Brexit

[Muddy Retriever]

There is just one problem with your analysis WP. It presupposes both sides being reasonable and using common sense. Only one side is interested in doing that.

The whole purpose of the withdrawal agreement from the EU side is to punish Britain. Martin Selmayr, the Secretary General of the European Commission has previously said that Northern Ireland is the price the UK would have to pay for leaving the EU, while the French newspaper Le Point quoted Michael Barnier as having said in 2016 “I’ll have done my job if, in the end, the deal is so tough on the British that they’d prefer to stay in the EU”.

The backstop is just a ruse to achieve the above aims. A hard border could easily be avoided by using the methods you describe in your post. Indeed that was exactly what was being planned by Ireland until Leo Varadkar became premier. The head of Ireland's own tax service said there was no need for any additional border structure.

So you may gather I'm not exactly optimistic about the chances of May's "re-negotiation" succeeding.

We can't say we weren't warned. Yanis Varoufakis predicted it all having experienced the EU's tactics first hand with Greece. He described their numerous tactics. My favourite one is the "Swedish national anthem". Basically it didn't matter what he said or how reasoned his case. The EU reacted to him as if he was singing the Swedish national anthem.

[DrPatrickBarry]

That would be a combination of trusted trader, self declaration, mutual recognition, random and intelligence led checks away from the border.

So why not remove it, in say 3 years, as the Malthouse option now set out? View it as a warranty rather than an insurance.

I would guess the issue is that all of that stuff is underpinned by european law. So that countries and/or companies can get their knucles rapped if they break the rules.
But with the UK leaving the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice, the EU would have to "trust" the UK, as they would have no way of actually verifying if products are what the UK says they are or do anything about it if they are not.
Remember the cases such as the UK winning in the ECJ, becasue France was using BSE as an excuse to block UK beef imports.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2001/dec/13/bse

[Derby Tup]

Read this; says all you need to know

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...at-theresa-may

[Witton Park]

I would guess the issue is that all of that stuff is underpinned by european law. So that countries and/or companies can get their knucles rapped if they break the rules.
But with the UK leaving the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice, the EU would have to "trust" the UK, as they would have no way of actually verifying if products are what the UK says they are or do anything about it if they are not.
Remember the cases such as the UK winning in the ECJ, becasue France was using BSE as an excuse to block UK beef imports.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2001/dec/13/bse

Bit of a red herring though Patrick. Hardly anything is checked at the border for standards. A major UK retailer had to withdraw some slippers a few years ago because they contained Chrome 6 which is illegal.
They had bought over 10,000 pair from China.
The test was a random trading standards test, they withdrew their stock that was left, which was under 600 pair.
It happens all the time.
The integrity of standards is maintained by the notify bodies, supply chain management and mostly done on trust.


The main point here is that the EU, the Irish, and the UK Govt have consistently said that they wouldn't want to use the backstop and they don't plan to.

But none of them have said up to now how they will avoid using it.

Under the current WA which the EU say they will not change, we could be in the backstop just over two years from now.

So what plans do they have not to trigger it? They must have a plan. But no one will say?

So I don't think their intentions are honourable. I do see it as a stitch up and elements of our Government are complicit.

[Derby Tup]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47055188

[Mossdog]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47055188

Don't believe it. Just more project fear. Just like the news this week that Barclays are shifting £167 billion to Ireland in prep for Brexit. I for one have pre-ordered my Unicorn Cake and lashing of Fanta(sy) drinks for the post Brexit party cos Boris, Fox, Rees-Mogg and the rest of the Tory millionaire Aristocrats simply have our best interests at heart. There's nothing in it for them and their desire to turn the UK into an ultra low wage, minimum public services, offshore tax haven like Singapore.

[Derby Tup]

Obviously it’s just fear. Therefore I deleted the email I got from one of my biggest customers earlier re ‘Brexit’. They’re a key supplier to JLR, VW etc. What do they know about what’s happening to our industry because of this wretched mess . . .and anyway the site is at least a mile or maybe two from where I grew up and I’ve only got maybe a dozen friends there. They’ll be fine

[Muddy Retriever]

There's nothing in it for them and their desire to turn the UK into an ultra low wage, minimum public services, offshore tax haven like Singapore.

Ultra low wage?

https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-livin...ngs?itemId=105

Singapore ranked 8th in the world, UK 20th.

The Singapore healthcare system is one of the best in the world.

Singapore has the third highest life expectancy in the world at 83, two years more than the UK.

Sounds awful. We don't want any of that here.

[Derby Tup]

Have you been to Singapore ‘Muddy Retriever’? I’ve not been since before the Millennium but it was an extremely expensive place to live for anyone with enough time to hang about on the Internet. Like many many places in Asia and possibly skewed because there are lots of wealthy ex-pats etc there is a huge difference between rich and poor

[anthonykay]

Thanks, DT, that just about sums up what my wife tells me about her native land. The healthcare is brilliant if you can afford it; but don't get my wife started on some of the experiences her relatives have had with healthcare there. The economy is supported by huge numbers of immigrant workers on very low wages, living in hostels. And one area where Singapore is an undoubted world-leader is massaging statistics and news management.