Bolts on Broad Stand

[MorganW]

Some more helpful and sympathetic posts, which is good.

The history and tradition of the BG is important, certainly to the vast majority of those who chose to become involved in it.

Bob Graham didn't use bolts; neither did Alan Heaton.

They have set a standard of moral and ethical behaviour in connection with the passage of this obstacle that all future contenders, in my opinion, should at least adhere to.

It it frightens you or you cannot protect the corner in an ethically acceptable and responsible manner (which in my book means includes removing your gear after you have passed by), go by another route.

[Splatcher]

what if someone bolts Little Chamonix or Corvus next?

What would happen would probably be violence if they tried it at a weekend. If it happened when nobody else was around, the bolts would be chopped in no time, & there would be efforts made to find who did it & make sure they didn't do it again. By education (I hope), and if they wouldn't listen there would be bound to be public humilation and/or conflict of some sort. It's happened before & it will happen again. The climbers won't tolerate it on natural rock in the Lakes, North Wales, Peak gritstone etc, anywhere where there are climbing routes already. Certain other areas have a different ethic, but it's all clearly understood by the climbing world. The problems usually arise when abseiling groups or other non-climbers want to make somewhere safer that the climbers already use without drilling holes. Occasionally there have been schisms in the climbing world, for instance a few years back in Cornwall, but not often.

[RobW]

The problems usually arise when abseiling groups or other non-climbers want to make somewhere safer that the climbers already use without drilling holes.

So is BS a place climbers use? Presumably not (apart from the odd retro in tweed )

[MorganW]

So is BS a place climbers use?

Rob, I believe its used as a descent route by and large.

[Splatcher]

So is BS a place climbers use?

Very much so. Technically it's a rock climb, & in the guidebooks. Practically it's the main descent route from the Scafell cliffs. More climbers descend Broad Stand than climb any single route on Scafell, as it's the main way down from so many routes. Rock climbing started in Wasdale, & Broad Stand's a key bit of climbing heritage.

[RobW]

Looking like Foxes tarn then . Thanks for that - interesting.

[Splatcher]

Climbers have no problem with people rigging Broad Stand for BGs, as long as you don't damage the rock (e.g by using bolts), don't leave anything behind when you leave, and don't stop other people getting past. Even leaving gear temporarily, e.g. overnight, isn't approved of.

[Fudge the Elf]

RobW wrote: "But unless & until the culture shifts a bit (there's already one ferrata in the Lakes...), no bolts it is. Times change: trods develop, things get bolted ..."

yes but this ferrata is part and parcel of a commercial operation if it's the one I think you mean and I don't know of any others in the Lakes. The guy who runs the scheme is none other than the geezer who spouted so much twaddle at last year's OMM. Say no more.

[RobW]

RobW wrote: "But unless & until the culture shifts a bit (there's already one ferrata in the Lakes...), no bolts it is. Times change: trods develop, things get bolted ..."

yes but this ferrata is part and parcel of a commercial operation if it's the one I think you mean and I don't know of any others in the Lakes. The guy who runs the scheme is none other than the geezer who spouted so much twaddle at last year's OMM. Say no more.

Good point well made FtE. Sadly I missed the great man on the day .

[MorganW]

Climbers have no problem with people rigging Broad Stand for BGs, as long as you don't damage the rock (e.g by using bolts), don't leave anything behind when you leave, and don't stop other people getting past. Even leaving gear temporarily, e.g. overnight, isn't approved of.

All these points I hope to cover in revised Guidance Notes for BG Club contenders.