Training myths

[CL]

I am achieving at my own level, and i'm happy with that. As for being a top something else, i leave that to others to decide. Would like to be a top father to my kids, but thats an ongoing process. People say i have a talent for making people laugh, others say i have a talent for getting on people's nerves. Just being myself makes me happy

Bring up your children, to be independant thinkers, and in their eyes you'll be a hero.

[stevefoster]

Bring up your children, to be independant thinkers, and in their eyes you'll be a hero.

I would'nt do it any other way, and knowing my kids, they would'nt grow up any other way. Cheers christopher leigh

[CL]

I would'nt do it any other way, and knowing my kids, they would'nt grow up any other way. Cheers christopher leigh

Pleasure.This forum is addictive, I better go to bed.Night chaps

[AJF]

As you reach your full potential, progress will slow.It doesn't take long to go from a 6min mile to a 5min mile. It takes a very long time to go from a 5min mile to a 4min mile.At a certain point you'll have to decrease the volume, and increase the intensity of your training.

If your progress comes to a halt, changes are required.

Unfortunately I realise this. Progress is slowing at the moment re: speed but I have never been that fast therefore distance is my main goal. Always better at longer stuff. Endurance is my main training goal then speed work on top of that once I can do the distance with more comfort. Still do quality sessions along with distance. (between 20 to 30 of my 60 are on fells)

That was why I was interested in phases of training and the 4 week cycles. I am always mixing up my quality session on different terrain, distance, incline etc as the body does seem to get used to things and it needs a shock to the system to get it moving again.

The HRM keeps coming out occasionally (probably not enough) and always shocked at how the heart rate has settled whilst the speed stays the same.

actually here is another myth

Myth ??

Just listen to what your body is telling you.

Listening to your body with regards to the amount of training is critical but listening to it when doing tempo running or your usual x mile route usually means you end up running the same speed whilst your heart rate drops therefore you don't push yourself enough.

Same with food, don't listen to what it wants, give it what it needs. You are probably not hungry you are probably thirsty.

[TimW]

Tim, can you explain what you mean re: phases of training? Was it you who mentioned the 4 week cycle?

Also do you aim to peak? How do you look to do that? It has been a thing that baffles me as surely if you get to a peak then you continue and grow from that peak (up to a certain point)

I spent from June of last year running but no specific training for along time. Started being more specific in Oct. Been great to put more science into my training.

I am in the position of not being a runner this time last year so don't have the years in the legs so I am quite responsive to training methods at the moment. I can notice the difference not only in times reducing but also in the way my legs and body feels from the different specific training. Picked up a few over training injuries along the way all part of the trial and error.

I don't have the luxury of the long base of fitness built up over years (how much do you think that makes a difference?) and I don't have the years of hills in my legs which I think is sometimes an advantage for people that do. This is another reason for MY training only getting to 60 miles max at present.

It wasn't me who mentioned the 4 week cycle no, but I'll gladly give you the benefit of my experience with what I understand by the word 'peaking'. I could write an essay on it (and probably still be confused lol) so I'll try and be brief.

I can see your point about building up to a 'peak' and therefore why can you not keep climbing to further peaks? I think one way to explain this is like - why can you not carry on sprinting indefinitely? (just using an analogy before CL tells me it's because your creatine-phosphate supplies only last about 10 secs - or whatever) In a similar way that we have to slow down from a fast pace eventually, we can only (unfortunately) be at our very fittest for so long before either our form tails off, or we take a planned recovery phase before building up again, possibly and hopefully to an even higher level.

Cycles can be as long or as short as you want them to be (Peter Coe, coach and father of Seb, is the one for these!). If you have a weekly training routine where you return to the same or similar training at the start of each week, that's a weekly cycle. If you always put in a winter concentrating on training and aim to be fit for summer races then that's another cycle - some athletes aim to peak twice a year, once at the end of the winter and then again in summer. There you have two 6-monthly cycles, probably broken into smaller cycles within.

