Momentum may not be as powerful/united as you think. Just had a little Google and there are pretty divided on the Brixit issue as well, probably more pro-remain. Who knows what sort of leader would rise from the ashes of Corbyn's failure.
Momentum may not be as powerful/united as you think. Just had a little Google and there are pretty divided on the Brixit issue as well, probably more pro-remain. Who knows what sort of leader would rise from the ashes of Corbyn's failure.
They are divided except on one thing. Keeping a militant left leader of the labour party. And the NEC are hand picked to ensure that continues.Originally Posted by DrPatrickBarry
They are ideological zealots. They believe half the labour MPs are red tories , all of whom will be replaced with "true believers". And because of the way local parties work, a couple of hundred assorted thugs and loudmouths in each constituency really can make that continue. I have friends who are , or more correctly were, labour party diehards in a couple of consituencies ( I am not tribal and have friends across many boundaries!). They have given up on local meetings, moderates cannot handle the way these meeting are now conducted. They have been taken over by the rabble.
This is why I get annoyed at the brexit party or brexiters being characterised as overrun by nasties: the people that throw that stone, should look at the labour party!
The divisions show on policy. Which is why Labour does not have a brexit policy just an illusion of one. They do not show on keeping a leftie in charge.
Last edited by Oracle; 23-05-2019 at 09:37 AM.
Yes. I genuinely think, to paraphrase the now hated Tony Blair (within the left of the party), there is the prevailing belief that power is not as important and principles.
I'm not a traditional Labour supporter but it's a real shame as we need an effective opposition.
I agree on the need for effective opposition.
We are now in a position where labour MPs dare not speak their minds. Some do of course, and I admire the character (not the policies) of such as Jess Phillips. But the hatred and bile she recieves as a result is uncalled for and I suspect she will be deselected in time. So most now tow the party line counting down years to retirement.
(which for MPs is far too soon. Their pension system is an insult to those who have to pay for it. It is so generous they never make a net contribution to the public coffers. They are the ultimate tax avoiders. They take out far more than they will ever put in in tax. And are sheltered from the damage they do to everyone elses pensions. But I digress.)
BTW...still trying to get the rules straight. So if I put a smiley after I am allowed to insult you right? :-) Signed Mr (partially) nasty.
Last edited by Oracle; 23-05-2019 at 09:49 AM.
Don't think anybody would disagree that there is left wing nut-cases as well as right-wing nut-cases.
The problem is, whilst true of nutcases generally, it makes the two seem comparable. But it isnt.
Credit to farage, anyone caught posting bile is summarily removed.
Labour party encourage nastiness and it is thriving in social media. Just look at the twitter feed of any dissenting MP!. The completely dysfunctional complaints process now taken over by a Corbyn lackie through sheer nepotism, so only the "right" people are disciplined.
In labour it is endemic in the power structure. But for those who remember the militant left in the seventies, it was ever thus. Grown men were afraid to go into work, cowed into silence. Threatening phone calls in the middle of the night to dissenters and scabs. Shamocracy replacing democracy. Sh!t through letter boxes. It is the "kinder , gentler politics" of an erstwhile age.Militant cant help itself. And corbyn dare not root them out. Even if he was minded to. The intimidation of dissenters by momentum is the source of his power. He cannot be seen to encourage them. But does nothing to dissuade them.
Last edited by Oracle; 23-05-2019 at 10:04 AM.
Unfourtantly there is probably a lot of truth in that.
But do you suffer from Nietzches other observation?
"It is hard enough to remember my opinions, without also remembering my reasons for them!"
Yes of course. Unless it offends DT.
I think it's also about who you offend. Given that I'm often winding you up and calling lots of (in jest) names, you can probably get away with a few retalliatory insults.
I think we all need to cut DT some slack.Yes of course. Unless it offends DT.
I think it's also about who you offend. Given that I'm often winding you up and calling lots of (in jest) names, you can probably get away with a few retalliatory insults.
CL could have addressed the same remark at anyone else without offense.
It was insensitive of him to address it to DT...
voce (em brincadeira) retatardo :-)
Last edited by Oracle; 23-05-2019 at 12:43 PM.
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