Lydiard or Speed Endurance?

[Deadlegs]

It is counterintuitive but not necessarlly wrong. The trouble with what you have said is that it is just what you think. It is not based on science. At least Syed produced some evidence.

[Deadlegs]

" There is clearly something going on in terms of a predisposition to be exceptional at something, but far more important is the 10,000 hours or whatever...of dedicated, delberate, intentional practice that creates absolute mastery of a very domain specific thing.. whather it's Sara Baras dancing or Chris Hoy sprinting."

Peter Keen. Performance Director UK Sport until recently.

[Mike T]

" There is clearly something going on in terms of a predisposition to be exceptional at something, but far more important is the 10,000 hours or whatever...of dedicated, delberate, intentional practice that creates absolute mastery of a very domain specific thing.. whather it's Sara Baras dancing or Chris Hoy sprinting."

Peter Keen. Performance Director UK Sport until recently.

!0,000 hours of practice may well be necessary for success, but by itself it is not sufficient.

[Tuffer]

!0,000 hours of practice may well be necessary for success, but by itself it is not sufficient.

It isn't it's in the manner of the practice which is the point that Deadlegs makes.

[Tuffer]

What I'm saying is firstly forget about cramming so many sessions into a day or week. Forget it! Instead have a list of hard sessions that are key and fill the time gap between with easier aerobic or rest periods. Take as long as necessary between hard sessions and when you feel strong again hit another hard session. This is the problem with all schedules in books-including mine(which are a guide) - they cannot say when you will be ready for another session and if you just blindly follow their advice you'll probably be worn out in a couple of weeks.

Back on topic, to overdo the quality is the quick and easy route to breakdown, i have found training based on a weekly quality track session essentially similar to the above, VO2 or Lactate Threshold (in blocks), sometimes with a race/parkrun, the remaining runs are easy paced, works. The aim is to arrive at the quality session rested and able to complete the sets in the times. Key too is keeping the training consistent and the progression soon follows.

[Deadlegs]

Back on topic, to overdo the quality is the quick and easy route to breakdown, i have found training based on a weekly quality track session essentially similar to the above, VO2 or Lactate Threshold (in blocks), sometimes with a race/parkrun, the remaining runs are easy paced, works. The aim is to arrive at the quality session rested and able to complete the sets in the times. Key too is keeping the training consistent and the progression soon follows.

As your recent results show. Is it the track or cross country racing that is most effective?

[CL]

Back on topic, to overdo the quality is the quick and easy route to breakdown, i have found training based on a weekly quality track session essentially similar to the above, VO2 or Lactate Threshold (in blocks), sometimes with a race/parkrun, the remaining runs are easy paced, works. The aim is to arrive at the quality session rested and able to complete the sets in the times. Key too is keeping the training consistent and the progression soon follows.

Yes, some individuals can only stand one or two hard training sessions a week. That doesn't mean they can't become superfit, it justs means the response from a training session takes longer to shift the chemistry of the body.

[Mike T]

Having a high VO2 max is such an obvious advantage in speed and endurance events that if it was easily measurable, and reasonably obvious to the naked eye, like for example weight, then we would probably compete in divisions, like in boxing or judo.

And to pre-empt those who will point out that VO2 max can be improved with training, the amount it can be improved is relatively small - most improvements with training are due to changes in running economy, lactate threshold, and lactate turn point.

But no matter how much and how intelligently you train, despite these improvements in economy/threshold/turn point, if you start with a VO2 max of only 35, you will never be world class as a runner or cyclist.

Improving physiological variables is very different from acquiring a complex motor skill - sure, running is a complex motor skill, but even superb running economy, by itself, is not enough.

[CL]

Another quality that is essential in producing maximum strength-endurance is courage. You've got to be able to laugh in the face of physical discomfort. I call my face of physical discomfort 'Baldrick' and so when it gets hard I say "sod off Baldrick", after the Blackadder sketch years ago.

No seriously if you are a timid kind who hates the slightest discomfort then you'll never reach your full potential. I actually wonder whether these kind of people are the ones Mike-T is referring to when he says some can't increase their V02s. Genetically and physically they can but mentally-at that time-they can't.

[CL]

Having a high VO2 max is such an obvious advantage in speed and endurance events that if it was easily measurable, and reasonably obvious to the naked eye, like for example weight, then we would probably compete in divisions, like in boxing or judo.

And to pre-empt those who will point out that VO2 max can be improved with training, the amount it can be improved is relatively small - most improvements with training are due to changes in running economy, lactate threshold, and lactate turn point.

But no matter how much and how intelligently you train, despite these improvements in economy/threshold/turn point, if you start with a VO2 max of only 35, you will never be world class as a runner or cyclist.

Improving physiological variables is very different from acquiring a complex motor skill - sure, running is a complex motor skill, but even superb running economy, by itself, is not enough.

Would you say a jump in V02 max from 49ml/kg/min to 66ml/kg/min was 'relatively small,' or even possible?