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sorry about that.... but that's the way of the world and everybody has gripes about something. But you're not being told you have to leave your home because you're the wrong colour. No party/Government can please everyone and that's why they get booted out every so often. We need a change in this country, but extremist politics are not it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
No I'm not. But my kids were put at the back of the queue for 2 decent secondary schools here in Blackburn on the grounds of religion.Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas
They were placed lower down the pecking order than Christians, Muslims, Jews, even Moonies and probably Jedi Knights!
That is even though they were attending a C of E primary school and Sunday Shool at the time of entry and had been since their toddler days.
However, no one else is being told to leave their home because of colour either - it's just a bunch of morons who will eventually get put back in their box and have no consequence whatever in the scheme of things.
On an earlier point you made, I'm not sure why the BNP are allowed to have racist policies and membership rules - I suppose because nobody has tested it in a court of law yet, but the BNP does seem to be illegal to me.
Extremism is never a solution, either way...
Interestingly, after almost 14 years in this country, working, contributing to society, paying my taxes and generally being law abiding, I still look at your politics from the outside... Mainly because I am not allowed to vote. I think that is odd...
What was it again, no taxation without representation?:rolleyes:
Thats a bit unfair. I couldn't be arsed to vote but thats was a fair amount influenced by not having a clue who to vote for:Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas
Tories: Generally anti europe which I'm not, expense claims for cleaning moats and duck houses, David 'I'm a bit too smarmy for my own boots' Cameron (I prefer William Haig), generally pro countryside (a good thing) but at the same time too many buffoons and for me too many bad recollections of the devastation caused by Margaret Thatcher. All about sound bites and spin and never answer direct questions.
Labour: Gordon bleeding prudent, does that funny thing with his jaw when speaking, Brown. Benefit cheats the lot of them, too socialist and left wing, mess about with the tax and benefits system to the point of being incomprehensible. All about sound bites and spin and never answer direct questions
Liberals: Ha! Just ha!
Were it a general election I guess I'd probably have voted conservative but only on the basis of disliking marginally less about them than all the others :D
A one woman Boston tea party :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Hanneke
Rather than being worried about 'positive' discrimination that minorities receive (though in reality I'm not sure this is anything other than a Daily Mail led scaremongering campaign), I am more concerned by the fact that in this country there are two choices open to everyone:
1) Work hard, receive an average salary and watch that income disappear on bills;
2) Sit on your arse all day, receving the same income (if not more) on various benefits because you're 'ill' and then get the same bills paid, leaving you to spend a fortune propping up the local hostelries and off-licences.
I feel the amount of support the government has given these wasters (and there are plenty of white/straight/able-bodied folks in there too!!) is much more damaging to this country in the long-run.
They drain the public services without contributing over a large proportion of their working lives. I am sure now that the generation has already been born that will be fully sustained through state support without contributing a day's work.
Their kids are being brought up to recognise that doing nothing to help yourself has no consequences and therefore have no aspiration to anything greater. It will be this generation we're relying on in 10-20 years time. I'm not convinced there'll be enough 'normal' people (of any race/national origin/sexual persuasion) around to keep this country afloat.
Cheery thought, eh?:rolleyes:
Let's try it... as in test it in a court of law...Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
I have done a LOT of corresponding wth Downing steert about it in the past, it got rather wearing :rolleyes: so I gave up :mad:Quote:
Originally Posted by Stolly
The whole fact that religion has any bearing on schooling/education is a whole different matter. Education should be totally secular and un-related to religious belief. We don't indoctrinate kids with political beliefs so why do the same with religion... let them make up their own minds when they're old enough to make a rational and informed choice... but that's a whole different rant/discussion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Witton Park
"On an earlier point you made, I'm not sure why the BNP are allowed to have racist policies and membership rules - I suppose because nobody has tested it in a court of law yet, but the BNP does seem to be illegal to me."
They're just about to discuss this on Radio 5 with a QC
I forgot! Only remembered at 10 when it was on the news! :oQuote:
Originally Posted by Stolly
But then I was probably going to spoil my card in protest.
I think the days of the great polar opposite ideologies are over, and most people just want the government to run the country. The party political process just makes this impossible.
