World Cross Country

[CL]

Actually, if he did measure it in his car as you suggest, then a real distance of 9.5 miles is quite possible... AIMS reckon cars measure courses at least 5% short.

Quite possible Tea.We are going back 30 years though.What if it was measured underdistance.That'll get the formites going!

[Guick Dotto]

Here's a conundrum that used to keep us talking for hours when we were eleven: if a Zulu warrior were to take on a Spartan who would win? or who was tougher?: Typhoon Tracy or Captain Hurricane? or if Alf Tupper were to race the Amazing Wilson who would be first? etc etc etc. Great fun but I guess we'll never know.

[Trossachs?]

Here's a conundrum that used to keep us talking for hours when we were eleven: if a Zulu warrior were to take on a Spartan who would win? or who was tougher?: Typhoon Tracy or Captain Hurricane? or if Alf Tupper were to race the Amazing Wilson who would be first? etc etc etc. Great fun but I guess we'll never know.

As they are all cheats and everyone knows Billy Whizz would win any race any time this conversation is redundant.

Jason


(great memories though!)

[crowhill]

What facts do you have that Haille Gebreselassie uses 'potions' to achieve his performances?

C'mon Christopher Leigh we're still waiting - you've made these claims before on other threads. As an admirer of Ethiopian distance runners, I'm interested in what evidence you have that Gebreselassie and Bekele et al are drug cheats .

[XRunner]

Peter Coe says he ran 45 minutes for 10 miles.He didn't say he ran 9 or 9 1/2 miles in 45 minutes.That is evidence,

Didn't Ken Wood claim that he had run a sub four minute mile before Roger Bannister?

Sheffield runners do have a certain reputation.

[Bant]

but incredible endurance.You cannot run a fast 800m unless you've developed your stamina to the maximum.The greater your endurance the longer you can sustain your pace.

Christopher Leigh, I salute you, you are a genious among idiots, a rich man among paupers. Why did no one else think of it before. Endurance is the key to a world class 800m. From now on I'm going to run 150mpw and that will definately give me the type of endurance needed to break the 800m world record. If only the worlds best had as knowledge a coach as you seem to be, maybe the world record would be sub 1.30 by now. You are right endurance is the key......

NOW JOG ON

[Guick Dotto]

As they are all cheats and everyone knows Billy Whizz would win any race any time this conversation is redundant.

Jason


(great memories though!)

Good old Billy Whizz! Yes he was fast, but no way could he beat Wilson at rock climbing

[CL]

C'mon Christopher Leigh we're still waiting - you've made these claims before on other threads. As an admirer of Ethiopian distance runners, I'm interested in what evidence you have that Gebreselassie and Bekele et al are drug cheats .

Okay I'll give you an honest opinion.

The main limiting factor in endurance running is oxygen uptake, transportation and usage in muscles.

Lets assume we have a natural athlete weighing 7okg with an oxygen uptake of 5.7litres a minute.Thats a V02 of 81.4ml/kg/min.Also assume that his haemoglobin is 15.8grams per 100ml of blood and that the quantity of blood in his body is 5litres.

Every gram of haemoglobin can hold 1.34ml of oxygen.So:

1.34x15.8x50=1058.6ml. Thats the amount of oxygen contained in the blood.

To get an uptake of 5700ml(5.7litres) the heart has to circulate the blood 5.38 times round the body.

Ok now we inject him with EPO.Over the next 4 weeks his haemoglobin rises to 18g per 100ml. so:

1.34x18x50=1206ml. An increase now of 147.4ml of oxygen before we circulate it round the body.

The heart pumps it round the body 5.38 times again.So 5.38x1206=6488ml of oxygen.An increase in oxygen uptake of 788ml per minute.

This equates to a V02 of 92.6ml/kg/min.An increase in uptake of about 16%!

Obviously I've started with a fit athlete, but you can see the problem.EPO wasn't tested for before 2000, and still can't be effectively tested for now.This incredible increase in performance is the reason why world records started to be smashed in the 90s.

I've put quite a bit of effort, into working everything out and explaining this.So serious comments only please.

[CL]

Christopher Leigh, I salute you, you are a genious among idiots, a rich man among paupers. Why did no one else think of it before. Endurance is the key to a world class 800m. From now on I'm going to run 150mpw and that will definately give me the type of endurance needed to break the 800m world record. If only the worlds best had as knowledge a coach as you seem to be, maybe the world record would be sub 1.30 by now. You are right endurance is the key......

NOW JOG ON

I must be a genius, because I can spell genius!

[Pudgy]

Quoted in Lydiard's book "Running To The Top"

Bengt Saltin compared seven elite Swedish runners with students from St Paricks High, Kenya. The students at St Paricks ran a high mileage, as fast as they could, 6 days a week [traditional harriers training?], plus running to school which added 10-30 km slow running.

Saltin found that the Kenyan's had a 3% greater anaerobic capacity, and similar proportion of slow to fast twitch muscle fibres.

But, he also found that the Kenyan's had more mitochrondria per cell and more capillaries draped around each fibre (7-8 against the Swedish 4-5) [ie. a greater capacity to use oxygen and a greater resistance to fatigue]

Saltin also found that the Kenyans had a higher concentration of enzymes which break down fat for energy, and to provide energy aerobically to muscles.

I don't think there is any suggestion that Kenyan high school athletes are routinely on drugs. It seems to me that they are pursuing the same training program that British athletes were following in the 80's, but from an earlier age.

Standards in Britain were far higher 30 years ago, with a number of runners running sub 2-10 marathons, world records being broken, and presumably without drugs. If the Africans are doing the same, but building up from a higher and earlier base, you don't need drugs to explain their success. They're just doing what we did, but better.