A Manifesto for 2024

[Wheeze]

Lots of people already say why work? They can carry on like that with ULW but at a vastly reduced administrative cost and no chance of improvement. But many more people probably do want to improve their lot. By working they can develop new skills that allow promotion, advancement and better pay.

I forgot to include Environment in my manifesto.
Rolling programme of legal personhood for rivers and other natural features subject to despoilation. Fines starting at 10% of gross revenue before tax and deductions for companies found guilty.
Screening of investors and sponsors of water and environmental companies to prevent green-washing.
Compulsory 100 hours litter picking for all those prosecuted for littering. Vehicles used in fly tipping to be crushed and registered owner subject to 100 hours litter picking. Funded by 5% levy on all fast food companies and soft drink producers not covered by the Nutrition tax.
Complete ban on building on flood plains.

[Wheeze]

Free trade agreement...have you tried buying anything expensive (over £200) from Europe recently?

[Witton Park]

Free trade agreement...have you tried buying anything expensive (over £200) from Europe recently?

Yes. I regular bring in items in excess of £5k without any difficulty. I have a pallet on it's way from Slovakia at the moment.

[Witton Park]

Lots of people already say why work? They can carry on like that with ULW but at a vastly reduced administrative cost and no chance of improvement. But many more people probably do want to improve their lot. By working they can develop new skills that allow promotion, advancement and better pay.
.

That doesn't really answer my question and maybe I'm misunderstanding you.

I am imagining this as a Universal Guaranteed Income, because you linked it to dismantling the Welfare State.

I already see issues with the Minimum Wage which I expected when it was introduced. The curtain and blind factory owned by John Lewis where my wife worked between 2018 and 2023 now as staff category of "Level 10 operative" and it is the everyone who isn't management/supervisor.

So the sweeper up gets the same pay as a highly skilled machinist or cutter.

When she started in 2018 they paid the L10s about 15% above MW but with the inflation + increases of MW each year, in 2023 they received a £0.02 per hour increase in order to keep them legal.

Incentive to work hard, produce good quality at a pace, such as piecework used to imbue, has been driven out of the workforce.
People started on menial jobs, and progressed to higher skilled jobs, or became utilities, covering several operations at a high level for better remuneration.
That's gone.

The rise of the welfare state, which allows circumstances where some can live better off the state than some working full time on MW, has also driven out incentive.

I am concerned that a universal income is further problematic move.

I agree we dismantle the welfare state, but I go down the Universal Job route. I do not agree with something for nothing.

[molehill]

Reading through I am pretty much on the same page as Wheeze, certainly on energy, why on earth no government would renew our nuclear power stations years ago shows shortsightedness. In an unstable world having in-house energy (fossil, nuclear and green) becomes more and more important. We shall see, but I fear the lights may go out in a few years.

Was only thinking yesterday that I have heard nothing about the environment (perhaps I haven’t paid enough attention). I recall the last election each major party attempting to outdo the other with tree planting, all got a bit silly “you say one million, I raise you another half million”. Long forgotten. But waterways need seriously sorting, now am I convinced nationalisation is the answer, enforcement is. Building houses, population expansion all contribute to problems.

For the record, I still have no idea where I shall put my X, all parties dangling carrots that they will snatch away or be forgotten 6 months later. Quite frankly, I don’t believe anything they say - depressing state of affairs.

[Wheeze]

By universal living wage I guess I mean universal basic income...the name keeps evolving.
Universal jobs is problematic because of the rise of automation and AI. As Hinari says, we will soon be in the age of the "useless human".
No jobs left!

[Mossdog]

For the Manifesto thread - but I've been unable to post there directly. Moderator!!!!

This is an interesting perspective on GE chocies by Hugh Willbourn (Psychologist and traditional Labour supporter)

"It is a shocking, mind-boggling truth that the Reform Party is simultaneously more conservative than the Tories and more socialist than Labour... How on earth is that possible?

Why Socialists should vote Reform

https://www.hughwillbourn.com/post/5...ld-vote-reform

[Mike T]

An ongoing source of extreme irritation for me is the Tory's claim re Labour's £2,000 tax hike. The fact that this is a more or less made up figure is only half of it. The other side of the coin is the implication that the British public wants the cheapest public services possible, even if those services are stretched - 7 hour wait to be seen in A+E, 2 days on a trolley in a corridor anyone - or virtually non existent - NHS dentistry for example. I for one would be happy to pay more tax for better services, even if I do not need those services, as long as those who earn more than me also pay their fair share. The idea that efficiency savings, reform and growth are all we need to improve public services is clearly nonsense - if it was that easy it would have been done by now.

it is my understanding that "comparable" European countries - France and Germany for example - pay more total tax than we do. And even if that isn't true, it costs what it costs, given where we are starting from.

Even more irritating is Penny Mordaunt. I hope she becomes the next Tory leader - that will destroy them if the election doesn't.

I'll get my coat.

[Witton Park]

An ongoing source of extreme irritation for me is the Tory's claim re Labour's £2,000 tax hike. The fact that this is a more or less made up figure is only half of it. The other side of the coin is the implication that the British public wants the cheapest public services possible, even if those services are stretched - 7 hour wait to be seen in A+E, 2 days on a trolley in a corridor anyone - or virtually non existent - NHS dentistry for example. I for one would be happy to pay more tax for better services, even if I do not need those services, as long as those who earn more than me also pay their fair share. The idea that efficiency savings, reform and growth are all we need to improve public services is clearly nonsense - if it was that easy it would have been done by now.

it is my understanding that "comparable" European countries - France and Germany for example - pay more total tax than we do. And even if that isn't true, it costs what it costs, given where we are starting from.

Even more irritating is Penny Mordaunt. I hope she becomes the next Tory leader - that will destroy them if the election doesn't.

I'll get my coat.

Mike I agree on the £2000k. The number is incorrect. It could be more, it could be less, but it is a guess and I don't like that kind of debate, but they are toast, floundering around for anything to pick at.

However, I'd just like to point out that public spending has doubled IN REAL TERMS from 646 Billion in 2000 to the OBR forecast of 1.22 Trillion in this financial year.

That is a monetary increase, and an increase as a % of GDP from 34.8% to 45.6% over the period.

Over the same period we have 500,000 extra public sector employees.

So we have gone way beyond pay a little more tax for improved services.

One has to also take that in the context of National debt that has gone from 28% of GDP to 98.8% over the same period and soon to reach 3 Trillion with no end to the deficit in sight during the next Parliament.

And our interest payments on that debt? £74 Billion forecast this year as we still run up the national overdraft.
That's the 5th highest category of spending, almost double the defence budget.

So when any of these politicians say "our plans are costed" they are talking shite.

If I ever took such a budget to my board, I would have been fired.

[Witton Park]

For the Manifesto thread - but I've been unable to post there directly. Moderator!!!!

This is an interesting perspective on GE chocies by Hugh Willbourn (Psychologist and traditional Labour supporter)

"It is a shocking, mind-boggling truth that the Reform Party is simultaneously more conservative than the Tories and more socialist than Labour... How on earth is that possible?

Why Socialists should vote Reform

https://www.hughwillbourn.com/post/5...ld-vote-reform

I was spoilt for choice with which to quote

Can a mod delete all bar one?

Yes I get where the writer is coming from.

I've seen a few agitations between Labour and the Unions over recent weeks, as you mention with Jnite, but also with the teachers unions as they have 22,000 members who's jobs are under threat by the VAT on private education.
It does beg the question who are Labour representing these days.