Round Rotherham 50

[BritNick]

Socks, I was feeling a bit rough on Friday after a week or two of something lurking, but Saturday's efforts seem to have told it who's boss. I've felt fine since.

Thanks Chris. I'm still on a high now (though it could be the cappuccino I'm drinking). I saw another Chris Brown in the results and thought you might have decided to go on again before I read this thread yesterday. Sorry it wasn't you after all.

As for the medical research, I think Paul said that 4 out of the 10 retired. The damp conditions put paid to his blood glucose measurements, so he only got the lactate measurements. I think he and his helper did very well for a first race monitoring in such adverse conditions. Not least of their problems was finding their way to the checkpoint locations by car in time for the first punter.

[Strider1]

Are you part of some research programme? Started running with a lady who'd done a 48 miler last weekend. Only doing Rotherham because of the monitoring, but didn't get chance to ask any more about it.

Hi all

As regards the research, the following is a brief snippet of what we're doing here at the University of Lincoln:

"As regards the research, we have been conducting an intial questionnaire study on ultra-runners, looking at methods of preparation and training for ultras and have just completed a programme of physiological testing in the labs here at the University of Lincoln. The aim has been to collect data on a cross-section of runners in order to build up a profile on VO2 max, blood lactates (threshold and turn points) and running economy for ultra-running. A paper will be submitted on this part of the study soon to both a scientific journal and ultra-running websites/magazines.

We're now out in the field to collect race data on these runners in both single and multi-stage races, starting with the Round Rotherham race, and running into the 2009 programme. This will allow comparison between lab and field measures and enable us to assess where the runners are working at, e.g a certain % of VO2 max., and what differences occur between levels of runner and between races of different types and lengths. Looking at performance indicators from the lab, eg. running economy, speed at thresholds, etc. and relating this to race performance is also of interest to us"

Saturday, as Nick has pointed out, was certainly testing for us. The conditions scuppered analysis of blood glucose, but we did collect a good deal of information on blood lactate levels and heart rate measurements were recorded on all 10 runners at 10 second intervals throughout the race.

We are looking at collecting further data on the runners at races next year to continue building the evidence base and we're currently looking at two of the Vasque races, Calderdale Hike and High Peak 40, but this is yet to be finalised.

If any of you are interested in finding out more and, possibly getting involved in the study, then please drop me an email at [email protected]

Regards
Paul

[mxhornet]

I'd be interested to see what results you get. Particularly VO2 max in relationship to performance, as I've already got the impression it isn't much of a predictor as far as ultra performance goes, hopefully I'll be proved wrong.

Those two Vasque events aren't amongst my potential targets for 2009. However if you change to other events I'm competing I'd be interested in becoming a guinea pig.

[Strider1]

I'd be interested to see what results you get. Particularly VO2 max in relationship to performance, as I've already got the impression it isn't much of a predictor as far as ultra performance goes, hopefully I'll be proved wrong.

No, you're probably right. Most of the recent research in endurance running upto marathon distance is that markers such as running economy, speed at lactate threshold/lactate turn-point and speed at VO2 max are better performance indicators.

There's only one paper that I know of that has looked at this in ultra-runing, with a small group of top end ultra-runners, and they have tentatively found similar results.

It will be interesting indeed....

Paul

[Strider1]

Those two Vasque events aren't amongst my potential targets for 2009. However if you change to other events I'm competing I'd be interested in becoming a guinea pig.

Will let you know if we change and/or other events come up. The research is planned to continue into 2010, with longer single stage ultras, as well as multi-day ultras, being looked at in comparison to the data we collect in 2008/9.

Regards
Paul

[Basil]

Lots of the drop outs (and around 40% apparently dropped out!) were very experienced and fit- just like your good self MXHornie.

I'd be keen to be involved in future research - although I expect a fair bit of ultra success to be down to training volume and (most importantly) mental approach rather than simple fitness predictors of VO2 max and such like.

Legs are back to normal (ish) now - a fast 5 miler with hills intervals today was a good shake down.

I'm hoping that next year the conditions are a little more clement- I might enter on the day and wait for good conditions. OK I admit I'm getting soft!

[SteveS]

No one ahead of me decided to drop out and give me a free position

Having caught up with someone just after the last checkpoint and running most of the last leg together, I just couldn't be bothered to chase the extra position. The legs would probably have said no anyway, but it's most unlike me to not even try even after that distance - I remember last year having to put some serious effort in to avoid Mark Hartell overtaking me on the cycle path into the finish.

The aftereffects have been much worse for me this time, not run again yet but at least feel up to it again today. Don't think I'll be racing a 10k this weekend and getting close to a PB like I did last year somehow!

Commisserations for all those who had to pull out, it sounds an easy decision to make to stop the suffering, but I know that's not the reality. It'll all be there next year and you'll have additional incentive to beat the damn thing.

Dare I say it - 2009 can't be as bad as 2008. I have deja vu as I'm sure I heard from lots of places 2008 can't be as bad as 2007... I'm expecting heavy falls of snow next year

[mxhornet]

Heavy snow eh ?

That'd probably stop me getting there in the first place !!

[Strider1]

I expect a fair bit of ultra success to be down to training volume and (most importantly) mental approach rather than simple fitness predictors of VO2 max and such like.

Undoubtedly there are a host of factors at play here (nutrition, experience, mental desire, to name just a few), but what we're considering is if we took athletes with similar backgrounds, what would be the determinants of performance in terms of underlying physiology, eg. VO2 max? speed at LT? running economy?

P.

[BritNick]

I bet running economy features highly. I thought mine was poor but the degree of splattering up the back of by legs was small compared to some others, who were splattered right up to their a***s. When I caught up to another runner just after the boulders who was asking the farmer the way, the farmer commented to me: "How come you're not as dirty as he is?". Does that mean I glided across the mud with delicate footfalls while he stomped and splashed? Is running economy related to smoothness of running action? Perhaps not.