The FRA and the Media

[IainR]

Although I'm struggling to see how this thread became a Welsh bashathon (IanR started it by mentioning that fell running wasn't thriving in Wales right?), I think that the problem with Snowdonia, as far as I'm concerned, is that its just too far away for me to be bothered to attend fell races. And thats it really. Full stop. I do travel about a bit but with the Dales outside my backdoor, the Lakes an hour's drive west, the Peak District 90 minutes or so south and the North York Moors 90 minutes to the north east, the thought of spending 3.5 hours driving to Snowdonia just for a race is barmy.

Every now and then I have to see a work client in Llandudno and, afterwards I've hacked up the Watkin Path to the top of Snowdon and returned by the ridge to the west (Clogwyn somethingorother) and I just love everything about that route. I do hate the concept of a railway up Snowdon though and dislike meeting people in suits and ties and mackintoshes at the summit. Equally when I ran the three national peaks I felt like I was on a tourist conveyor belt trotting up the Pig Track.

I've had a few camping holidays, usually based in Beddgelert, with my two kids, and as a place Snowdonia is hard to beat with its fantastic hills but close proximity to the sea, especially the completely brilliant Llyn Peninsula. I have never witnessed any trouble with any north waleseners but, there again, I've never been to any of the dodgy areas. I'm surprised though that IanR is talking about post event (are we actually talking fell races here?) pub fights.

its not post events, just post wyddfa.. the problem is wyddfa showcases north wales, great race, great organisation, friendly, great local community buy in, involvement as runners, support etc.. but then the visitors also see the fighting.. 4 of the last 5 years have involved a fair degree of fighting on the streets at some point..

So people leave having their view of North Wales tainted, but that's basically the only time you see trouble in llanberis, but that's when the runners visit. We've spoken to pubs about putting on an event afterwards, the heights is now great btw, but basically why would they take the risk..

[Witton Park]

It's about demographics really. The old towns in Snowdonia where there might be some trouble at times is probably as they have experienced a decline - where they slate mining of something?
Cleator Moor is similar.

You can go to South Wales and you have the Rhondda.

But who picks to stay in these areas?

If I was going to the lakes and needed to stay over I think Cleator Moor would be at the bottom of my places to stay as would the Rhondda if I was in the South Wales mountains.

[LissaJous]

I thought it was nice there. The lady at the campsite did look at me askance when I asked if the eggs she was selling were free-range, but other than that, no trouble.

Dolgellau's great. They ought to know about free range eggs just down the road from CAT.. But if you prefer to stay in a campsite the other side of Cader at the bottom of the Minffordd path, there's one with it's very own free range eggs!

[ZootHornRollo]

Dolgellau's great. They ought to know about free range eggs just down the road from CAT.. But if you prefer to stay in a campsite the other side of Cader at the bottom of the Minffordd path, there's one with it's very own free range eggs!

I camped there only the other day! Good eh?

[LissaJous]

I camped there only the other day! Good eh?

I nearly rented the attached cottage but work (55 mins drive to Aber) might have suffered somewhat.

[Baggins]

Never had any trouble in Llanberis been going there for over 30 years!

People should be careful not to jump to conclusions of anti English behaviour on a typical UK weekend just because the people involved aren't English.

I've felt much more intimidated in an English city centre on a Saturday night than anywhere in Wales.

Anyone feeling adventurous could check out Cleator Moor in Cumbria.. I can't promise pitched battles but I have heard (a few years back) that a lot of West Cumbria seems incredibly rough (and very deprived).

Very funny "you've heard" Nothing wrong with people from Cleator Moor, friendly down to earth people, some of them even support runners they've never even met in the middle of the night on some fell running challenge :wink:

I've got a load of mates from Mary Port (don't ask me why) and they don't speak very highly of the place at all.

You lost your argument at Maryport! I bet they were keen to put Cleator Moor down (this is a west cumbrian thing)



Cleator Moor born and bred

[Dynamo Dan]

You lost your argument at Maryport! I bet they were keen to put Cleator Moor down (this is a west cumbrian thing)
Cleator Moor born and bred

Funnily enough they've never mentioned Cleaton Moor it's usually the charms of Cockermouth (or Cock-in-mouth as they call it) they go on about. I meant West Cumbia in general in my original post by the way not just Cleaton Moor.

[LissaJous]

I've felt much more intimidated in an English city centre on a Saturday night than anywhere in Wales.

Agreed!

Very funny "you've heard" Nothing wrong with people from Cleator Moor, friendly down to earth people, some of them even support runners they've never even met in the middle of the night on some fell running challenge :wink:

Cleator Moor born and bred

:thumbup: I'm sure there's the occasional exception to the rule :wink: A friend of mine did a teacher training placement there (or lived there while she did)! She didn't enjoy it much.

Let's start on the nuclear industry next, that'll liven the debate up....

[IainR]

It's about demographics really. The old towns in Snowdonia where there might be some trouble at times is probably as they have experienced a decline - where they slate mining of something?
Cleator Moor is similar.

You can go to South Wales and you have the Rhondda.

But who picks to stay in these areas?

If I was going to the lakes and needed to stay over I think Cleator Moor would be at the bottom of my places to stay as would the Rhondda if I was in the South Wales mountains.

I don't think its that.. last year the locals in llanberis were more annoyed than I was and weren't far off heading out to sort out the trouble causers themselves..

Llanberis had the slate quarrying a good 50 years ago, think the last ones finished late 60's/early 70's.

And its not welsh bashing, as I state I love it here, its probably the friendliest place I've lived. Its very insular though, but so are most rural places anywhere in the UK, so maybe some wrath can get directed at the english but that's because they are outsiders and south waleans can get similar grief, so can guys from llanberis in Llanrug 2 miles away... when the house burnings were going on that was any second home owners, english or welsh..

I just think it needs a high level answer from the council or police to clean up that one night for a good 3-5 years on the trot... change the perception. Each person staying will be worth a good £60-£100 to the economy, after accomodation, food and beers over that weekend, plus encouraging more to come again. Would you come to llanberis for the snowdon race weekend and bring your kids out to the village, stay for the evening, take the family out for a meal? Many wouldn't, so its lost revenue.. Go to a European race and you'll have the post race party atmosphere with child-safe/suitable atmosphere..

Anyway this came up because someone (GB I think) said there was no need to promote fell running, and I think there is in Wales. I've sat in the meetings where they've discussed the lack of feasibility of some races, not enough runners. The Peris, £5 a runner, say 60 runners, £300.. by the time you've bought prizes, cups, coasters, paid the radio guys (if they still use them), its not a great money raiser.. And I think the perception of trouble for visitors doesn't help. Look at this thread, there's a fair few talking about feeling or being threatened.. its only a few people, probably not even anti-english, but it stays with people and doesn't attract them back as much.

And its affected the race, some piss head running out in a mankini the other year.. etc. there's been talk of changing the start time so the pubs are open for less time, so the race knows its an issue. But TBH I think it has to come from higher up, the council or police, to be out in numbers, high profile presence, forget ticketing cars.. and prosecute anyone causing trouble. Zero tolerance to any anti social behaviour, and do that year on year for a few years and the idiots will avoid the race day..

[mr brightside]

Agreed!

:thumbup: I'm sure there's the occasional exception to the rule :wink: A friend of mine did a teacher training placement there (or lived there while she did)! She didn't enjoy it much.

Let's start on the nuclear industry next, that'll liven the debate up....

Are you in the mood for winning on saturday? Where's Emma C these days?