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Thread: Hs2

  1. #41
    Master Witton Park's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    On a purely train note, as this is the HS2 thread, the APT wasn't a low budget scheme. Not when you consider British Rail's underfunded resources in the 1970s and early 1980s. The problem was that the West Coast mainline wasn't built by Brunel, and has a lot of sharp bends. It was good enough for the 1840s, but as it hadn't been re-aligned the curves required tilting technology which is what the APT offered and almost provided.

    The French built new lines, dedicated to high speed travel. We didn't put the investment in, and spent less money trying to develop technology to allow new trains to travel fast over 1840s routes. In the end we did it by buying Pendolino trains

    The reason we were running Deltics on the East Coast mainline was because British Rail couldn't afford to electrify it at that time. It's worth pointing out that when they were introduced the Deltics cut an hour of the scheduled London-Edinburgh time, set by the steam powered A4 pacifics (like Mallard), and were cutting edge diesel traction for the time.
    I'm not knocking the Deltics. Cracking locomotives, but if we are talking technology they are quite a way from the Bullet Train.
    I think the French put as much in to each km of the original TGV route as we put in to the APT. That's about 400 times the investment.
    No wonder it's worked.
    Richard Taylor
    "William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
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  2. #42
    Master bigfella's Avatar
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    Another problem with the UK rail network is too many bridges.

    Deltics, what a fantastic engine sound they had.
    Cause tramps like us, baby we were born to run

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Witton Park View Post
    I'm not knocking the Deltics. Cracking locomotives, but if we are talking technology they are quite a way from the Bullet Train.
    I think the French put as much in to each km of the original TGV route as we put in to the APT. That's about 400 times the investment.
    No wonder it's worked.
    Apples and Pears

    Shinkansen means new trunk route. It was an expensive newly built, fast straight elite-passenger line using dedicated coaches. When I travelled on one it displayed the train speed and counted down the number of seconds before the train left the station. Impressive.

    Deltics used existing tracks calling at existing stations - so there was no point in designing them to travel at 200 mph and instead they were designed to pull massive trains of existing carriage stock to get ordinary people to work. Like Leeds (where I lived) to London (where I sometimes worked) quickly and reliably. Impressive

    The TVG used a similar model to the Japanese and the new lines were mainly built over farm land of which France has rather a lot. Not too bad either.
    Last edited by Graham Breeze; 13-08-2020 at 03:07 PM.
    "...as dry as the Atacama desert".

  4. #44
    Master Witton Park's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham Breeze View Post
    Apples and Pears

    Shinkansen means new trunk route. It was an expensive newly built, fast straight elite-passenger line using dedicated coaches. When I travelled on one it displayed the train speed and counted down the number of seconds before the train left the station. Impressive.

    Deltics used existing tracks calling at existing stations - so there was no point in designing them to travel at 200 mph and instead they were designed to pull massive trains of existing carriage stock to get ordinary people to work. Like Leeds (where I lived) to London (where I sometimes worked) quickly and reliably. Impressive

    The TVG used a similar model to the Japanese and the new lines were mainly built over farm land of which France has rather a lot. Not too bad either.
    Apples and Pears in terms of the investment. We'd be stuffed but for the Victorians.
    Richard Taylor
    "William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
    Sid Waddell

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mossdog View Post
    Depends who 'we' are. I don't do genealogy, but I'm guessing I'm a bit anglo-saxon/norman/celt/roman/pict/beaker.... A general Heinz 57
    I'd never heard of the Beaker people.

    Thanks Mossdog, every day a school day!

    BTW I've tried Efe's in Turkey and it tastes eff... awful. You're not missing much, it would spoil your cucumber sandwiches.
    Visibility good except in Hill Fog

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Llani Boy View Post
    I'd never heard of the Beaker people.

    Thanks Mossdog, every day a school day!

    BTW I've tried Efe's in Turkey and it tastes eff... awful. You're not missing much, it would spoil your cucumber sandwiches.
    Keep trying to educate the folk's on here Llani that I drink Tuborg.

    One or two appear to disapprove of my number of holidays to Turkey.

    Could you please explain how lovely it is?

  7. #47
    Master BritNick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stagger View Post
    One or two appear to disapprove of my number of holidays to Turkey.

    Could you please explain how lovely it is?
    I've been to Turkey many times but only on business visiting customers. I agree it's a lovely country, as are the people. Shame I never ran a race there.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stagger View Post
    Did we win them all?

    Did well in 66 won that one
    Stagger:- The first 21st Century Crusader! Long live Richard the Lion Heart. You keep those Moorish infidels back and defend Christedom. Jesus loves you!
    Have another beer for me.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by MattPo View Post
    Stagger:- The first 21st Century Crusader! Long live Richard the Lion Heart. You keep those Moorish infidels back and defend Christedom. Jesus loves you!
    Have another beer for me.
    Thanks for your support Matt.

    Glad that we are all on the same side.

  10. #50
    Master Travs's Avatar
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    My office is near the NEC... there has been disruption and works going on for over a year now to the south-east of Birmingham, which is where the new Birmingham junction/branch-station will be.

    Although having barely been in office since last March, i have no idea how things are progressing lately.

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