OMM in Borrowdale!

[IainR]

[quote=amadablam;159314]However saying this; it may have been the organisers fault in the first place for accepting entries from those with limited experience. One AL race is not enough IMO. quote]

I don't see why RO's put so much emphasis on Al's. I know a good few hugely experienced climbers to have been rejected from AL's, personally, I know who I'd rather get caught out with..

Getting around AL's means nothing, just enter the championship AL counters and follow the crowd..

There is and has to be some personal accountability. We are adults, if we sign that we are experienced, that's our call. What do you want, exams?

[IainR]

Respect for the mountains is understanding the limitations of your personal relationship with them. If you're a novice then yes, it does mean going out only when the sun shines until you have more experience.

Who does that though? We've all been caught out as youngsters, I remember abbing off curved ridge as a teenager in a blizzard at 4pm in feb as it got dark, and creeping through crowberry basin in high avalanche risk. All part of lifes experiences. We (most) push the boundaries, all part of the challenge of being in the hills.

I think to abandon was the right call. But I still reckon holding the event wasn't a bad call.

There's too much passing the book, the responsibility should lie with the runner.

[richpips]

the responsibility should lie with the runner.

:Fact:

[Billy Goat]

National Press finally covers our sport and they make a bollocks of that - "A Charity Run in the Lake District" for a start!

... on debate above - runners responsibilty first and foremost! Organisers of this and numerous MM events do a fantastic job. I've yet to here an interview with a runner who has suggested or inferred that the organiser should have called it off before the start of the race.

[molehill]

I wasn't there, so probably should not comment - but I will anyway. At the end of the day: if you are strong enough, experienced enough and have the correct kit there is no reason for not giving it a go. You either make it, or take a decision to turn back/down to safety. If you can't cope with those decisions you probably shouldn't be there, but there's no way of testing competitors for that ability and experience.
This is an event that is meant to consist of experienced competitors, it is their choice.

[Kinnaird]

"Responsibility lies with the runner"? At what point would you wish the organisers or any of those involved to reject responsibility?

Responsibility lies with everybody. It ain't a legal term or some sort of swear word, it shouldn't land you in trouble either, but I know that cancelling the OMM certainly would have. That's where the respect gets kicked out the the window.

As for completing AL's. There are plenty of very good fell runners that couldn't nav' their way out of a paper bag. How about that for respect.

Perhaps also we should "respect" a local voice like Mr Weir especially when strangely enough he seems to have been right.

I hope that they all get down and that the experience will have been well worth it. Something they can tell their grandchildren.

Forgive the language but I've never been so agitated before.

[IainR]

I never said they (the RO) should 'reject' responsibility. I just think there are fewer and fewer events that let people compete at 'proper' mountain events. So manhy races are now being changed (for the worse IMO). Look at the need for cairns and additional CP's on the 1000m peaks race.

[No map, no compass]

[QUOTE=sideburns on the summits;159308]

i am sure everyone that set off knew what was ahead[/QUOTE
T2days after 51/2 inches of rain flooded the Borrowdale Valley, it took less than 2 inches of rain to cause the first flooding and the race abandonment today. As of 10.30pm we have now had almost 5 inches fall today. Heavy rain was always forecast to fall today.

Having just heard the BBC weather forecast, they say 75mm rain fell central lakes on Thursday and 65mm today, which is just over 5 1/2 inches total, so a bit of exaggeration there.

News 24 had interview with bloke who had happily finished is course in what he thought was a good time, which suggests that if you knew what you were doing and had the right kit you were alright. His only problem seemed to be that they had cancelled the event and he couldn't get his car out of the valley. If it was still on he would have been at the start this morning.

If you cancel the OMM 'coz the weather forecast is bad then you might as well just stop running the event full stop. The weather is part of the challenge - you don't like it go home and play with your Wii!

[richpips]

"Responsibility lies with the runner"? At what point would you wish the organisers or any of those involved to reject responsibility?

They have no responsibility for Me. That's my job.

[Emily K]

[QUOTE=Splinter;159312]

This is simply not true. While as I said in my earlier post, there are some highly qualified and skilled runners in OMM who are more than capable of making that decision, there are plenty of others who are not. Some of those recognised their limitations and didn't start or dropped out early but there are plenty of others who would have chosen, in their ignorance, to bite off more than they could chew. Many of them will have thought "if the organisers haven't called it off then it must be safe to proceed." The simple fact is that the organiser of any race, even a race for only the most competent mountaineers in the world, have as their first responsibility a duty of care to the safety of the participants (whether they need that care or not.) To go ahead with OMM after two days of torrential rain and a great deal more widely forecast for today was (sic) a very poor decision indeed. The influence of maintaining the legend "never having been called off" clearly, it seems to me, loomed large in their thinking but keeping that streak alive has severely dented their reputation. I always thought the first rule of the hills was that a good mountaineer respected the mountains. I'm buggered if the OMM team showed the mountains any respect in reaching their decision this weekend.

I do understand what your saying, and the bolded text is something I applied to every fell race I ran. (However I've done most of my racing as a Junior, I have less experience and I'm more dependant on organisers).
At the end of the day, they don't know your general fitness level and if you're capable of the race, but I'm sure it's easy even in these conditions to decide to run the race because the organisers said it was good to go, I would've presumed they know what they're talking about and are aware of the coming weather, and are able to make a good judgement.