That's where I agree with you DT.
Its not my preferred route but change is needed and any good younger MPs are corrupted by seniors of their relevant party.
It will take a massive vote for the numpties to bring our regular parties back on side.
As per trump in US.
No one cares for him but he was the only option because the electorate were sick of the regular suits.
Farage " and friends" , and tommy Robinson's UKIP are not the same. Farage acts to remove any who are discovered supporting racist sentiment, but you conflate the two. It is not helpful. I have not used the phrase Nazi metaphorical or otherwise.Originally Posted by Derby Tup
If you look at the history of UKIP it was set up out of Labour once Labour had transformed to a pro EU party in the 90s.
It failed to make any traction, especially as in the late 90s we had Goldsmith forming the referendum party. They had more money and a higher profile and I think at that time, the public hadn't really a strong opinion either way on the EU.
UKIP really didn't get anywhere until the later days of "new" labour.
The causes of the rise of UKIP were largely:
1. The EU Constitution which morphed in to the Lisbon Treaty and EU nations were getting a say, but the UK yet again didn't.
2. The open door immigration that Blair allowed, anticipating no more than 10,000 people of the new Eastern European states coming here, but the numbers went off the scale, putting pressure on housing, public services, schools places...
At the time we also had the Multiculturalism agenda - the effect of this was to shut down any discussion about immigration, accusations of racism, hard-right, fascism - these were all levelled at anyone who raised any concerns regardless of the tone.
It was as a result of this agenda that UKIP gained traction. Not because they were racist, alt-right as the thought police opined, but because they spoke like the bloke in the pub, or the couple at home, tapping in to some of the concerns people had whether they lived in a Northern town, or a Devon fishing port.
It was the establishment, versus the ordinary person.
If UKIP were right wing under Farage between say 2010 and the referendum, then a large chunk of Labour's northern vote must also have been, as they really did tap in to that demographic.
The UKIP Tories were largely old Eurosceptic Thatcherites, the UKIP Lefties were working class northern factory workers, builders...
If you look at the 2015 General Election manifesto, it was nowhere near right wing.
But since the referendum, job done (as if) and the collapse of UKIP, you could say the sensible side of UKIP have left and what has been left behind are largely the right wing reactionaries.
What is left of UKIP will disappear, maybe not quite yet as they still have a degree of brand recognition, but I expect by 2020 they will be struggling to get 3% in the polls.
But now with the Brexit Party in campaign mode, I think more Eurosceptics will be drawn there, become aware of the gap between the two.
Anti EU is not right wing.
The communist party are for leave.
The SDP are for leave.
Farage will have to appeal to the left, he will have to be fairly centrist, or he'll struggle to break above the 10% level.
I think he knows that as well.
Richard Taylor
"William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
Sid Waddell
Wonder how many in this queue are from Eastern Europe? It amazing how you can lie to yourself and write that. Farage is a racist, who appeals to racist. He just has to keep a lid on it and not make it too obvious.
https://images.app.goo.gl/S7RasHvcDzTiDux86
Farage is the perfect politician for the ‘I’m not a racist but’ brigade
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Don't like.
Out of touch with what?
This Pat is a blatant out of context snippet and just demonstrates the point I was making.
I wrote quite a long thread and what do you focus on? Immigration and twist what I said, which was purely to outline that the policies of the mainstream were the driver for the UKIP's increase in the polls.
and what lie? It is on record that Labour decided not to use the limits on migration from the new EU members that others did. They did so as they didn't expect the numbers to come that did (or they did and they lied about it)
Richard Taylor
"William Tell could take an apple off your head. Taylor could take out a processed pea."
Sid Waddell
Why did he not use a queue of white people?
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