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Thread: Conservative leader

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    Moderator noel's Avatar
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    Conservative leader

    I see Teresa May has announced the date she'll leave, and that Boris Johnson is the bookies' favourite. He's certainly very different in most ways.

    Normally in these situations someone comes from left-field and the 'favourite' doesn't get it. What do people think?

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    Master Witton Park's Avatar
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    I can't see someone from leftfield this time.

    They need a big personality to take on Farage on one hand and Corbyn on the other.

    A manager will not suffice.

    They have 315 seats following the departure of 3 TIGs.

    As things stand they would lose half of them.

    That will focus their mind.
    Richard Taylor
    "William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
    Sid Waddell

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    Master PeteS's Avatar
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    BoJo will get it.

    Shame there's no precedent for narcissistic deluded fools with a mad barnet running a G7 nation.....
    Pete Shakespeare - U/A

    Going downhill fast

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    Master Muddy Retriever's Avatar
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    Whoever wins will have the same parliamentary deadlock on Brexit to contend with so there will have to be a general election to break the impasse. But even that may not do it. For the Tories to have any chance of luring their voters back from Farage and winning, it will have to be a Brexiteer and probably Boris.

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    Master Witton Park's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy Retriever View Post
    Whoever wins will have the same parliamentary deadlock on Brexit to contend with so there will have to be a general election to break the impasse. But even that may not do it. For the Tories to have any chance of luring their voters back from Farage and winning, it will have to be a Brexiteer and probably Boris.
    I'm not so sure Muddy.
    Theresa May wasn't voted for as party leader and then she lost the majority and that gave a dozen or so remainers (3 have left) scope for mischief.

    A new leader will carry the weight of the MPs and party if a leaver like BoJo and it will be harder for the dozen or so waverers to cause trouble, or they can be dealt with in a way that May wouldn't or couldn't deal with them.

    For example, withdraw the whip from Grieve if he doesn't play ball and see how the others react.
    Richard Taylor
    "William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
    Sid Waddell

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    Master DrPatrickBarry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witton Park View Post
    it will be harder for the dozen or so waverers to cause trouble, or they can be dealt with in a way that May wouldn't or couldn't deal with them.

    For example, withdraw the whip from Grieve if he doesn't play ball and see how the others react.
    You are living in a dream world, to anti-brexiteers, the well being of the country is more important than what the tory whip can do to them. BoJo will find himeself in the exact same situation as the MayBot. Does he have the balls to go for a "no deal" brexit, and if so how does he get it through parliment?

    An election will not help him as a Labour/SNP could be a likely goverment.
    Last edited by DrPatrickBarry; 24-05-2019 at 01:24 PM.

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    Master Muddy Retriever's Avatar
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    The problem is as you said earlier, they only have 315 seats plus the 10 from the DUP. It needs very few to rebel.

    I don't think the EU will renegotiate the Withdrawal Agreement (at least not yet). So the new leader has to state that we will opt for no deal and mean it. From what we have seen the current Parliament won't let that happen.

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    Moderator noel's Avatar
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    For me the interesting thing will be to see what a difference a different personality makes. Teresa May is dogged and determined, but she's always been pretty bad at bringing people with her. And while I don't like Boris Johnson, that is one of his strengths. It's a big ask but perhaps personality will make the difference.

    I think the conservatives will be pretty wary of a general election in these volatile times. If they go to the polls without first having delivered Brexit, their core voters could abandon them.

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    Master Witton Park's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrPatrickBarry View Post
    You are living in a dream world, to anti-brexiteers, the well being of the country is more important than what the tory whip can do to them. BoJo will find himeself in the exact same situation as the MayBot. Does he have the balls to go for a "no deal" brexit, and if so how does he get it through parliment?

    An election will not help him as a Labour/SNP could be a likely goverment.
    Pat - they were all onside until the General Election. Go back to all the clips and articles and Soubry, Allen, Grieve.... all telling us how they couldn't countenance a rerun of the referendum, the result had to be respected....

    You are living in a dream world if you think that a leader not elected by the membership, who lost a majority at a badly judged GE, who lost a 20% (at times) poll lead, who lost minister after minister whether leave or Remain.... had any chance or holding the party and Govt together.

    The new leader will have much more pull in the party.

    It will never chance Ken Clarke, but it will make a difference. We have to see what that difference is.
    Richard Taylor
    "William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
    Sid Waddell

  10. #10
    Master Witton Park's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muddy Retriever View Post
    The problem is as you said earlier, they only have 315 seats plus the 10 from the DUP. It needs very few to rebel.

    I don't think the EU will renegotiate the Withdrawal Agreement (at least not yet). So the new leader has to state that we will opt for no deal and mean it. From what we have seen the current Parliament won't let that happen.
    Yes I know Muddy.

    But the Tories only had 10 or so rebels under the David Davis plan and 3 of them have left.

    There are at least 6 Labour leavers and a few others that will support - maybe up to 10.

    Time will tell. But it is definitely going to be interesting.

    Just one final thought.

    If I was pitching to the party, I would suggest that an offer is made to the SNP.

    Abstain on Brexit legislation and they will be granted a 2nd independence referendum 2-3 years after the leave date.

    They are probably going to have one anyway, so why not tie it in to the Brexit issue?
    Richard Taylor
    "William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
    Sid Waddell

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