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Thread: Chinese Disaster Ultra Marathon

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Mark G View Post
    The Life Scientific, R4 this morning is going to be about exposure and hypothermia. From the trailer it.might be primarily about cold water immersion but likely to be of interest.
    Thank you.

    Yes it was and yes it was.
    "...as dry as the Atacama desert".

  2. #12
    Admin brett's Avatar
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    I enjoyed that!

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark G View Post
    The Life Scientific, R4 this morning is going to be about exposure and hypothermia. From the trailer it.might be primarily about cold water immersion but likely to be of interest.

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by brett View Post
    I enjoyed that!
    Yep.

    I had been toying with doing an Ironman.

    But now I'm not so sure.
    "...as dry as the Atacama desert".

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gambatte View Post
    Complaining about the nanny state anyone?
    While this was extremely tragic and is a salutary reminder of the need for appropriate risk assessments etc. I do worry that vigorous advocates of the nanny state will seize on this as another opportunity to lay the heavy hand of restriction on risky, but appropriate, outdoor activities. We'll see
    Am Yisrael Chai

  5. #15
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    It’s a difficult one to strike the right balance on. Some will prefer assessment of their own risk and want to rely on their own decision-making, others would advocate for more stringent rules around kit, skills, etc.

    I do wonder what the FRA’s minimum kit list is designed to do. Anyone immobilised and off route in severe wet and windy weather is not going to survive for very long with only waterproofs, hat and gloves to put on. Of course individuals should make their own judgements and carry additional kit as appropriate, but there’s a risk that a “mandatory” kit list will be viewed as definitive, especially by those with relatively little experience of the hills in bad weather.
    Last edited by Hank; 25-05-2021 at 11:14 AM. Reason: Typo
    Geoff Clarke

  6. #16
    Moderator noel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hank View Post
    It’s an difficult one to strike the right balance on. Some will prefer assessment of their own risk and want to rely on their own decision-making, others would advocate for more stringent rules around kit, skills, etc.
    I think in the case of this Chinese race, it would have been reasonable for the officials to require some sort of kit that would have mitigated the lethal effects of the weather if a cold/wet snap were to happen. This seems a reasonable step that won't change the nature of these races, and I hope race organisers and official bodies take note - 21 deaths.

    You're right Hank, you'll never (and in my view should never) take the risk out of it completely. For me the balance is around what would change the nature of the sport.

  7. #17
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    I get the feeling that there’s an awful lot about the tragedy that’s not known so it’s hard to judge too much one way or the other. I think the weather itself might have been super extreme - heavy rain turning to sleet, snow and ice, really strong winds, up at around 3,000 feet and massively plunging temperatures can still cover a massive range of potential weather outcomes.

    I don’t know how many checkpoints there were either but typically in ultra events there are food stops and CPs every 8 to 10 miles, with the route usually following a known trail. I know from pictures I’ve seen from ultra races in the US that a lot of the top runners seem to run with relatively minimal kit and perhaps that is influenced by the general high level of race support available, and frequent CPs.

    That said the kit requirements do seem a bit too biased towards the runners being willing to take all the risks

  8. #18
    Master Hank's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by noel View Post
    I think in the case of this Chinese race, it would have been reasonable for the officials to require some sort of kit that would have mitigated the lethal effects of the weather if a cold/wet snap were to happen. This seems a reasonable step that won't change the nature of these races, and I hope race organisers and official bodies take note - 21 deaths.
    Yeah, agree. From what information is available it seems the required kit was woefully insufficient. Personally I think races generally should require much more kit (if they're going to have kit requirements), but risk will always remain and that's ok.
    Geoff Clarke

  9. #19
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    This isn’t just the Chinese being lax by the way - this is plucked from a random U.K. ultra running web page where they were asking a well known and apparently experienced ultra distance runner (the grand union canal 145 mile race mentioned) their top five kit requirements

    “What would be the 5 ‘must have’ items for every ultra runner?

    Chafing cream. Be proactive and apply to all your sensitive areas before the run to help keep a smile on your face all day!

    Your favorite energy food. Experiment during training runs to find a selection of foods that you will look forward to eating. If you love Monster Munch, include some extra in your drop bag in case you could stomach nothing else late in the race.

    Toilet roll and wet wipes… for the obvious reasons

    Capsules that you can swallow or tablets or powder you can add to your water bottle or bladder

    Bottle, flask or reservoir. Choose your method to carry liquid based on some experimentation. Ease of drinking, ease of access and getting the bottle back into its pocket, ease of refilling, ease of cleaning, reliability of that device, comfort, weight, cost – all are factors to choose the best method of carrying fluid for you”


    Toilet rolls and wet wipes ffs!
    Last edited by Fellbeast; 25-05-2021 at 11:49 AM.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hank View Post
    It’s a difficult one to strike the right balance on. Some will prefer assessment of their own risk and want to rely on their own decision-making, others would advocate for more stringent rules around kit, skills, etc.

    I do wonder what the FRA’s minimum kit list is designed to do. Anyone immobilised and off route in severe wet and windy weather is not going to survive for very long with only waterproofs, hat and gloves to put on. Of course individuals should make their own judgements and carry additional kit as appropriate, but there’s a risk that a “mandatory” kit list will be viewed as definitive, especially by those with relatively little experience of the hills in bad weather.
    Something that hasn't been mentioned is thermal base layers (Helly Hansen Lifa or similar) as useful protection against cold weather.

    I remember one fell race a few years ago, held in October in average temperatures for the time of year, with intermittent rain. For some reason I didn't wear a base layer, just a long-sleeved T-shirt and a waterproof (with taped seams). I was fine all the way round, but as I stood around chatting after the race, I suddenly noticed how cold I was feeling. I had gone over on my ankle during the race; if that had immobilised me, I might have been in serious trouble, whereas with a base layer I would have cooled down much more slowly.
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