Bob Graham Route Choices

[Baggins]

It can be quicker if its dry but has a couple of awkward steps on it that can slow you down if its wet (its the climbers traverse so there are some big drops in places)

I've vowed never to use it again when its wet and I'm carrying a heavy pack
Bill

I fully intend to be tied on before two burly blokes pull me up without my having to expend any effort.

I'd be very interested in finding the route Ali describes, it sounds like a shorter version of the foxes tarn diversion and will check it out on my next (clockwise) recce. If i find it, i'll take some photos and pop some lines on them before posting them.

ST

[GeoffB]

I'm hoping for RichT to be dragging me up on a rope in June, but I'm planning a recce of this leg on Easter Saturday, so I think I'll also have a look for the route that Ali described.

[IanDarkpeak]

I'm hoping for RichT to be dragging me up on a rope in June, but I'm planning a recce of this leg on Easter Saturday, so I think I'll also have a look for the route that Ali described.

I'm up that weekend although I've only got one day free (family commitments), if you fancy the company, I'll see you at the Downfall race.

Which w/e in June were you thinking of and what start time.....

Ian

[Bob]

I'd be very interested in finding the route Ali describes, it sounds like a shorter version of the foxes tarn diversion and will check it out on my next (clockwise) recce. If i find it, i'll take some photos and pop some lines on them before posting them.

ST

There are two climbers' trods beneath East Buttress, you need to take the lower one - the upper one begins with a very steep grass/rock short climb and is the one usually used to access the climbs. It ends at a rock wall.

On this page http://www.frcc.co.uk/rock/newroutes...es/scafell.htm about a quarter of the way down is a photo of the East Buttress (search for the text "New Horizons", the shot is just below.

At centre bottom of the shot an area of light rock may be seen slanting up and right. Going leftwards from the same point is a grassy line that leads to the edge of the shot about a third of the way up from the bottom corner. This is the line to take. It comes out directly at Foxes Tarn and avoids having to drop right down to pick up the gully containing the outflow of the tarn. It saves around 50m of descent/ascent. (note that the upper incorrect line begins at a vaguely orange patch of vegetation up and right of the start of the correct trod - it is the next break rightwards in the rocks).

Coming the other way, and this is from memory so may be incorrect, you descend to Foxes Tarn and then cut left to find a couple of small cairns from where a short scramble down over easy rocks leads to the traverse.

I'll be doing this section both ways this summer so may have to rely on this myself

[Mark Smith]

Thanks for such an excellent description. If i have it right, do you mean this line (ish!)?

[Ali]

Thanks for such an excellent description. If i have it right, do you mean this line (ish!)?

ST,

that's the one. Head upwards as soon as possible after the crag.

Cheers, Ali

[Bob]

Thanks for such an excellent description. If i have it right, do you mean this line (ish!)?

Yes, I didn't want to pull the shot from the site and use it myself but since you've done it...

The yellow line is the best line, the dashed part is where it follows a trough beneath the crag. The red line is the one you need to avoid.

[Mark Smith]

Yes, I didn't want to pull the shot from the site and use it myself but since you've done it...

The yellow line is the best line, the dashed part is where it follows a trough beneath the crag. The red line is the one you need to avoid.

Thanks Bob. I;m sure they won't mind re the photo - i'm not making any money from it, and it's being used for a good cause, well good for me anyway! I tend to forget there are probably ettiquete type issues around these things - oops...

Looking forward to giving that route a go, esp if there are a line of people at Broad Stand on the day - it seems like a useful fallback.

Thanks again
ST

[IanDarkpeak]

After a number of long runs I'm getting fed up of sweet sticky stuff, Jels, Chocs, Fruit etc

It's ok for a few hours and when you get a dip but I'm already bored of it. I do take an occasional packet of Crisp's which helps the salt intake.

Any other positive suggestions, I'm sorry roadrunner and Plumbum "ginsters" don't cut it for me.

I have considered boiled potatoes tossed in salty butter and allowed to cool.

Another question, How valuble does any one find cycling in the pursuit of Hill stamina/Speed/Fitness? Am I better plodding the hills on foot or going out on the bike one day a week?

Ian

[Chas]

Bob Graham himself apparently had a lightly boiled egg for breakfast at Dunmail Raise on his round in 1932 so I reckon anything goes. It is very much personal preference. I would however advise against taking too many sweet drinks and food in the first half as this tends to make you feel sick which stops you eating anything at all.

The calorie-burn rate on a BG round is usually about 650 calories per hour - a lot less than say a marathon. You can't possibly take in during the run the approx 12000-15000 calories required. You have to accustom your body to burning fat from an early stage and therefore you have to be careful not to take too much sugar early on.

Another key to be able to continue eating all the way round is to start off slowly. Also eat regularly between the road stops and keep drinking.

Most people however do feel sick to some degree for some if not most of the second half. I found it very hard to keep anything other than glucose tablets down for the last 8 hours or so. Many people need to rely on such things as jelly babies, sweets etc in the last few hours.

I found moist cake a good compromise between fat and carbohydrate and it went down easily with a high calorie content. Mashed potato with butter and salt was something I looked forward to even though it didn't stay down too long! Often with food its as much psychological as physical.

It is a good idea to have the odd thing that you really like and is a bit different from everything else you are trying to eat. Your favourite packet of crisps can work well.

As to whether cycling is good training for the BG I would say that you can't beat time on your feet doing big ascents. The old advice of 10,000ft per week is still the best (although you obviously need to build up slowly over several weeks). You need to train for your aim - ie long days in the hills not necessarily going too fast. I reckon that for a 24hr BG the amount of time you need to be actually running (as opposed to walking or resting) is less than 6 hours. Think of it more as a long, fast walk than a run. Some of my training days were just very long walking days out in the hills with lots of ascent.