Government need to be seen to be doing something but can't make painful decisions for fear of upsetting the electorate so we end up with expensive, ineffective 'initiatives', 'czars', and spurious statistics to support the effectiveness of said 'initiatives'.
Opposition should be there to support the running of the country by offering meaningful challenge to formulate effective policies, but instead rely on ridiculing the government at every turn. They too avoid the big decisions because they will not get elected on a manifesto promising anything drastic like tax increases to pay for a level of public service we all clearly feel entitled to without paying for, or to outline in too much detail how they will clamp down on the welfare state (in case they lose the vote of the underclass).
Couple this with the fact that we now have a government stuffed full of people who have dreamed of high office since they were 14: career politicians. No-one worthy of government should really want to hold that power, such is the level of duty and responsibility attached to it. It should be seen as a period of public service undertaken by those who have both contributed to and benefited from this great(?) nation.
If I dislike the government, where then is the credible alternative: someone I believe will actually change things? And if they don't exist and I then don't want to vote for anyone, I am one of the apathetic. Whilst I understand my not voting probably contributed to the BNP getting elected, I refuse to lend my support to any other party simply to prevent neo-Nazi mob getting in. It is down to the political parties to provide the meaningful alternative.
I suppose in a true democracy it would be down to me to become a politician to rectify the things I don't like - anyone up for joining Softie's Republic? - I might have even thought about it too, but it looks like I won't be able to claim a great deal on expenses any more. Stuff that!;)
Anyway, that off me chest, I can go to my physio appointment now!
Why is there a Black Police Officers Federation?
.... Because the police were, by their own admission, institutionally racist and, in order to attract more ethnic minorities to re-dress this and to provide a more representative police force, such a support group was deemed necessary.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trog
There is also a British Association for Women in Policing for similar reasons.
and why is the campaign for racial equality person always black?Quote:
Originally Posted by Trog
I tend to agree and sway to the Tories on the basis that they look to give responsiblity to the individual where the Labour Party adopt the nanny state approach.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stolly
But the Tories aren't anti Europe - they took us in with Heath - took us deeper in with Maggie - flirted with the ERM / Euro under Major and generally are pro EU with the odd exception.
However have a look at Labour back in 1987 http://www.psr.keele.ac.uk/area/uk/man/lab87.htm
Their problem is that they cannot say what they believe in. Politicians sch as Jack Straw, CHarles Clarke, Blair, Brown, Prescott etc all grew up staunch lefties, opposing Nuclear Power, Europe etc and changed their minds when they realised that the Britsh Public had frozen them out.
So they freshened up their suits, changed their stance, but lost all conviction.
I belive in Europe - I work with many EU colleagues - but I also work with Norway and they believe in Europe - just not the EU.
Do not confuse the EU with Europe!
The EU, along with our over-bloated Parliament, our Regional development agencies, National Assemblies, several tiers of Councils and then the Civil SErvice with it's 1 million plus additions in the last 10 years - is just the result of socialist politics trying to build up an empire around itself.
The empire is crumbling all around Europe - Europe will survive - but the EU will become a basket case.
the BNP are trully out and out scum, i have seen them in recent times kick hell's bells out of people because they wouldn't put a flag up to support St. goerges day... look on the bright side at least they don't bother to attend coucil meetings nor attend local commitee meetings! after all there input is neglible if not crap.. it's a pathetic party with a racist attitude that should be stamped out. they shouldn't even be on the registar to vote.
great some on here have said well if they had done this or done that no-one would vote for them.. erm you will always have a dole dosser who belives a forigner has a job they can not only do but have yet they are more than happy to let the system pay there lifestyle..
Anybody willing to 'fess up and admit they voted BNP?
I've seen only one person I know who admits to voting BNP - if they have respectable policies, why does everyone shy away from admitting they voted for them?
First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out - because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for the communists
and I did not speak out - because I was not a communist.
Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out - because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for me -
and by then there was no one left to speak out for me.
No it isn't. It's about forcing their convictions on the rest of us. You regard your above goals as good, by YOUR standards. Therefore you don't think it wrong to force your convictions on people who disagree.Quote:
Originally Posted by marty mcfly
Likewise the BNP think they have the right to force their convictions on us for exactly the same reasons. They believe their goals are good, and yours are evil.
The truth is of course anyone who imposes their convictions on others is a monster, regardless of the end and regardless of political party.