Some aim for one specific race, others for a series of races close together. Numerous permutations. Peaking, in essence, involves hard, progressive training before easing off and possibly 'sharpening up' before the big one (s). Usually 10-14 days before, which is long enough to freshen up, but not so long that the benefits of the harder training will wear off.

I've recently been working on a 4 week 'cycle' of 3 hard 1 easy (which ended up 3 hard 2 easy last time because I got a cold!) Different coaches will have slightly different methods and different athletes will have their own preferred ones. Others just race and train willy nilly and still get good results! They would undoubtebly get even better results with more thought but then maybe they'd not enjoy it so much. You have to consider that too when getting so 'serious' although personally I enjoy planning my training and racing, and seeing the plan come together. Sometimes!

AJF you obviously have a good head on your shoulders and I wish you well with your running. It's refreshing to meet people on the Forum who want to learn. I still want to learn, despite 22 years of running during which time I've gained International representation. Sometimes I think the more I learn the less I know (if you know what I mean) you musn't overcomplicate things, but I also find some of the cleverest people (in terms of they might have a 1st Class degree from Cambridge etc etc) just don't have a running brain and just aren't capable of holding these sort of conversations. Which is strange.

My final piece of advice is develop an appreciation of the science of running but don't get too bogged down in it. It's an art. Or as Sarah Rowell puts it in her book "An art that applies science".

Good luck

[TimW]

I don't have the luxury of the long base of fitness built up over years (how much do you think that makes a difference?) and I don't have the years of hills in my legs which I think is sometimes an advantage for people that do. This is another reason for MY training only getting to 60 miles max at present.

Sorry AJF I forgot to answer this part of your post. Referring to some of my earlier posts yes I think it does make a difference. It may not be as iminently crucual as what you do in your final build up to an event, but in one of my favourite books Running with the Legends (not about fell runners, but anyway) I quote the coach of world class marathon runner Rob De Castella "basically, you're running off your last 4 years training".

Looking at my own running, before I turned to the fells I raced road and track (for my sins) and thus have a reputation for decent flat speed within my fell running peers. I was never going to win any medals on the track, and I have still had to maintain what little speed I had, but it has meant I generally do OK on the runnable sections of races. Descending has always come quite naturally to me but I struggle a bit on steep climbs. Now I'm sure if I'd spent my track running years as a cyclist then the reverse would be true, I'd be a better climber but be found wanting for flat speed, just because of my background.

You acquire fitness over the years, however I believe everyone has a certain shelf life, a bit like a car. And there's a saying - it's not the reg. no but the miles on the clock. You'll notice a lot of the top Vets were latecomers to the sport. The ones who were running as Juniors are often either burnt out or lost interest. Mark Roberts is a notable exception mind. How much of this is physical and how much mental, is an interesting one.

[Stolly]

Just some input from the totally unscientific side of the fence, I think achievement and improvement can be measured in lots of ways. Race time and race position of course but also just something as basic as what you feel like at the end - I can quite safely say that in running two pf my past 3 peaks races (whilst not nearly as fit as I should have been or maybe thought I was), I have easily won the race to be in the most severe pain at the end, hands down.

Putting a gloss on pushing myself to that extreme, which lets face it was not particularly clever, its absolutely fantastic nowadays when I finish a race in pretty good shape. Having gone through massive pain barriers and total body cramps and the like in the past I do know my threshold for self inflicted torture quite well and don't especially want to revisit it .

Edited to remove cringeworthy, embarrassing bollocks - my first thing in the morning and last thing at night posts are not my best.

[CL]

I also find some of the cleverest people (in terms of they might have a 1st Class degree from Cambridge etc etc) just don't have a running brain and just aren't capable of holding these sort of conversations. Which is strange.[quote]

I've noticed that as well, and not just in running terms.I think specialization, without an interest in anything else, leads to a condition I call 'the absent minded professor syndrome.' You know the sort: A person who cannot perform the simplest of tasks outside of work, but once in work can teach Calculus Mathematics or Nuclear Physics.

[Guick Dotto]

That's me to a tee Chris.

[Guick Dotto]

Apart from the work bit, the maths and the physics.