Pronation and bio mechs help!

[GregC]

I got left achilles pain when I first started (road) running 2 years ago when I ran over 6 miles. I went to up and running and had a gait analysis and was diagnosed with the same as you - right foot OK, left pronating. I bought some New Balance support trainers which stopped the problem immediately. Started fell running last year, wearing Roclite 295s which have been great. I think you only need support shoes with pronation correction on the road, due to the constant pounding in the same position.

[MorganW]

Corniceman

We are all put together differently, so be cautious drawing on the experiences of others.

The key for me has been understanding what caused the serious knee problems that kept arising at regular intervals over the last 25 years or so. My over pronation problems and resulting flat feet are caused by having bent bones below the knee, worse on the right than the left. Probably caused by the bones continuing to grow after the ends had fused in my late teens.

I started to deal with the complications by using sticky felt inserts into the arch area to flip some of the load nearer to the middle of the foot. I used these in fell shoes as well as road shoes. My bones aren't any less bent in fell shoes (but I would agree that the damage flowing from the problem isn't as "serious" as arises from the repetitious road running footfall) and I do need some help to correct the problem in all types of shoes (though see below).

Latterly I saw a guy in Bradford who does some off the peg orthotics for me for about £60 a pair. These work just fine, but do wear out in time and need to be replaced.

I know I can't straighten my bones, so the problems won't ever go away completely.

But I have done some regular but infrequent barefoot running, on level grass (round the perimeter of some well used sports pitches locally) and there is no doubt that this has helped strenghten my feet and the arches.

I found this out shortly after buying a pair of Salomon S Lab 3s in preparation for an Alpine ultra this year. I inadvertently went out in them without the orthotics and they were so bloody comfortable (more so than with the ortho in) that I kept at it. The shoe does have a gentle arch post and for the last 3 months or so I have been running in little else and have not been using the orthos. I'm convinced that a few years ago this would not have been possible.

If I run in Roclite 295s I use the orthos to give some degree of arch support.

So things have changed over time, and may do so again.

You doubtless will have a different story!

[Corniceman]

Personally rather than trying to control and inhibit your body’s natural running cycle,why don’t you get yourself a pair of Vibram Five Fingers or Baregrips or betterstill barefoot, which will force you up onto your forefoot and let your feet naturallycushion the impact of landing.

I can understand your thinking here TBGM but I am concerned it was switching to minimalist or pretty minilmist shoes in the first palce that caused the injury. the shoes I wore were brookes Greensilence and they are pretty light and low to the ground copared with any other raod shoes I have ever worn. I have though been using X talons on the fells for some time now and never experienced a problem. Zephr will no though how I slow down significantly on any down hills as he has passed me quite a few times and this is because my ankles seemed to have for some time got weaker and weaker.

Another running friend of mine strongly advocates steering away from orthotics and trying strengthening of the ankles and calves and I guess this is more towards a more natural approach although not quite going as far as barefoot just yet?

Thanks for the advice from all of you its greatly valued and appreciated.

[Corniceman]

Simon, Don't forget you only injured yourself approx 1 month ago (as you said in your original post); you should allow adequate healing of your injured leg to take place, including lots of stretching and strengthening to address scar tissue. Give it time and ease youself back into things, also taking care of the opposite leg which sounds like it is compensating a little, hence syptoms around the achillies region.

Was the original injury at the musculotendinous junction? Quite a vulnerable area if so and will take time.

Good luck

Gaz

Gaz

I am sure you are right here, and like most people here I have little patience and always hope things will heal quickly. Also one look at the calender and you see all the great races that you miss this time of year. looks like Langdale will have to be given a miss too.

[Fairyfeet]

Yes, me. I have come from a road running background and have a history of IT Band problems caused by over pronating. My hip and knee pain kept me out of running for 6 months in 2009, then after 5 months back running I was out for the rest of the following year and had physio and sought the help of a podiatrist. My inserts had the effect of correcting my over pronation, this took time. So inserts and further exercises have helped 100% In 2010 I took to the fells and as I got stronger I didn't feel the need for the inserts and they weren't a great fit in my shoes anyway. All was well until 7/8 months in I started get pains and swelling n the bones on my right foot, the same leg as the ITb problems. As my legs had become stronger the ITB was being supported and so there were no ITB problems but my foot pronation still continued and I was twisting the tendon that runs just above the arch of the foot. My inserts were amended again and I have now got feet exercises! I never run without my orthotics, I have to buy fell shoes that fit them. Mudclaw (not a great fit but do able) Mizuna Wave Harrier and Wave Ascend are my faves and fit the inserts fine.

[wycoller]

This is a complex area and if you do have problems then there is a lot that can be done - see Fairyfeet above. I've been to a podiatrist and orthopaedic surgeon for years but have recently found a physio at Wyke near Bradford who specialises in feet. He has done a fantastic job and even makes his own orthotics.

As for most injuries get some professional advice but possibly seek some different views.

[MorganW]

I found this out shortly after buying a pair of Salomon S Lab 3s in preparation for an Alpine ultra this year. I inadvertently went out in them without the orthotics and they were so bloody comfortable (more so than with the ortho in) that I kept at it. The shoe does have a gentle arch post and for the last 3 months or so I have been running in little else and have not been using the orthos.

An update on my tale in post # 12.

I have managed a decent 6 months without the orthotics, running in the S Lab 3s.

But in the last week before the New Year turned, the old nagging irritation in the right patellar tendon started again.

So, back to the orthotics again now.

But to run for 6 months without them has been a delight, and I hope that another few months of ortho wearing and regular barefoot sessions will get me back to a place where I can do without them for another period.

The other thing that I think has made a difference during the 6 months has been the nature of my running. I have been clocking plenty of miles training for ultras. This means I have been training for longer periods but without too great an intensity.

What this has meant is that I have more time when running to concentrate on my form, and have been working on this as often as I can. On downhills in particular, where I am cruising along rather than going hell for leather, I have been able to work much more on where and how I place the feet, and I am sure this has helped prolong the period I was able to run without the orthotics.

[Graeme]

I suffered with a torn calf 3 years ago and I made the mistake twice of going back to running too quickly, I was given NHS orthotics after the 2nd reoccurance, but I am not convinced they did anything. At the time I was running on the road in support shoes, since in recent times I have comfortable ran road marathons in sacony fastwich, and have no problems running xc in spikes. I think thwe key is having stong flexible muscles and tendons. Avoid any step changes in shoe types or running style.