Pertex Tops?

[ZootHornRollo]

A Pertex top is one of the most useful bits of running kit you can have imho

seconded

I wouldn't pay more than £35 for one - just get the basic Montane Litespeed, all the others just have unnecessary bells and whistles to excuse raising the price by howevermuch.

[ZootHornRollo]

their 'Marathon' jacket is on special offer at amazon:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B002RD1ZO...S&linkCode=asn
Not sure how this is meant to be better than the basic Litespeed one, which is also on sale:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B002NQ9E5...G&linkCode=asn
The Marathon looks a bit like the H20 jacket, which I also have, and which also has the big drawback of having no pockets of any sort. It's more rain-resistant and less breathable than the Litespeed.
The breast pocket in the Litespeed is quite big and very useful for hat, gloves, map etc.

[IanDarkpeak]

A bit of an anamoly is that a paramo waterproof wouldn't pass a kit check and neither would a ventile top if you could still get such a thing but I would rate either as much better extreme weather protection than most running cags albeit not the easiest things to get in your bumbag!
Are we all posting so often at the moment because we are checking every half hour or so to see if a certain race entry has gone 'live'? The next race will be to the post box when it does.

Mark I would pass the waterproof range of Paramo as waterproof at a kitcheck as it still passes the test, the seams aren't sealed but are waterproof, I used to be on a test team and used Paramo when it first came out in the late 80's?( I have some shocking pics of me on top of Mont Blanc in a 2 piece Brick red combo) It's Good stuff but maybe a bit heavy for running though. I was managing a shop in Leeds at the time and Leeds Uni did alot of testing on waterproof fabric.

Where a water proof uses a barrier method you do need a sealed seam. Goretex, PU proofed nylon, Cascade, Hydro Dry, Sympatex, etc Paramo uses a different system of pushing the water away from the face fabric

[murph]

I carry and run in the Inov8 Mistlite jacket and bottoms and have found them to be excellent, however I notice they dont have taped seams but are recomended as being FRA approved, would these be turned down under certain circumstances or at certain races ?

Murph

[Dynamo Dan]

Hi Murph! I'm afraid they would be if a RO stipulated waterproof body cover with taped seams. Windproof and they're fine. If you don't want to spend ££££ on an expensive set a pair of Regatta mac and pac trousers and jacket will do. I've got a nice jacket a Montane Atomic, which I only run in if it's filthy and a pair of regatta trousers I've never ran in. Remember you'll rarely run in waterproofs and in reality you carry them in case you have to stop/walk in bad weather to stop you dying of hypothermia.

[Rob Furness]

I've got a montane marathon jacket and would highly recommend it. Brilliant lightweight piece of kit

[swedentrails]

Back to Pertex..

Anyone tested OMM Sonic Smock?
http://www.theomm.com/products?page=...category_id=10

[Mike T]

WaterProof has a very specific meaning It has to be able to with stand a collum of water 1,000mm high as a starting point for very basic lightweight fabrics, Goretex is tested to 20,000mm but will probably go higher than 50,000 with a strong face fabric

Under 1000mm you can only say resistent. if the fabric is "waterproof" but it has stitched non sealed seams you cannot call it water proof. Most rucsacs are a case in point the fabrics are waterproof but unless they have taped or glued seems they are not "waterproof Rucsacs"

WATERPROOFING IN MM TRANSLATED
•0mm: obviously not waterproof in any way. Sieves, screen doors, basketball nets.
•0mm-1000mm: rain resistant, but not rainproof. Most stretch-woven softshells fall here.
•1000mm-5000mm: rainproof but not waterproof under pressure (sitting on or leaning against wet surfaces). Engineered (laminated) softshells, inexpensive rain shells, low-end ski and snowboard wear.
•5000mm-15,000mm: totally rainproof and generally waterproof unless under serious pressure (extended sitting, submersion, heavy people sitting). Most proprietary coatings (generally, liquid polyurethane coatings that become porous when applied to fabrics and cured) fall in this range.
•15,000mm-30,000mm: totally waterproof, even under serious pressure. High-end proprietary PU laminates, PTFE membranes like eVent and GORE-TEX® fabrics. Can withstand shallow-depth submersion without leaking (fishing waders, drysuits for sailing).

But what about breathability? - after all being waterproof is easy - take your average garbage bag ..... it is my understanding that Goretex scores poorly in this area, and is a good example of a product whose marketing is superior to its performance.

[IanDarkpeak]

But what about breathability? - after all being waterproof is easy - take your average garbage bag ..... it is my understanding that Goretex scores poorly in this area, and is a good example of a product whose marketing is superior to its performance.

Good one Mike!

Interesting the more technical the jacket, eg extra panels, lots of colours, lots of pockets, means more taped area's which mean less breathable. But yes a mesh top would be 100% breathable where as a PVC mac is zero

Breatherbility is measured in MVTR (moisture vapour transmission rate)

Where breathabilty get really complicated is there are lots of factors which can effect this. The jacket being wet(on the surface) is not one of them! although a wet jacket will feel colder and heavier.

Breathabilty works by relative humidity, the inside having a higher humidity to the outside, the higher differential the better the breathabilty works, So if you open your pit zips, ventilate your jacket you are actually slowing down the breathabilty. if you were to go to a tropical rain forrest the moisture could actually go the other way!!! What you wear under said jacket is also important.

There are so many variables that to unless you try each jacket personally you'll never know which is the best jacket for you.

Here are some graphs for different fabrics and their relative breathability

http://www.verber.com/mark/outdoors/...athability.pdf

expanded PTFE is basic gortex before it is bonded to a face fabric.

But on one thing you are dead right, Gore has a fantastic marketing dept, as has Salomon in the 70's Rear entry ski boots??? what was that all about shakes head

[Dynamo Dan]

Back to Pertex..

Anyone tested OMM Sonic Smock?
http://www.theomm.com/products?page=...category_id=10

Yes I got one for Christmas and it's a great no frills light weight Pertex top, I run it all the time.