Are you a monster then Chris?:confused::rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher leigh
This attitude demonstrates what's wrong with the Brits. Since you regard not voting as a crime, what do you propose to do with people, who refuse to vote for the bunch of lying skunks?Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas
History certainly tells us about what's occurring today. It tells us that when you discriminate for certain groups, you create hardships for the victims. Those victims then usually want revenge against those or scapegoats for their misery.
What's happening today has to be because of the past. I'll tell you something else, support for the BNP will grow. When times get hard people move to the extremes(provided they're offered), because the extremes, rightly or wrongly,hold consistent viewpoints.
He's certainly scarey at times:eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilgrim
Well so are the labour party. Britain is a fascist state. It's just a matter of degree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mud
Anyone who doesn't agree can read the National Socialist Workers party(NAZI) manifesto in 1921. Upon reading it you'll realise that it's almost identical to the aims of the major parties that exist in Britain today.
No. One just ends up in prison, or fined for acting in accordance with one's conscience. Ask the catholic church what will happen to them if they don't consider homosexuals for adoption.Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas
Look the only difference between Hitler and Gordon Brown, is Hitler believed in murdering his opponents, Brown just believes in robbing them.
So they(government) adopted and practised the very same evil but in reverse.Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas
The Heathens that's the best post you've ever made! Well said.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHeathens
Come on CL you're making sweeping sensationalistic statements (I'm sure with a glint in your eye) but, even for you, using the policies of the catholic church to back you up is pretty out there!
I don't force you to read my posts do I?;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilgrim
Echoed endlessly by N.I politics.Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher leigh
Now you're agreeing!!!???? I think Heathens is making the point about speaking out against extremist views now and putting an end to them before it's too late or have I got the wrong end of the stick?Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher leigh
I'm making the point that the church regard homosexuality as immoral. Why should they therefore be forced to consider homosexuals as suitable parents?Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas
That's the problem you see. The government has no right to discriminate FOR or AGAINST anyone. Since it is doing just that it is causing injustices all around us.
Now you may be blind or shielded from such, but millions are not. That's why they're voting the BNP.
I think you've got the wrong end of the stick. The point is if you don't stand up for the rights of people who disagree with you when their rights are on the line, don't expect anyone to stand up for you when your rights are on the chopping block.Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas
I don't think so, especially considering the context. Heathens???Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher leigh
Yes I think very much so. If all the people who disagree with you end up in prison for such, you'll be the only person left.Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas
I don't believe any political party in Britain has such extreme manifesto ideas such as:Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher leigh
Quote:
Originally Posted by NSDAP Maifesto 1920
Look what I can do.....
Who says censorship is dead on the forum?Quote:
I haven't ever said anything about sending anyone to prison:eek: Are you delusional???!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by christopher leigh
RE racism and removing foreigners from the country when discussing race at school, I just talk about football. Amazing that when you mention no foreign players racism becomes silly. Mention the idea of no pizzas, or no chinese take-aways, no curry houses then it is totally out of order.
Then mention the idea of the fact that many people are descended from people who came from overseas and scientists believe life begn in the Rift alley, Africa so in fact you are 'new' to the country they then realise it is pretty silly.
Most parties have issues but the scary thing is people believe the BNP, I'm just waiting as a teacher to be blamed for the lack of education to be the cause of BNP increase in support!!!
No, you haven't got the wrong end of the stick. Martin Niemoller (who penned the poem) affirmed that we must rally against unhealthy organized regimes. It's effectively a stand against political apathy, and not because the Trade Unionists disagreed with the Communists (for example).Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas
Now (and this may seem at odds) I feel the BNP have an equal right to freedom of speech as the rest of us, and I personally hold that right above all others. If we start denying them that right, we are acting like Fascists ourselves.
HOWEVER, it is also the right (and even the duty) of myself and others who despise the BNP to put forward an alternative viewpoint and try and show the world that their ideas are beyond the pale.
I still have faith that the majority of the population will keep the BNP out long term. This appears to be a reaction to the economic and political crises that we currently have and a weakness of the European electoral system. The conditions of 1930s Germany were totally different to those we have today but it's important not to rest on our laurels.
No, he just makes things up that you've said. I can give you at least 10 examples of that from previous posts.Quote:
Originally Posted by nikalas