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Thread: Tour de France 2020

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derby Tup View Post
    I had some fun looking at the same list too Graham
    I've now looked at that list, and had only even heard of perhaps half the riders mentioned, and got hardly any of the references. But I found the phrase "it reopens painfully circular conversations about how a certain Swiss rider noodled away from a certain Belgian racer on the the Muur in 2010" intriguing and so did a bit of Googling. Wow! (Is 'noodled away' a common phrase in cycling? I hope so.) I'd never heard of either rider before. Presumably, all you pro cycling aficionados are so familiar with the story that you don't think twice about it, but coming on it for the first time - wow! Using a GPS watch for navigation during a fell race - that's so not worth bothering about in comparison. Watching the bit of the video where Cancellara opens up the gap I thought, that's incredible! But then, as I read more, and watched the second video, I thought, yes, it was incredible - not in the 'difficult to believe' sense but, rather, in the 'impossible to believe' sense. What a fascinating story. (Perhaps this post should be on the e-bike thread, but, then again, perhaps not.)

    https://cyclingtips.com/2018/04/for-...r-speculation/

  2. #92
    In passing - I watched the ITV 4 live coverage and I did think the commentators got a bit ...hysterical. I know it's their job to make a cycle race sound as exciting as the moon landing but even so.

    The Maglia Rosa in the Giro d'Italia has changed hands three times on the final day in living memory (1984, 2012 and 2017) and if they can't remember 2017 I am sure Tom Dumoulin can.

    And after seven days in the lead Robert Millar in the 1985 Vuelta was ambushed by the Spanish teams (Españoles valientes, Que no gane El Pendientes - Brave Spaniards. Don't let the one with the ear-ring win) on the last racing day to prevent a foreigner winning - giving Pedro Delgado the win from being 6 minutes down.

    And thinking of treachery I suppose we ought to nod at Stephen Roche stabbing his Carrera team leader Roberto Visentini in the back at a late stage (Roche Bastardo!) to win the 1987 Giro, ironically with the help of Robert Millar. Well well well!
    Last edited by Graham Breeze; 20-09-2020 at 09:32 AM.
    "...as dry as the Atacama desert".

  3. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham Breeze View Post
    I don't think I can put a % on it (!) but the fact that Sky/Ineos, which was/is pumping several times more money into its team than anyone else, has won the Tour with five different riders illustrates that it's the team that matters, and not the individual riders; and money buys the best team (which is more than just the riders).
    whilst they had money, surely that fact that they also focussed their squad around winning grand tours was a factor.
    When the signed Cav, I think their only top flight sprinter over the years, they never supported him and he was largely left to freelance.
    They've had half-hearted attempts at the monuments even turning Kwiatkowski in to a domestique.

    They've come in this year though with all their riders under-prepared. Not the only team to do that.
    Richard Taylor
    "William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
    Sid Waddell

  4. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Witton Park View Post
    whilst they had money, surely that fact that they also focussed their squad around winning grand tours was a factor.
    When the signed Cav, I think their only top flight sprinter over the years, they never supported him and he was largely left to freelance.
    They've had half-hearted attempts at the monuments even turning Kwiatkowski in to a domestique.

    They've come in this year though with all their riders under-prepared. Not the only team to do that.
    If I was pumping tens of £millions into Sky/Ineos I would do as they have done - because the Tour is show business whereas, say, the Belgian classics are about cycle racing.

    To the general public, to advertisers, to sponsors, to the people that hand out Knighthoods - only the Tour counts. I think Sky/Ineos only takes an interest in the Giro, and the Vuelta because they are obliged to and have to find something for their squad to do. Armstrong wasn't interested in the Monuments because nobody in the USA knows where Belgium is. You can buy a hundred books on the history of the Tour, I think there are a couple on the Vuelta in English and I have three on the Giro.

    As you will know the Tour is no "better" as a race than, say, the Giro but it has come to dominate the world of cycling because of the money. A petro-chemical company sponsoring a cycle team? What a bizarre world!
    "...as dry as the Atacama desert".

  5. #95
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    I[QUOTE=Graham Breeze;666849




    As you will know the Tour is no "better" as a race than, say, the Giro but it has come to dominate the world of cycling because of the money. A petro-chemical company sponsoring a cycle team? What a bizarre world![/QUOTE]

    Well it has backfired on Ineos this year as it was all about advertising their new Grenadier 4x4, and apart from one day, never got a look in:
    Visibility good except in Hill Fog

  6. #96
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    [QUOTE=Llani Boy;666013]My money would be on Pogacar to be wearing yellow in Paris.

    Well you heard it here first

    I think that for once in a while the best overall rider, and not team, won.

    Roglic was fine when surrounded and protected by his team but on his own was found wanting. Pogacar’s team mates struggled to keep with him on many stages which I think makes him a deserving winner.

    I believe Roglic is 30 now so may have blown his best chance.

    I, like others, are pleased for Ritchie Porte, who has had so much bad luck previously.
    Visibility good except in Hill Fog

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham Breeze View Post
    To the general public, to advertisers, to sponsors, to the people that hand out Knighthoods - only the Tour counts.
    I know what you mean, but Sir Chris Hoy seems to have done OK.

    I can see you don't like Sky. I think it has done a lot for British cycling though so I think overall it's been good.
    Richard Taylor
    "William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
    Sid Waddell

  8. #98
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    [QUOTE=Llani Boy;666855]
    Quote Originally Posted by Llani Boy View Post
    My money would be on Pogacar to be wearing yellow in Paris.

    Well you heard it here first

    I think that for once in a while the best overall rider, and not team, won.

    Roglic was fine when surrounded and protected by his team but on his own was found wanting. Pogacar’s team mates struggled to keep with him on many stages which I think makes him a deserving winner.

    I believe Roglic is 30 now so may have blown his best chance.

    I, like others, are pleased for Ritchie Porte, who has had so much bad luck previously.
    I think as a team they needed to be more ruthless at times.

    There were two or three occasions when they could have taken more time out of Pogacar and some of the other rivals.
    They took over a minute out of him in the cross winds, but then let him attack the next day in the Pyrenees and claw back around half of what he had lost.
    I can only think they let him go that day in the Pyrenees as they were more focussed on Quintana and Bernal.

    They seemed happy to eek out a few seconds here and there and like most probably felt like a minute would be enough come the TT.
    Richard Taylor
    "William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
    Sid Waddell

  9. #99
    [QUOTE=Llani Boy;666855]
    Quote Originally Posted by Llani Boy View Post
    My money would be on Pogacar to be wearing yellow in Paris.

    Well you heard it here first
    Nice story in the DT today.

    Pogacar when much younger was way off the back at a circuit race and an observer chided the RO and said he needed to do something about the small chap that had been left behind.

    The RO then explained that the small chap - Pogacar - was actually about to lap the rest of the field.
    "...as dry as the Atacama desert".

  10. #100
    LANCE

    The 201 minute ESPN documentary is now on BBC iplayer. I think it will be shown on BBC2 at some point.

    I know the odd thing or two about Armstrong, drugs in cycling & etc and while there are some boring bits of his domestic life (grating parmesan!) much of the film, which is interview based, is riveting stuff.

    And, reassuringly, he comes over as a really, really nasty piece of work.
    "...as dry as the Atacama desert".

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