:
"What all of these economies have in common, however, is that by joining the eurozone they put themselves into an economic straitjacket."
It is becasue it is what you want to hear.
In an earlier post you mentioned that everybody says there is no need for border checks on the island of Ireland, but I posted this article before, which blantly contradicts that. So you just pretend it does not exit. Fourtantly there are negotiators out there representing the UK and EU that do than have your luxury of ignoring difficult issues and have to find solutions, with the withdrawal agreement being the answer.
https://www.politico.eu/article/brex...norway-sweden/
Couldn’t say to be honest, I’m too ridden with Bubonic Man Flu to look at the articles and authors you’ve linked to. Can barely manage to change the tv channel!
Patrick I do think that's a bit rich coming from you. You leave many of the points I raise unanswered. That's fine, it's entirely up to you. But I do try to answer your points as clearly as I can, you just don't like my answer.
I don't say that there will be no checks at all but it is clear that they don't need to take place at the border. I'm not making this up, reputable bodies and people have expressly said so. If intelligence arouses suspicion about smuggling, the vehicle can be stopped. Whatever problems you think there are between Norway and Sweden, there are no plans to tear up the arrangement.
Don't forget there is already a border at the moment, Ireland and the UK have different VAT and excise rates and a different currency. The issue of the border could easily be overcome by friendly countries working together and showing goodwill and commonsense. In fact in the months after the Brexit vote this is exactly what was happening. The previous Taoiseach Enda Kenny had initiated contacts between Irish and British officials to make preparations and minimise disruption. That all changed when Leo Varadker took over and decided to weaponize the issue.
Well if you think that Stiglitz is wrong (or Krugman for that matter) I'd be interested in knowing why.
In that article "there were 229,286 checks on vehicles crossing in 2016, up slightly on the previous two years." Once again you only see what you want to see.
You are not appreciating the difference between N.I/republic and Sweeden/Norway. Those scandinavian countries have the relationship as you oulined above as does the UK and Irish Goverments. The same cannot be said of the nationalist/republician and unionist/loyalists in N.I.
The are many anti-good friday agreement people in the unionist side that would see the establishmnet of a hard border as a victory, that reduces Eire's influence on N.I. Conversly the republicans would see that same border as driving a wedge between two halves of the same people and would see it as a target.
But there are suggestion of a border between the UK and Northern Ireland in the Irish sea as even with the backstop Northern Ireland is to be kept fully inside the Single Market. Surely that will inflame Unionist opinion who will see that as a breach of the Belfast agreement.
Logistically that would be the simplist solution, easier to "quietly" carry out customs checks on trucks/containers that are heading towards a port. But as you say "that will inflame Unionist opinion".
Many years ago, I remember a young unionist lad saying in a TV interview that "they were more English than the English themselves", I was just a kid myself at the time but I still remember my thought, "but you are Irish"
You will be only too aware of the issue of flags and marches in N.I.
The Unionist are not in a happy place with demographic changes due to birth rates and so many young unionist moving to GB they are seeing their majority (and Britishness) slowly errorded.
Recent figures show there are around 50% more students from a Catholic/nationalist background going into higher education here as there are from a Protestant/unionist background
http://www.judecollins.com/2016/01/a...er-university/
It is terrible for the Unionist tradition to see their bright young people deciding they have had enough and leaving.
In the now suspended Stormont government the DUP had one one member more than Sinn Fein. When (if) Stormont is restablished, it is only a matter of time before there is a Sinn Fein first minister.
Before brexit N.I had fallen out of national news, but it is still a very troubled place and will be for many years to come.
Don't blame Leo Varadkar for trying to find a way of lessening the tensions up there.
I'm afraid I doubt his motives.
Tell me this Patrick, why hasn't Varadkar's Government legislated to restore the Voisinage agreement? For those that don't know, this is an agreement that has been in place for over 50 years between Northern Ireland and the Republic, which grants reciprocal access to fishermen from each jurisdiction to fish in the other's 0 to 6 mile territorial waters. In 2016 the Irish Supreme Court ruled that the agreement wasn't properly enshrined in law. Fisherman from Northern Ireland haven't been able access to the waters of the Republic of Ireland since although the Republic's fisherman continue to have access to Northern Irish waters from which they catch 40% of their total intake.
The Irish Government was supposed to legislate to enshrine the agreement in law but this has stalled in the face of opposition from Irish fishing groups. But if Leo Varadkar is so high minded and concerned with avoiding a hard border with Northern Ireland shouldn't he be making strenuous efforts to remove the hard border against Northern Irish fishermen?
Last edited by Muddy Retriever; 13-12-2018 at 02:34 PM.
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